CPS (Midlands) Limited - What is the current advice for dealing with this company?, Threads merged Options

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

Evening all,

A friend of a very good friend received a Parking Charge Notice from these monkeys this week.

I've checked BPA AOS and they were once members according to some old posts but now appear to be members of the IPC.

I'm quite confused by all the posts so it's easier to ask I'm afraid.

What is the current advice for dealing with CPS (Midlands) Limited please?

There was a broken sign next to the guy's vehicle and I've asked him to get a photo of it as the photo he did take was not very clear.

There are 3 warning signs on site according to the speculative invoice.
It appears he was parked right next to the broken sign as I asked him to show me on Google Street View.

Can redact and upload speculative invoice if needs be.

I'll keep scouring the forum in the meantime to see if I can find any up-to-date CPS posts.
Thanks in advance.

EDIT:
NOTE FOR FORUM ADMIN!
Forum Search is giving lots of errors. PC clock is set fine but this post says it was posted at 22:03 when it was actually posted at 21:03. This is leading FireFox to think PPP is an insecure website.

This post has been edited by Rhothgar_Den_Viking: Sun, 15 Dec 2019 - 21:56

[Advertisement]

[Dave65]

Post up the redacted copy of the PPN.
Remove personal information but leave dates.

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

Struggling to upload.

I have space but it just won't attach.

Imageshack is no longer free. Tinypic has gone too.

What are people using now for the occasional upload?

Spoke too soon.

ImageBB seems to be the place to go these days.

Here are the ImageBB links to the PCN front and rear:-

https://ibb.co/18HGSNw
https://ibb.co/vLvkwgK

This post has been edited by Rhothgar_Den_Viking: Mon, 16 Dec 2019 - 19:43

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

Went by the site today to take a photo of the signage for my mate.

Got into conversation with the landowner which was interesting. He told me that there is no contract with CPS. Whether he signed something and forgot about it, I've no idea. Quite an amenable chap to be honest.

He just asked me what I was doing when I walked onto his land and took a photo of the signage so I said I was defending a friend.

He's get no cut from any charges apparently. He just wants his land to be free of people parking without any regard. He was telling me stories of people parking across his access drive at weekends and that they sometimes need to access the roller shutters which is fair does to be honest.

My mate says he was parked within one of the bays (without actually being parked within one of the bays fully). Only single width bays with no bays either side so guessing that wouldn't be a problem.

[nosferatu1001]

Identifying the driver is a bad idea

IF there is no contract, then of course that is a point of challenge. Without a contract, no chance of them complying with the code of practice, and cannot offer contracts.

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

Identifying the driver is a bad idea

IF there is no contract, then of course that is a point of challenge. Without a contract, no chance of them complying with the code of practice, and cannot offer contracts.

Hi nosferatu1001,
Driver has not been identified. Definite no-no.

Code of Practice? IPC one?

Presumably this would fall down at the first hurdle on POFA Sch.4 Para 5(1)a insofar as no contract exists between the landowner and CPS according to the landowner himself?

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

Could do with some more advice on this one.

Only have until Saturday if I am to appeal to CPS. They are IAS as far as I can tell. They used to be BPA.

Not wishing to rely really on what the land owner told me verbally in that there is no contract with CPS and them.

As CPS seem to be non-litigant in their stance, should I just advise the RK to ignore appeal and then ignore NTK if and when it arrives please?

[ostell]

So if it's just a windscreen ticket then get in an appeal from the keeper so that it arrives just before day 28. They may then forget to issue a NTK or not contact the DVLA. Either is a POFA fail and no keeper liability

This post has been edited by ostell: Thu, 26 Dec 2019 - 17:35

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

So if it's just a windscreen ticket then get in an appeal from the keeper so that it arrives just before day 28. They may then forget to issue a NTK or not contact the DVLA. Either is a POFA fail and no keeper liability

Thanks Ostell.

It's getting so confusing these days

I read southpaw's Sticky. Ignore or not and people in there are going on about GDPR having changed things or not as the case may be. There seems to be a lot of misinformation around.

There seem to be a few threads about CPS (Midlands) and that they generally don't seem to bother with chasing people. Again, without having experienced though even though they are a local 'firm' it's hard to know what to do.

That gives me a little bit of breathing space. It's just Saturday is the 14 day reduced payment offer.

Windscreen ticket issued on 14th December so Day 28 will be 11th January? So post 1st Class on 9th January?

This post has been edited by Rhothgar_Den_Viking: Thu, 26 Dec 2019 - 18:35

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

I've posted recently about a mate getting a ticket from CPS (Midlands) Limited.

In my post, I make reference to IPC. CPS are on the list maintained by IPC but I was of the opinion because of a case I had myself a few years ago that the IPC or perhaps the IAS were looked down on as being cowboys.

Both IPC and IAS are based at SK10 9NR?

The IAS as I now understand is a truly an independent appeals service.
Maybe my confusion comes from being advised not to bother appealing to the IPC. However, I truly cannot remember.

Can someone enlighten me what the current views is of both companies and whether either should be trusted please?

Is the IAS where you get POPLA code's from for BPA AOS or is that somewhere entirely different again?

Merry Xmas to all the main peeps on here. You do a sterling job in helping others.

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

So if it's just a windscreen ticket then get in an appeal from the keeper so that it arrives just before day 28. They may then forget to issue a NTK or not contact the DVLA. Either is a POFA fail and no keeper liability

I've just looked at the photo of the back of the ticket again and they state appeals challenges must be received within 21 days? Are they trying to confuse this with the IAS' appeal procedure I wonder? The IAS do have a flow chart though and, in there, it asks if you have "Have you made an appeal to the operator in accordance with their internal procedures?". If you say no, it says you have cannot use the IAS Appeals Service.

