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Driving Past the Police when they are doing the exact speedlimit
speedfighter23
post Mon, 28 Oct 2019 - 19:00
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Just a question about something I have always wondered; when you are on the motorway and the police are doing 70 on the dot and you pass them and they stop you, can you get done for speeding despite being under the 70 + 10% + 2 (e.g. 78 or below?).

Now that police are quite active on twitter, I saw them stopping someone for driving by them even though according to their accounts they were doing 70, and punishing them because they weren't insured (ok bad example, but the main reason they stopped them was because they were going faster than them)

Has anyone seen a prosecution for going lets say 72 in a 70?

I am quite curious about this given that people are generally scared to overtake a police car on the motorway!

I don't mind being the guinea pig, all my paperwork is in order so wouldn't mind going 75 in a 70 and overtaking a policeman to see what happens, or should I just never overtake police cars going 70!


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post Mon, 28 Oct 2019 - 19:00
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PASTMYBEST
post Mon, 28 Oct 2019 - 19:18
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IIUC police speedos are calibrated so if theirs says 70 it is doing 70 If not if the did decide to prosecute you and say we were doing 70 by our speedo and the other car overtook so they must be speeding, you would have to challenge the accuracy of their speedo.

But in honesty my experience suggests that if you come up behind pull out safely overtake and pull back in doing a not to over the top speed they will not bother you. If they see you flying up to them through their mirrors and you slow and pass them at 75 or so, they just might pull you They can


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DancingDad
post Mon, 28 Oct 2019 - 20:03
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Nowt to stop them pulling you at 71, doubt it would happen very much but they can.
Don't forget the +10% +2mph is guidance, the law is the exact figure stated.

My experience with cops cruising on motorways is that they rarely travel exactly at the speed limit, usually toddling along lane 1 at 60-65.
No hurry, they got all day and are being paid, no timetable to adhere to and the bonus is, they get to watch their customers coming up behind and overtaking.
I'm more worried about the cop or camera I don't see, not playing silly beggars with the ones I can.
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Mayhem007
post Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 08:09
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I regularly go 75 past them without any concern. Most of the time on motorways, from what I have seen, they drive about 65 to allow drivers to pass them, otherwise you'd have a massive queue behind them. Not a very safe situation to be in.


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cp8759
post Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 11:34
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QUOTE (speedfighter23 @ Mon, 28 Oct 2019 - 19:00) *
I am quite curious about this given that people are generally scared to overtake a police car on the motorway!

The prosecution threshold is 79, so up to 78 they'd be hard pressed to justify taking any action. I don't see any officer caring about someone doing 72 or 75. That being said, as has been noted above the police tend to drive slightly below the limit anyway.

Still, I've passed them dead on 70 and seen a queue of high-powers cars too scared to go past.


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DancingDad
post Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 12:01
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Years back in the days before cameras, basic thoughts were that someone doing 80 or less was unlikely to be stopped for speeding.
85, as long as contrite and passed the attitude test, a rowlocking and sent on your way.
90, good chance of a ticket.
95, very good chance of a ticket.
100 plus, gonna end up in court.
Of course that all depended on the cops actually seeing you and taking action, I've clocked a cop car coming down a slip road behind me, let off the gas, had them pull alongside, give me and the car a lookover, a wagging finger and they bu55ered off.
They knew and I knew that my speed was "slightly" (ahem) over 70 but that I was aware and slowed either didn't give them chance to record a speed or they decided that I was safe enough. Take your pick.
I've also seen on the cop fly on the wall progs where a cop in a marked car has been following someone over the speed limit and decided to pull them. Rational is if the driver isn't aware of a cop car behind them, they aren't giving enough attention so even 75 could generate a pull. Unlikely to go to enforcement but cops get bored and don't mind checking out someone who is ignoring them.

As said, cops rarely toodle along at 70, usually less so no issues in overtaking sensibly.
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cp8759
post Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 12:42
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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 12:01) *
As said, cops rarely toodle along at 70, usually less so no issues in overtaking sensibly.

To be fair I've also seen them plod along at 80, just as good a way to ensure there's no build up behind them but also stops people doing silly speeds.


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speedfighter23
post Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 19:43
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 11:34) *
QUOTE (speedfighter23 @ Mon, 28 Oct 2019 - 19:00) *
I am quite curious about this given that people are generally scared to overtake a police car on the motorway!

The prosecution threshold is 79, so up to 78 they'd be hard pressed to justify taking any action. I don't see any officer caring about someone doing 72 or 75. That being said, as has been noted above the police tend to drive slightly below the limit anyway.

Still, I've passed them dead on 70 and seen a queue of high-powers cars too scared to go past.


That's exactly what I meant. I remember a policeman going 70 indicated on the middle lane and no one dared overtake them!
I'll try next time doing 72 = )

QUOTE (DancingDad @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 12:01) *
Years back in the days before cameras, basic thoughts were that someone doing 80 or less was unlikely to be stopped for speeding.
85, as long as contrite and passed the attitude test, a rowlocking and sent on your way.
90, good chance of a ticket.
95, very good chance of a ticket.
100 plus, gonna end up in court.
Of course that all depended on the cops actually seeing you and taking action, I've clocked a cop car coming down a slip road behind me, let off the gas, had them pull alongside, give me and the car a lookover, a wagging finger and they bu55ered off.
They knew and I knew that my speed was "slightly" (ahem) over 70 but that I was aware and slowed either didn't give them chance to record a speed or they decided that I was safe enough. Take your pick.
I've also seen on the cop fly on the wall progs where a cop in a marked car has been following someone over the speed limit and decided to pull them. Rational is if the driver isn't aware of a cop car behind them, they aren't giving enough attention so even 75 could generate a pull. Unlikely to go to enforcement but cops get bored and don't mind checking out someone who is ignoring them.

