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Contravention Code 01 Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours - Newham
EVdriver
post Fri, 11 Oct 2019 - 23:39
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Hi all, I'm still quite new to this site so if any mistakes please accept my apologies.

I have been very unfortunate recently, My vehicle was issued with a Penalty Charge Notice, Contravention Code 01 - Parked in a restricted street during prescribed hours.

On the day before the contravention I bought a bath panel for my sister which she needed for the next day, so I took the panel to her place in morning of 29th September where the contravention allegedly took place. On 29th September (Sunday) when I arrived with the panel in front of my sister’s house I briefly stopped on the single yellow to unload the panel and I take it inside her house and return home, the whole process of my unloading only took approximately 5/6 mins in my humble estimation.
However, where I stopped for unloading I have not seen any signage whatsoever about any restricted parking along the entire side of the road at all (please find the attached photos), besides I was not even parked there for more than 5/6 mins but only to unload, when I returned to my car I found a pcn ticket on my windscreen.

i will appreciate your help in this matter.

thanks.

This post has been edited by EVdriver: Fri, 11 Oct 2019 - 23:43
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post Fri, 11 Oct 2019 - 23:39
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Neil B
post Wed, 4 Dec 2019 - 15:22
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QUOTE (EVdriver @ Wed, 4 Dec 2019 - 14:15) *
I would very much like to re-send my rep again/appeal this decision should this be feasible without losing the current discount price £65

You can't.
Well, you can challenge again but Newham are likely to ignore.
You can't dictate preservation of the discount, although councils sometimes re-offer it again.

You are not at tribunal stage yet.
You will receive a Notice to Owner, as the rejection describes.
You can then make formal representations against that.

I would fight this all the way.

The issue is simple; you were exempt by virtue of unloading.

You have submitted a receipt for purchase of the item, the day before, which indicates the
unwieldy nature of the item being delivered.

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Nothing to do with RTA 91 or absence of any signs.


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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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Neil B
post Fri, 6 Dec 2019 - 17:02
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EV.

What are you thinking on this?


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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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cp8759
post Sat, 7 Dec 2019 - 20:15
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QUOTE (EVdriver @ Wed, 4 Dec 2019 - 14:15) *
Ah, I am not really sure if I am able to attend the tribunal in person with or without a bath panel and it won’t be easy to send my sis either...

Well let's try and be practical here, can your sister email you a picture of the bath panel? And supply a witness statement? That could be enough to make it an open and shut case.


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Neil B
post Sun, 8 Dec 2019 - 09:17
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Sat, 7 Dec 2019 - 20:15) *
QUOTE (EVdriver @ Wed, 4 Dec 2019 - 14:15) *
Ah, I am not really sure if I am able to attend the tribunal in person with or without a bath panel and it won’t be easy to send my sis either...

Well let's try and be practical here, can your sister email you a picture of the bath panel? And supply a witness statement? That could be enough to make it an open and shut case.

+1.
It would add weight but I'd be confident even as it is.

I hope EV isn't put off by my criticism of his challenge or others' recent advice in his Camden case.
Neither affects how strong this case appears to be.


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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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hcandersen
post Sun, 8 Dec 2019 - 11:18
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Can we recap.

The OP submitted their informal reps which were rejected. A transcript has been posted.

Talk of tribunals is premature.

The OP's argument is not clear-cut IMO. It is too easy to say unloading, but the legal position is that they must unload and then move their vehicle to a legal location as soon as practicable. There is no evidence that this happened, in fact the opposite could be argued unless the OP adds meat.

Bath panel, take from car, deposit inside front door, return to car immediately, walk back to house and then move bath panel to where it is needed. Time away from car..3-4 minutes?

At present the OP has to deal with the fact that they parked 'outside' their sister's, therefore little time lost walking to the house, and did not see the CEO during the whole period of observation, creation and production of the PCN. We do not know the obs period, could be 5 minutes for all we know.

