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Why dont the Police enfore the law regarding cyclists?
Korting
post Tue, 1 May 2018 - 22:14
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In the last few weeks, I've nearly had collisions with two cyclists both at night, both had jumped red lights and both had no lights on their bicycles.

Last Saturday night, I saw a cyclist fall over because he lost control, no other vehicles involved. I went to check if he was ok, he was and was going to ride off without lights.

I told him he didn't have any lights and he said he had reflectors. I told him reflectors are not good enough.

If I drive a car without lights the Police are likely to stop me and possibly report me. Ditto for a motorcyclist.

If I'm caught jumping a red light I'm likely to be reported.

Cyclists seem to get away with breaking all the rules and laws.

Why wont the Police take some action? It seems that Cyclists are above the law and a law unto themselves.

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post Tue, 1 May 2018 - 22:14
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PASTMYBEST
post Tue, 1 May 2018 - 22:16
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QUOTE (Korting @ Tue, 1 May 2018 - 23:14) *
In the last few weeks, I've nearly had collisions with two cyclists both at night, both had jumped red lights and both had no lights on their bicycles.

Last Saturday night, I saw a cyclist fall over because he lost control, no other vehicles involved. I went to check if he was ok, he was and was going to ride off without lights.

I told him he didn't have any lights and he said he had reflectors. I told him reflectors are not good enough.

If I drive a car without lights the Police are likely to stop me and possibly report me. Ditto for a motorcyclist.

If I'm caught jumping a red light I'm likely to be reported.

Cyclists seem to get away with breaking all the rules and laws.

Why wont the Police take some action? It seems that Cyclists are above the law and a law unto themselves.


can't catch em
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cp8759
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 03:19
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QUOTE (Korting @ Tue, 1 May 2018 - 23:14) *
Why wont the Police take some action? It seems that Cyclists are above the law and a law unto themselves.

You need to lobby your police and crime commissioner.


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I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
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The Rookie
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 06:03
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Warwickshire recently had a big campaign to tackle both. Publicised in advance and then seen by friends of mine in at least 4 different locations. As a cyclist I’m all in favour as I’ve been told a number of times that ALL CYCLISTS jump rd lights which of course is ridiculous.

Meantime I’ve lobbied for them to start enforcing traffic light compliance on cars at advanced stop lines as abuse is rampant.


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Jlc
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 07:25
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Wed, 2 May 2018 - 07:03) *
Meantime I’ve lobbied for them to start enforcing traffic light compliance on cars at advanced stop lines as abuse is rampant.

Actually, I find motorbikes the number 1 culprit here as they filter and decide that the box is their exclusive domain. I've even seen bikes do this straight in front of a police car sitting at the ASL. Perhaps they are interested in real criminals? laugh.gif


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peterguk
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 07:46
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QUOTE (Korting @ Tue, 1 May 2018 - 23:14) *
I told him he didn't have any lights and he said he had reflectors. I told him reflectors are not good enough.

If I drive a car without lights the Police are likely to stop me and possibly report me. Ditto for a motorcyclist.

If I'm caught jumping a red light I'm likely to be reported.


Cars and motorcycles come under different legislation to cycles.


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The Rookie
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 08:38
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No cycles are still required to show lights (when light conditions dictate) or are committing the same lighting offence.


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

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m7891
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 08:53
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QUOTE (Korting @ Tue, 1 May 2018 - 23:14) *
In the last few weeks, I've nearly had collisions with two cyclists both at night, both had jumped red lights and both had no lights on their bicycles.

Last Saturday night, I saw a cyclist fall over because he lost control, no other vehicles involved. I went to check if he was ok, he was and was going to ride off without lights.

I told him he didn't have any lights and he said he had reflectors. I told him reflectors are not good enough.

If I drive a car without lights the Police are likely to stop me and possibly report me. Ditto for a motorcyclist.

If I'm caught jumping a red light I'm likely to be reported.

Cyclists seem to get away with breaking all the rules and laws.

Why wont the Police take some action? It seems that Cyclists are above the law and a law unto themselves.