Am I joining the dots here? The whole idea of not appealing in accordance with the operator's internal procedures then forces the operator into a situation where they need to take it to court? Or is there no rhyme or reason to it.

I've just written a separate thread about IPC and the IAS as my memory is a more than little vague regarding the processes involved.

[ostell]

The IAS is the "independent" appeal service operated by the IPC. It is operated by the same solicitors that run the IPC, though they went through an exercise some time ago that makes the connection difficult to find now. The IAS guarantee 85% rejection rate. The IAS gave some good decisions until they got themselves officially recognised then reverted to rejecting most appeals.

POPLA is a true independant appeal service for BPA members, who give the POPLA number when they reject an appeal

You appeal to IPC members but when they reject then you forget about appealing to the IAS and wait for the court papers.

[ostell]

As you haven't contacted CPS previously then send an appeal to them. It's only their own rules that say you can only appeal within 21 days.

[The Rookie]

Your initial confusion was actually right, your current correction is the wrong bit.

The IAS cannot be considered independent.

There is some so fusion as the BPA refers to POPLA as it’s IAS in many documents, presumably to avoid the need to change them if they close the POPLA brand.

And one case, one thread. I’ve asked a Mod’ to merge for you.

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Fri, 27 Dec 2019 - 05:26

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

Thanks ostell and The Rookie (I've always considered that to be a bad username for you - far from it! More appropriate for me)

Just realised another week has passed since I logged on.

Here is a link to the sign on the site that actually is readable (doesn't that sign give the impression that they are Crown PS - MAY BE PROSECUTED BY CPS (MIDLANDS) LTD at the bottom? Surely only the real CPS can prosecute):-


Not sure if you looked at the PCN links but it states there are 3 signs on the site. There are 1.5 signs.

My mate was parked but the half sign...

This one:-


I need to write an appeal to post Thursday really. I'll be doing this as RK as suggested in an earlier post. I'd rather ignore them which seems to be another option. Almost let sleeping dogs lie according to some older posts from SchoolRunMum and a few others but those posts are 4 years old.

Managed to get thumbnails to load.

I'll change code on initial post so people can see the PCN too.

EDIT

Couldn't change post so here are the ticket details again:-






This post has been edited by Rhothgar_Den_Viking: Tue, 31 Dec 2019 - 17:59

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

The IAS is the "independent" appeal service operated by the IPC. It is operated by the same solicitors that run the IPC, though they went through an exercise some time ago that makes the connection difficult to find now. The IAS guarantee 85% rejection rate. The IAS gave some good decisions until they got themselves officially recognised then reverted to rejecting most appeals.

POPLA is a true independant appeal service for BPA members, who give the POPLA number when they reject an appeal

You appeal to IPC members but when they reject then you forget about appealing to the IAS and wait for the court papers.

As you haven't contacted CPS previously then send an appeal to them. It's only their own rules that say you can only appeal within 21 days.

@ostell If I am understanding you correctly, you are saying appeal to CPS and then forget about appealing to IAS as it's a kangaroo appeal service and total waste of time?

Should I send the appeal within the 21 days or ignore that too and appeal next week? As the IAS won't look at it, apparently, if I don't appeal in accordance with CPS rules, then I suppose that will default to CPS having to take court action if they so wish.

I'll pen a response now anyway and post it up.

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

Is this too jovial and cocky? I take my lead from SRM that wrote a similarly scathing response to CPS for someone and urged them to send it.

I'm guessing if he did call bluff then a judge would probably frown upon it.

It's all I've got the energy to write today.

Also, the address is as per their ticket but their website still say they are at Shippo's Brewery in Nottingham on Northgate.



This post has been edited by Rhothgar_Den_Viking: Wed, 1 Jan 2020 - 20:54

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

In the end, I ended up not sending an appeal as it was advised a waste of time.

Surprisingly, they have now got a company called TNC involved with the debt collection and my mate received a letter just over two weeks ago. He's already hesitant.

I must admit I got a little confused with the earlier advice and having no response to my cheeky letter a la School Run Mum style I decided I'd better not send anything.

This is their letter:-



I'd never heard of TNC before but they seem to go way back according to some of the dates of the posts.

So is this now a case of simply writing to them and saying you have handed the NtK to the driver and advised them to contact them or keep ignoring and see if that resolves the issue?

NtK arrived within 56 days of ticket on screen.

Thanks in advance

This post has been edited by Rhothgar_Den_Viking: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 - 14:28

[ostell]

So you didn't send in that appeal as suggested to arrive on day 26?

So now you appeal the NTK.


Dear Sirs,

I have just received your Notice to Keeper xxxxx for vehicle VRM xxxx

You have failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to give the invitation to keeper in the format prescribed by section 8 (2) (e) of the Act. You cannot, therefore, transfer liability for the alleged charge from the driver at the time to me, the keeper.

There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.

I do not expect to hear from you again, or your debt collectors, except to confirm that no further action will be taken on this matter and my personal details have been removed from your records.

Yours etc


First class mail with free certificate of posting from a post office

There are other POFA fails

[Rhothgar_Den_Vik...]

Thanks ostell.
No I didn't. As I say, I got confused. I find it hard to differentiate between posts when PoFA applies and when it didn't. I inevitably re-read the Stickies and it just adds to my confusion.

As a matter of interest, what is the thinking behind this Day 26 idea?

Should I send your response immediately or wait until nearer Day 28 after NtK ie another 10 days or so.

This post has been edited by Rhothgar_Den_Viking: Sun, 16 Feb 2020 - 21:20