London bus lane approval - Lambeth council |
London bus lane approval - Lambeth council |
Fri, 6 May 2022 - 09:20
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 38,006 Joined: 3 Dec 2010 Member No.: 42,618 |
For context, the link mentioned in the decision is https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/...pproved-devices
Nahid Hossen v London Borough of Lambeth (2210860888, 05 May 2022) In this appeal I have examined the CCTV clip sent to this Tribunal by the Council despite its admissibility as evidence being a central point of contention between the parties in the appeal. I consider it nonetheless appropriate that I record here that this clip shows the appellant’s solo motorcycle being ridden at a moderately slow speed and in steady manner within a bus lane along road which at the time carried only light motor traffic. It shows the rider intruding into the bus lane for what may be some 75 m. The motorbike is not shown undertaking any slower line of traffic but the rider is undoubtedly riding parallel and to the left of the bold white line serving to demarcate the bus lane which the appellant representative indicated to me he accepts was in force at the time. Although the intrusion into the bus lane was relatively minor I have not I believe been asked on behalf of the appellant to treat it as trivial to the extent that the Tribunal regard it as de minimis. Instead I have been asked to rule on admissibility of CCTV evidence and the type of equipment used for recording. London bus lane enforcement is surrounded by legally elaborate and somewhat opaque provisions in relation to camera equipment. These in effect dictate that a valid bus lane penalty charge notice originate from a “prescribed device” and this term requires reference to the Road Traffic Offenders (Additional Offences and Prescribed Devices) Order 1997. Mr cp8759 as representative for the appellant has submitted that not only does admissibility of CCTV evidence depend upon the equipment being a “prescribed device” but also on it being a type that has been ministerially approved and any conditions subject to which the approval having been given being satisfied. These stipulations arise from paragraph 7(2) of Schedule 1 to the London Local Authorities Act 1996. Given the technical nature of points about approval and camera status raised by Mr cp8759 and the Council’s Miss Whaley being during the telephone hearing on 15 February 2022 I thought unfamiliar with the detail of equipment used and any formalities for approval and maintenance, I adjourned with a view to giving the Council the opportunity to clarify issues with staff on its engineering side in conjunction as I thought might be appropriate, with any manufacturer or supplier of the equipment used. Following such adjournment a response from the Council included a declaration of compliance document in connection with Siemens camera LW 2035 dated 22 March 2022. Mr cp8759 has following its receipt urged me to regard this as inconsequential in relation to a contravention alleged as occurring on 26 August 2021 but I have decided that I need not deal with argument on that chronological aspect in relation to that in this appeal. That Council response referred me to a link regarding recording devices. The web page given referred to documents being lists of approved devices. The data there is presented in a manner which is not easy for this Tribunal to interpret, but I believe Mr cp8759 has correctly pointed out that the listings do not in terms refer to the London Local Authorities Act 1996 but exclusively appear to relate in terms of statutes to the Transport Act 2000 and the Traffic Management Act 2004. It is apparent from the submissions received from Mr cp8759 that he consequently believes certifications from Parking CCTV Manager and the Project Delivery Manager as signed and dated 22 March 2022 fail to establish that the CCTV evidence in this appeal should be treated as admissible. I have noted the Council’s unwillingness to arrange for the attendance of these persons to give evidence and explanation to the Tribunal despite Mr cp8759’s wish for the opportunity to question them regarding certification and equipment status. I have decided principally in view of this to now complete this particular adjudication. I have recorded this appeal as allowed. Without further clarification from equipment supplier or Council officers about the status of the camera equipment used and its approval I have decided I cannot properly treat the crucial clip as admissible. Gerald Styles 2210860888 5 May 2022 -------------------- If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
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Fri, 6 May 2022 - 09:20
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Fri, 6 May 2022 - 11:41
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 2,411 Joined: 14 Apr 2022 Member No.: 116,298 |
-------------------- People, we come and go Memories, they ebb and flow. When we fill our lives with emptiness This does not create true happiness. As this is the Dance of Life.
People, we can be kind True love is hard to find. When we fill our lives with emptiness This does not create true happiness. As this is the Dance of Life. Animals, we kill to eat For many, it’s just a treat. When we fill our lives with arrogance We create a huge imbalance. As this is the Dance of Life. Our Earth is our Heavenly home God-given to freely roam. When we fill our lives with arrogance We create a huge imbalance As this is the Dance of Life. One day, we will all be judged This simple truth cannot be fudged. When we carry on so blindly We do not act all so kindly. As this is the Dance of Life. As Above, and so Below A simple truth to help us grow. When we put aside our egotism We will really find altruism. As this is the Dance of Life. The Divine lives in all things Manifested in music’s rings. The planets are a testament To the everlasting firmament. As this is the Dance of Life. It's all in the wrist. |
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Tue, 10 May 2022 - 22:47
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 6,963 Joined: 19 Dec 2006 From: Near Calais Member No.: 9,683 |
A good result there because of the council's laziness?
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Tue, 10 May 2022 - 23:59
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 38,006 Joined: 3 Dec 2010 Member No.: 42,618 |
A good result there because of the council's laziness? No, having dealt with a number of these cases I believe the council officers concerned simply cannot grasp the issues. They really should get their legal departments to help, because at the moment these PCNs are like lambs to the slaughter. -------------------- If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
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Mon, 16 May 2022 - 09:11
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 56,198 Joined: 9 Sep 2003 From: Warwickshire Member No.: 317 |
A good result there because of the council's laziness? No, having dealt with a number of these cases I believe the council officers concerned simply cannot grasp the issues. They really should get their legal departments to help, because at the moment these PCNs are like lambs to the slaughter. Indeed, I think their mindset is 'but it's approved innit'. That or fixing the issue currently would cost more than they would save, once they get hit with a lot of similar appeals they may rethink it! -------------------- There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!
S172's Rookies 1-0 Kent Council PCN's Rookies 1-0 Warwick Rookies 1-0 Birmingham PPC PCN's Rookies 10-0 PPC's |
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Mon, 16 May 2022 - 14:41
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 38,006 Joined: 3 Dec 2010 Member No.: 42,618 |
Indeed, I think their mindset is 'but it's approved innit'. This. They've requested a review with this compelling argument: All information relating to the approved device and certification was provided by Lambeth Council to confirm the camera used to record the contravention was approved and a known device. Obviously this is wholly unreasonable and an application for costs has been put in. -------------------- If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
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Mon, 16 May 2022 - 15:13
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 2,411 Joined: 14 Apr 2022 Member No.: 116,298 |
Please keep us posted, as I am sure you will!
-------------------- People, we come and go Memories, they ebb and flow. When we fill our lives with emptiness This does not create true happiness. As this is the Dance of Life.
People, we can be kind True love is hard to find. When we fill our lives with emptiness This does not create true happiness. As this is the Dance of Life. Animals, we kill to eat For many, it’s just a treat. When we fill our lives with arrogance We create a huge imbalance. As this is the Dance of Life. Our Earth is our Heavenly home God-given to freely roam. When we fill our lives with arrogance We create a huge imbalance As this is the Dance of Life. One day, we will all be judged This simple truth cannot be fudged. When we carry on so blindly We do not act all so kindly. As this is the Dance of Life. As Above, and so Below A simple truth to help us grow. When we put aside our egotism We will really find altruism. As this is the Dance of Life. The Divine lives in all things Manifested in music’s rings. The planets are a testament To the everlasting firmament. As this is the Dance of Life. It's all in the wrist. |
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Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: Thursday, 28th March 2024 - 21:58 |