Key word - "caught". You can drive through every red light you see, at night with no lights and get away with it if you aren't caught.

There's this prevalent attitude that just because you see a cyclist doing something illegal and they're not caught, it follows that all cyclists act illegally and are not caught. Two applications of the hasty generalisation fallacy.

I'm pretty sure that in your lifetime you've seen more drivers breaking the law and getting away with it than you have cyclists. Amber gamblers? Full-on red-light jumpers? Speeding? The vast majority of drivers see these every single day but just shrug them off; see a cyclist jump a red light and suddenly there should be at least 5 traffic cars and an armed response team descending on the area.

I'm not defending cyclists who break the law; but there is a distinct hypocrisy amongst many drivers when it comes to their complaining.
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DancingDad
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 09:18
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Same story as many others.
Minor crime, not enough cops.

As a car driver, the no lights really bug me...... often also in dark clothing so just a shadow, if that, in headlights
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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 10:51
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Cyclists without lights are frustrating, even more so for cyclists liable to meet them on poorly lit cycle paths.

However, I see more drivers with headlights out, taillights out, rubbish retrofit xenon that blinds you or the more recent phenomenon of people driving along in the dark with just DRLs on. And arguably drivers have less excuse with no need to recharge lights or find batteries for them.

As for red lights, again even more drivers do, they just happen to do it with "amber gambling" instead. There is a roundabout near me that is particularly bad because the phasing is terrible so you suddenly realise that someone is flooring it through not only after the light has turned red but when the green man/cycle is lit.

If you ever cycle you will soon appreciate the number of drivers who overtake in the stupidest places with inches to spare, that is much worse than a cyclist without lights but I have never seen a police car pull someone for it even though it happened a couple of weeks ago with a police car 20m behind.

Basically, whatever form of transport you use there are idiots who don't maintain their vehicle, treat the rules as optional. It isn't a cyclist problem or a driver problem, just a general all round tw*t problem.
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nigelbb
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 11:17
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QUOTE (notmeatloaf @ Wed, 2 May 2018 - 11:51) *
Cyclists without lights are frustrating, even more so for cyclists liable to meet them on poorly lit cycle paths.

However, I see more drivers with headlights out, taillights out, rubbish retrofit xenon that blinds you or the more recent phenomenon of people driving along in the dark with just DRLs on. And arguably drivers have less excuse with no need to recharge lights or find batteries for them.

As for red lights, again even more drivers do, they just happen to do it with "amber gambling" instead. There is a roundabout near me that is particularly bad because the phasing is terrible so you suddenly realise that someone is flooring it through not only after the light has turned red but when the green man/cycle is lit.

You will be telling us next that even more motorists than cyclists drive on the pavement.


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Damning OFT advice on levels of parking charges that was ignored by the BPA Ltd Reference Request Number: IAT/FOIA/135010 – 12 October 2012
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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 11:40
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Per year between 2007 - 2016

Average number of pedestrian deaths by cyclist over the last decade per year - 3

Average number of pedestrians killed by drivers per year - 317 including 43 on the pavement.

Average number of pedestrians seriously injured by cyclist per year - 82

Average number of pedestrians injured by motorists - 4394

Obviously some of the cyclist ones will be on shared paths where cyclists are entitled to be.

When motorists get their house in order maybe we can move onto cyclists on the pavement.

This post has been edited by notmeatloaf: Wed, 2 May 2018 - 11:45
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TheDisapprovingB...
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 15:27
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Ah, the fallacy of relative privation - a favoured refuge among many cyclists.
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nigelbb
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 16:02
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QUOTE (notmeatloaf @ Wed, 2 May 2018 - 12:40) *
Per year between 2007 - 2016

Average number of pedestrian deaths by cyclist over the last decade per year - 3

Average number of pedestrians killed by drivers per year - 317 including 43 on the pavement.

Average number of pedestrians seriously injured by cyclist per year - 82

Average number of pedestrians injured by motorists - 4394

Obviously some of the cyclist ones will be on shared paths where cyclists are entitled to be.

When motorists get their house in order maybe we can move onto cyclists on the pavement.

