PCN drooped kerb Enfield council strikes again |
PCN drooped kerb Enfield council strikes again |
Wed, 5 Dec 2018 - 16:34
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#1
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 6 Joined: 5 Dec 2018 Member No.: 101,302 |
Hello everyone
My MIL has asked for my help as she was issued a PCN today for allegedly blocking a dropped kerb. From the photos she has taken it seems clear that she wasn’t blocking the kerb as she’s parked her wheel behind the sloping kerb but does it matter that her bonnet sticks out slightly? I’m not massively sure and she doesn’t know how to appeal so I thought ask for your help to help me help her! The PCN was definitely issued after the lady who lives in the house complained to the council. She had words with the MIL when she got there but MIL said she politely pointed out she wasn’t blocking the drive at all. Obviously that didn’t work I’ve attached pics of the car taken by MIL and of the PCN. I’ve asked her to tell me exactly where it was but she can’t remember at the moment- she’s a bit flustered by it all honestly. PCN Car and parking Many thanks! |
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Wed, 5 Dec 2018 - 16:34
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Wed, 5 Dec 2018 - 16:58
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 23,582 Joined: 12 Feb 2013 From: London Member No.: 59,924 |
Doesn't look in contravention. get and post the council pics if those aren't them - they are the key.
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Wed, 5 Dec 2018 - 17:34
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
That doesn't look like a contravention to me
The front wheels aren't even on the sloping part of the kerb and no part of the car is over the dropped section Was this a private driveway ? If so, a possible explanation is that the householder complained Instead of telling him where to go the CEO issues the penalty notice to shut him up, putting your MIUL to a lot of work and potential expense This looks like a case where a comment that the CEO needs some training wouldn't go amiss |
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Wed, 5 Dec 2018 - 17:51
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#4
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 6 Joined: 5 Dec 2018 Member No.: 101,302 |
Here are the council images
Any advice as to how to word it? That doesn't look like a contravention to me The front wheels aren't even on the sloping part of the kerb and no part of the car is over the dropped section Was this a private driveway ? If so, a possible explanation is that the householder complained Instead of telling him where to go the CEO issues the penalty notice to shut him up, putting your MIUL to a lot of work and potential expense This looks like a case where a comment that the CEO needs some training wouldn't go amiss Yes a private driveway with quite an irate owner by the sounds of it! |
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Wed, 5 Dec 2018 - 18:59
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 26,656 Joined: 6 Nov 2014 Member No.: 74,048 |
Perhaps ever so slightly over the lowered part but IMO not enough to be in contravention even if that is the case,
See this adjudication 2160311942 This appeal was set down for a personal hearing at 10:00 am on 17 August 2016. Neither party attended. The Authority says that the contravention occurred because the vehicle parked past the point where the kerb starts to slope. This is an incorrect understanding of the law. Section 86 (1) of the Traffic Management Act 2004 provides that (In a special enforcement area) a vehicle must not be parked on the carriageway adjacent to a footway, cycle track or verge where the footway, cycle track or verge has been lowered to meet the level of the carriageway for one of the purposes stated in the section. This means that the dropped kerb is the part of the kerb which meets the level of the carriageway and does not include the sloping kerbs on either side. In misdirecting itself on the key and fundamental point of law when considering the Appellant's representations, there is a procedural impropriety on the part of the Authority. I should say that by applying the correct test, I am satisfied that the Appellant's vehicle was just over the proper dropped kerb but it was so marginal that I find it to be de minimus. I allow the appeal. -------------------- All advice is given freely. It is given without guarantee and responsibility for its use rests with the user
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Wed, 5 Dec 2018 - 19:52
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#6
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 6 Joined: 5 Dec 2018 Member No.: 101,302 |
Ooh thank you
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Wed, 5 Dec 2018 - 20:40
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 23,582 Joined: 12 Feb 2013 From: London Member No.: 59,924 |
You can see why the homeowner gets irate - the DK doesn't extend across the whole of their ramp. But that's between them and the council not you, and you should simply challenge:
I wish to challenge PCN no xxxxxx on the basis that there was no contravention. As your pictures confirm, my vehicle was only adjacent to the sloping part of the kerb. I understand that the code 27 contravention only involves the fully dropped part of a footway. I look forward to your early cancellation of this PCN. If they reject you can add cases at formal appeal. |
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Thu, 6 Dec 2018 - 05:49
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#8
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 6 Joined: 5 Dec 2018 Member No.: 101,302 |
You can see why the homeowner gets irate - the DK doesn't extend across the whole of their ramp. But that's between them and the council not you, and you should simply challenge: I wish to challenge PCN no xxxxxx on the basis that there was no contravention. As your pictures confirm, my vehicle was only adjacent to the sloping part of the kerb. I understand that the code 27 contravention only involves the fully dropped part of a footway. I look forward to your early cancellation of this PCN. If they reject you can add cases at formal appeal. Thank you so much this is so helpful. |
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Thu, 6 Dec 2018 - 10:28
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#9
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
That homeowner is just asking for well-informed drivers to park in exactly that position until the council gets fed up with having all the PCNs cancelled and tells him the cars aren't in contravention
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Mon, 10 Dec 2018 - 19:18
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#10
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 6 Joined: 5 Dec 2018 Member No.: 101,302 |
We’ll it’s been rejected because her bonnet is over the drooped kerb.
Any advice? |
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Mon, 10 Dec 2018 - 19:41
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 26,656 Joined: 6 Nov 2014 Member No.: 74,048 |
We’ll it’s been rejected because her bonnet is over the drooped kerb. Any advice? Post your challenge and the rejection This post has been edited by PASTMYBEST: Mon, 10 Dec 2018 - 19:43 -------------------- All advice is given freely. It is given without guarantee and responsibility for its use rests with the user
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Wed, 12 Dec 2018 - 11:15
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#12
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 6 Joined: 5 Dec 2018 Member No.: 101,302 |
She’s decided to pay it. I told her otherwise but she said it’s too much bother.
On another note why on earth can’t I spell dropped?! I’ve just noticed the drooping of kerbs 🙈 |
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Wed, 12 Dec 2018 - 11:35
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#13
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
The bonnet is over the sloping kerb
It's not over the dropped part at all What your MIL doesn't realise is that councils and particularly Enfield automatically reject informal appeals almost without reading them They know that most motorists will cave in at this point and pay the discounted charge This post has been edited by Redivi: Wed, 12 Dec 2018 - 11:36 |
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Wed, 12 Dec 2018 - 11:55
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#14
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Member Group: Members Posts: 23,582 Joined: 12 Feb 2013 From: London Member No.: 59,924 |
That's a shame - this was winnable.
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Wed, 12 Dec 2018 - 19:24
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#15
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Member Group: Members Posts: 38,007 Joined: 3 Dec 2010 Member No.: 42,618 |
She’s decided to pay it. I told her otherwise but she said it’s too much bother. On another note why on earth can’t I spell dropped?! I’ve just noticed the drooping of kerbs 🙈 I might send her an invoice of my own, wouldn't mind some extra money for Christmas and clearly she'll just pay it as fighting it would be too much bother 😀 -------------------- If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
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Sat, 15 Dec 2018 - 15:49
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#16
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 15 Dec 2018 Member No.: 101,448 |
Check PastMyBest, Post #4, 11 Dec 18 of 'PCN Incorrectly Issued?, Parked in a special enforcement area adjacent to a dropped footway' thread !!!
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