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Here's an odd one
Josho
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 00:27
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Okay so a friend of mine goes on holiday. Says drop me off then borrow the car do what you want with it but please change my brake pads while I am away.

Okay says I.

I run a Ltd company as a garage.

just been flashed at a high rate of speed. I'm guessing around 110. Absolutely no reason for it. On the M20 with a HADECS I think.

Hopefully I hear nothing but I'd guess the police will be interested in 100 MPH.

Anyway. Say my friend DOES get a ticket can he nominate my Ltd company garage as the driver?

Or will he have to nominate me?

This post has been edited by Josho: Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 05:23
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post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 00:27
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ford poplar
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 03:24
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If he has any sense he will nominate you or the Co.
Either way, why would you prefer a FTF??
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The Rookie
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 04:45
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The friend can nominate you personally or the limited company, either is fine.

The forum rules are very strict on not encouraging people to commit criminal offences, so the implications of any actions can be discussed but no-one on here can join you in any conspiracy.

As you have probably figured a failure to furnish is very likely to be 6 points (although a ban for the one offence is a sentancing option it is all but never used) while any speed over circa 103 nowadays is more likely to result in a short ban than points. That said the MS90 has a greater impact on insurance premiums.


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Josho
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 05:14
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Okay.

So hypothetically if he nominated my Ltd company and then any subsequent NIPs were ignored what would happen?
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peterguk
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 07:37
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QUOTE (Josho @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 06:14) *
So hypothetically


Does this relate to a live case?


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nosferatu1001
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 07:39
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The Ltd company could not get points, but would get a hefty fine. I believe it is possible they may decide to go after directors anyway, but others can correct me or be more precise.
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Jlc
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 08:42
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QUOTE
(5) Where a body corporate is guilty of an offence under this section and the offence is proved to have been committed with the consent or connivance of, or to be attributable to neglect on the part of, a director, manager, secretary or other similar officer of the body corporate, or a person who was purporting to act in any such capacity, he, as well as the body corporate, is guilty of that offence and liable to be proceeded against and punished accordingly.


My emphasis.


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RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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Josho
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 09:00
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QUOTE (peterguk @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 07:37) *
QUOTE (Josho @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 06:14) *
So hypothetically


Does this relate to a live case?



I suppose no, it's not.
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BertB
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 12:01
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The OP seems to list quite a specific set of events, for something that is just hypothetical... ninja.gif
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NewJudge
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 12:43
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QUOTE (BertB @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 13:01) *
The OP seems to list quite a specific set of events, for something that is just hypothetical... ninja.gif


Indeed. Especially the speed, the location and the presumed camera type. No need to do all that to test a hypothesis.

QUOTE (Josho @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 06:14) *
Okay.

So hypothetically if he nominated my Ltd company and then any subsequent NIPs were ignored what would happen?


Hypothetically your company would receive a S172 request asking you to provide the details of the driver at the time of the alleged offence. If the request was ignored your company would almost certainly face a charge of failing to provide driver's details and a conviction would be almost inevitable. I don't know what effect such a conviction might have on your trade insurance (if you have any). For individual drivers an MS90 endorsement is not treated lightly.

Out of interest does your company have many employees who might have access to your customers' vehicles? If enquiries are made Section 172(5) - which jlc mentions - may come into play.

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thisisntme
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 14:37
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Basically if you are a sole trader naming the company may not save you.


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Fredd
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 14:43
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QUOTE (thisisntme @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 15:37) *
Basically if you are a sole trader naming the company may not save you.


QUOTE (Josho @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 01:27) *
I run a Ltd company as a garage.


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cp8759
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 14:51
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QUOTE (Josho @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 01:27) *
Anyway. Say my friend DOES get a ticket can he nominate my Ltd company garage as the driver?

Or will he have to nominate me?


It doesn't matter, I would expect the prosecution to come after you personally under the provision highlighted by jlc if the company were to FTF. Or else we could just register our cars to limited companies, drive around at 100mph and wind them up when the fines turn up in the post.
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Fredd
post Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 15:02
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 15:51) *
QUOTE (Josho @ Wed, 27 Sep 2017 - 01:27) *
Anyway. Say my friend DOES get a ticket can he nominate my Ltd company garage as the driver?

Or will he have to nominate me?


It doesn't matter, I would expect the prosecution to come after you personally under the provision highlighted by jlc if the company were to FTF. Or else we could just register our cars to limited companies, drive around at 100mph and wind them up when the fines turn up in the post.

I would expect no such thing, based on the number of times that hasn't been reported as happening here (or elsewhere). If companies not nominating became a common thing then no doubt prosecutions would ensue to make a point and stop the practice, but while it's certainly a possibility it seems to be rare in practice.


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