I am truly astonished at those figures. Taking into account the vastly greater number of miles travelled by motorists versus cyclists it's clear that cyclists who are by far the greater menace to pedestrians.

This post has been edited by nigelbb: Wed, 2 May 2018 - 16:03


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British Parking Association Ltd Code of Practice(Appendix C contains Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 ) & can be found here http://www.britishparking.co.uk/Code-of-Pr...ance-monitoring
DfT Guidance on Section 56 and Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/syste...ing-charges.pdf
Damning OFT advice on levels of parking charges that was ignored by the BPA Ltd Reference Request Number: IAT/FOIA/135010 – 12 October 2012
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ford poplar
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 16:38
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No cyclist >10yo can legally cycle on the pavement or use a pedestrian crossing, (includes dismounted 'scooting'.
What annoys me are those riders who use only 'flashing' front/rear lights or use a helmet-mounted front light.
As the number of motorists/cyclists increase, each should be subject to basic requirements eg 'third party' Insurance and MOT.
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666
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 16:54
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QUOTE (ford poplar @ Wed, 2 May 2018 - 17:38) *
No cyclist >10yo can legally cycle on the pavement or use a pedestrian crossing, (includes dismounted 'scooting'.


No cyclist of any age can legally cycle on the pavement, it's just that under-10s can't be prosecuted (in E & W).

AFAIK there's no law against cycling on a ped crossing.
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big_mac
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 17:01
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QUOTE (nigelbb @ Wed, 2 May 2018 - 17:02) *
Taking into account the vastly greater number of miles travelled by motorists versus cyclists it's clear that cyclists who are by far the greater menace to pedestrians.

The last time I could be bothered to go through the figures, compared to a car driver, a cyclist was about twice as likely, per mile travelled, to be involved in collision causing death or serious injury to a pedestrian.

Obviously, if you just consider urban roads, the result would be different.
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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 17:44
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QUOTE (nigelbb @ Wed, 2 May 2018 - 17:02) *
I am truly astonished at those figures. Taking into account the vastly greater number of miles travelled by motorists versus cyclists it's clear that cyclists who are by far the greater menace to pedestrians.

Except I would imagine most pedestrians are worried about the chance of being killed or seriously injured per journey, or per million people, or whatever. Most people don't worry about things that are very very very unlikely to happen unless they don't understand it is very very very unlikely to happen.

QUOTE (ford poplar @ Wed, 2 May 2018 - 17:38) *
As the number of motorists/cyclists increase, each should be subject to basic requirements eg 'third party' Insurance and MOT.

If you look at somewhere like the Netherlands cycling becomes less risky the more people who cycle. Not least because they don't have the god awful cycle lanes we have here. So you should need less regulation.

With motoring the risk is unchanged so the regulation is broadly unchanged.

Again any stats will tell you it would be worth targeting uninsured drivers before giving a monkey about cyclists, because police resources are stretched so you have to prioritise.
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southpaw82
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 19:01
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I f***ing hate these cyclist threads.


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Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 2 May 2018 - 20:07
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You're lucky it's just threads, as "the" cyclist at work it's every. Sodding. Day.

"Oi, were you cycling along xxx Road yesterday morning?"
"No."
"Oh. Well, a cyclist pulled out of the cycle lane right in front of me. I almost ran them over. I thought it must be you."
"Perhaps it was one of the other handful of cyclists in the city?"
"It just looked like your bike. Two wheels. Saddle."
"Where did they pull out?"
"Right by those road works."
"There's a traffic light in the middle of the cycle lane there, you have to pull out to go around it."
"Well, they should have waited. I wasn't expecting it."
"WHAT DID YOU EXPECT YOU HALFWIT? THE CYCLIST TO CYCLE THROUGH THE TRAFFIC LIGHT? HOP ONTO THE PAVEMENT AND KILL FOUR PEDESTRIANS? WAIT UNTIL 3AM WHEN THERE IS NO OTHER TRAFFIC AROUND?"

Almost worth driving to work just to shut them up.

This post has been edited by notmeatloaf: Wed, 2 May 2018 - 20:08
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