OP, more detail pl.
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Neil B
post Sun, 8 Dec 2019 - 11:48
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The council have not actually disputed loading; rather, just got themselves confused.

Carrying such an item inside is much harder than from the car. It could easily take up to ten minutes
to get it to a safe position so kids or pets don't fall over it.

Many, if not most, Newham CEOs are scooter borne so not seeing them is not unusual.


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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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cp8759
post Sun, 8 Dec 2019 - 15:32
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QUOTE (hcandersen @ Sun, 8 Dec 2019 - 11:18) *
Talk of tribunals is premature.

Absolutely, there's a fair chance that with a photo of the bath panel and a witness statement, the council will agree to cancel the penalty.


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EVdriver
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 01:26
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Guys with your full support I would really like to fight this all the way, i understand that my argument may not be clear-cut i.e. the unwieldy nature of the item being delivered...
FYI, after unloading from the car there was a little delay someone answering the door as they could not hear me on door from inside due to building works but when the door was answered i helped my sister taking the item upstairs as it was too bulky for her, then I returned to my car to go home and I saw the CEO talking off…

My sister should be able to email me a picture, I also have the picture of it too but for the e witness statement, how should she be wording it please...?

https://ibb.co/W514w9N

https://ibb.co/cKqWTvr

https://ibb.co/30Wzz2L

This post has been edited by EVdriver: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 01:27
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hcandersen
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 07:14
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A delay.

What a good guess!

So, deal with it. If, for example, your sister has a shared front door then if you can truthfully say that the bath panel - see photos - could not be left in a common area but had to be moved to the bathroom, something which she was unable to do on her own, then let's see these details in a draft.

'I was unloading' is well short of the legal test in terms of evidence, but it doesn't seem as if the details would get in the way.

OP, pl remember that unloading is an exemption, it is not an excuse.

This post has been edited by hcandersen: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 07:15
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EVdriver
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 14:41
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Thanks hcandersen - To be frank, the front door wasn't shared but they could not hear me, perhaps she was in the back garden/toilet in the upper level...

Admittedly, I took some time whilst carefully unloading such a large panel from a small car by myself without causing any damaged to the car or the panel, wasn’t really straight forward plus the delay on the door…

Could anyone else point out any other point please….??

This post has been edited by EVdriver: Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 14:49
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Neil B
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 17:04
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QUOTE (EVdriver @ Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 01:26) *
my argument may not be clear-cut i.e. the unwieldy nature of the item

I think you misunderstood me. By 'unweildy' I meant difficult to carry so in your favour.
They are, as you say, easy to damage.


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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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EVdriver
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 18:00
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Thanks for the clarity NB, so what should do i do next...? i.e. do I submit a further rep at this point in time intending to clarify my preliminary rep as they’ve misunderstood my case as a result of my poor submission…or wait just for the NTO?
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cp8759
post Tue, 10 Dec 2019 - 23:40
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Personally I think sending a second informal rep is a waste of time. We've tried it many times and (except where the council has asked for supporting evidence) I can't recall a single instance of it working.


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EVdriver
post Wed, 11 Dec 2019 - 09:34
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I had to pass the pcn to my sister 2 days ago to deal with as I could not spare any time in this ☹

You’ll agree that this wasn’t really my fault as I was only trying to be helpful, the fact that she did not inform me about the event day and also answering the door late this didn’t help the situation…

This post has been edited by EVdriver: Wed, 11 Dec 2019 - 09:38
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Incandescent
post Wed, 11 Dec 2019 - 13:33
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QUOTE
I had to pass the pcn to my sister 2 days ago to deal with as I could not spare any time in this

OK, fair enough, but it is the owner of the vehicle who is responsible for appealing or paying. Are you the owner ?
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cp8759
post Sun, 15 Dec 2019 - 01:14
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QUOTE (EVdriver @ Wed, 11 Dec 2019 - 09:34) *
I had to pass the pcn to my sister 2 days ago to deal with as I could not spare any time in this ☹

If you're the owner you don't need to do anything other than wait for the Notice to Owner.


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