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[NIP Wizard] Alledged speed of 82 on motorway recorded with manned equipment
Dev
post Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 16:39
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NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? -
Date of the offence: - September 2019
Date of the NIP: - 9 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 10 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - M40 Beaconsfield
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - First
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? -
How many current points do you have? - 3
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - I was in the fast lane heading Westbound towards Jn 3 of the M40 having overtaken another vehicle and whilst coming around a sweeping bend I spotted a police camera van parked up on a bridge over the motorway about 500 yards ahead facing westbound oncoming traffic, with the back side doors partly open. I started to brake as I was doing over the limit at the moment I first spotted the van so would have been decelerating at the moment I came into line front on with them. I don’t know at what distance they usually clock oncoming vehicles at but the recorded speed on NIP was 82mph.
No images or other supporting evidence provided.


NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - Yes
Did the first NIP arrive within 14 days? - Yes
Although you are the Registered Keeper, were you also the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v3.3.2: Wed, 16 Oct 2019 16:39:11 +0000
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post Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 16:39
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Jlc
post Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 16:44
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Any question? They can ping you up to 1km...


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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The Rookie
post Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 16:55
Post #3


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Joined: 9 Sep 2003
From: Warwickshire
Member No.: 317



Upto 1km for the most common devices. Braking once you see a van usually achieves nothing.

No evidence needs to be sent at this stage, nor in fact at any stage unless the case gets to court.

That speed is likely to qualify for an awareness course.


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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NewJudge
post Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 17:01
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Provided you have not done one for an offence committed in the three years prior to this one you should be offered a Speed Awareness course for that speed. The alternative is a fixed penalty (£100 and three points). Do not forget to name yourself as the driver within the 28 days allowed.
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Dev
post Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 18:30
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QUOTE (NewJudge @ Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 18:01) *
Provided you have not done one for an offence committed in the three years prior to this one you should be offered a Speed Awareness course for that speed. The alternative is a fixed penalty (£100 and three points). Do not forget to name yourself as the driver within the 28 days allowed.


I last did a SAC in 2015 so I’ll take another one if it’s offered in this case. I was just surprised not to be offered a means to view photographic evidence or details of the hand held equipment calibration as the last time I got busted by a fixed camera after returning the NIP with my details I was sent the COFP along with a website and a PIN code to enter on the site to gain access to view the photos of my vehicle along with time tag and speed etc. This was in Surrey a couple of years ago so maybe Thames Valley don’t offer the same service.

So I guess in this case I would have to contest it and go to court before Thames valley would reveal the photos, calibration certs etc as evidence? Otherwise I guess I just have to accept that their equipment and procedure was legit and I was doing 82mph as they allege.

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NewJudge
post Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 18:55
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QUOTE (Dev @ Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 19:30) *
So I guess in this case I would have to contest it and go to court before Thames valley would reveal the photos, calibration certs etc as evidence? Otherwise I guess I just have to accept that their equipment and procedure was legit and I was doing 82mph as they allege.

You won't get all of that even if you go to court. All you will get will be the evidence they intend to rely on to convict you. They do not have to prove that the device was accurate. It is assumed to be so unless the contrary is proved. If you want to question its accuracy the burden of that proof rests with you.
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Jlc
post Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 20:12
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...but you could ask for a photo to assist in the driver identification. They may supply one.

(The 28 day clock doesn't stop)

You admit speeding in your opening post...


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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cp8759
post Thu, 17 Oct 2019 - 10:27
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Posts: 38,006
Joined: 3 Dec 2010
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QUOTE (Dev @ Wed, 16 Oct 2019 - 19:30) *
I last did a SAC in 2015 so I’ll take another one if it’s offered in this case. I was just surprised not to be offered a means to view photographic evidence or details of the hand held equipment calibration as the last time I got busted by a fixed camera after returning the NIP with my details I was sent the COFP along with a website and a PIN code to enter on the site to gain access to view the photos of my vehicle along with time tag and speed etc. This was in Surrey a couple of years ago so maybe Thames Valley don’t offer the same service.

Every force has different procedures, the fact that some forces go over and above the minimum legal requirements does not imposer any obligations on other forces to do the same.


--------------------
If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
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