As said, cops rarely toodle along at 70, usually less so no issues in overtaking sensibly.


I've actually been followed by the police going around 58 in a 50, but they didn't stop me and just well, kept on following me! It was dark and they didn't have their Blue Lights on so I didn't notice it was a police car for a while! It was quite funny, they were going the exact speed I was going at, if I accelerated, so did they, almost tailgating me actually = )

This post has been edited by speedfighter23: Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 19:45


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cp8759
post Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 20:14
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QUOTE (speedfighter23 @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 19:43) *
I've actually been followed by the police going around 58 in a 50, but they didn't stop me and just well, kept on following me! It was dark and they didn't have their Blue Lights on so I didn't notice it was a police car for a while! It was quite funny, they were going the exact speed I was going at, if I accelerated, so did they, almost tailgating me actually = )

It sounds like they were pacing you, i.e. following you at a fixed distance to determine your speed. If I'm right then obviously they were after serious speeders rather than people going just a bit over.

This post has been edited by cp8759: Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 20:14


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DancingDad
post Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 21:52
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 20:14) *
QUOTE (speedfighter23 @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 19:43) *
I've actually been followed by the police going around 58 in a 50, but they didn't stop me and just well, kept on following me! It was dark and they didn't have their Blue Lights on so I didn't notice it was a police car for a while! It was quite funny, they were going the exact speed I was going at, if I accelerated, so did they, almost tailgating me actually = )

It sounds like they were pacing you, i.e. following you at a fixed distance to determine your speed. If I'm right then obviously they were after serious speeders rather than people going just a bit over.


Police driver may well have simply been going in the same direction and matching to you, we all do it at times when driving.
Or they just sit there, waiting to see what you were going to do. Not willing to sort out a load of paperwork for a borderline speeding case but wondering if you were going to panic.
Or just waiting for the vehicle check to come back clear. I've certainly had that, cop car slot in behind, sit there for 5 minutes, overtake and move on to the next one.
Or just waiting for you to notice them and slow down.
Or....
Can be disconcerting though, all those little thoughts going through your mind, Oh God, the MOT ran out....duh, you took it in last week and it passed....what about my insurance.... did that last month....

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speedfighter23
post Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 23:54
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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 21:52) *
QUOTE (cp8759 @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 20:14) *
QUOTE (speedfighter23 @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 19:43) *
I've actually been followed by the police going around 58 in a 50, but they didn't stop me and just well, kept on following me! It was dark and they didn't have their Blue Lights on so I didn't notice it was a police car for a while! It was quite funny, they were going the exact speed I was going at, if I accelerated, so did they, almost tailgating me actually = )

It sounds like they were pacing you, i.e. following you at a fixed distance to determine your speed. If I'm right then obviously they were after serious speeders rather than people going just a bit over.


Police driver may well have simply been going in the same direction and matching to you, we all do it at times when driving.
Or they just sit there, waiting to see what you were going to do. Not willing to sort out a load of paperwork for a borderline speeding case but wondering if you were going to panic.
Or just waiting for the vehicle check to come back clear. I've certainly had that, cop car slot in behind, sit there for 5 minutes, overtake and move on to the next one.
Or just waiting for you to notice them and slow down.
Or....
Can be disconcerting though, all those little thoughts going through your mind, Oh God, the MOT ran out....duh, you took it in last week and it passed....what about my insurance.... did that last month....


What is funny is that they actually were following me in the place I am most likely to speed other than the average speed cameras on the M25, the A40 at Northolt westbound when it goes from 50 to 70 as that is a downhill and I generally start accelerating before I reach the national speed limit sign!

I have no problem with the police stopping me, I am fully legit in terms of paperwork, although I have in 12 years only been stopped by the police once in Knighsbridge in 2008; they were doing an anti terriorist excercise and were searching my car, even telling me if I would like a form from them saying they stopped me due to the anti-terrorist act!


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Police Speeding Fines - Police 1 - speedfighter23 0
TFL traffic contraventions 0 - speedfighter23 2
Kensington and Chelsea 0 parking contraventions - speedfighter23 1
Brighton and Hove parking 0 - speedfighter23 1
Private PCN - Private Parking Solutions Limited 0 - speedfighter23 1

Tyre Puncture Pothole Claims:
0 Buckinghamshire Council - speedfighter23 1
0 TFL - speedfighter23 1

Result Pending:

1 Islington Council tyre puncture claim
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mike5100
post Wed, 30 Oct 2019 - 08:26
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If you are judging the speed of the police vehicle by reference to your own speedo, it's likely they were doing a real 65mph. If you have a good satnav that displays your true speed, use that. You will probably find that you can overtake the police car without breaking any speed limits.
Mike
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DancingDad
post Wed, 30 Oct 2019 - 11:19
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QUOTE (speedfighter23 @ Tue, 29 Oct 2019 - 23:54) *
…………. although I have in 12 years only been stopped by the police once in Knighsbridge in 2008; they were doing an anti terriorist excercise and were searching my car, even telling me if I would like a form from them saying they stopped me due to the anti-terrorist act!


Uhm, in my first 12 years of driving I lost count of how many times I was stopped by police.
Part of life's rich pageant being a bit of a nutter, driving bangers and often being on the road in the wee small hours due to jobs I was doing.
Never got booked for anything but plenty of warnings.
The vast majority of cops were polite, professional and courteous.
I must have passed the attitude test.
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PASTMYBEST
post Wed, 30 Oct 2019 - 12:16
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As a youngster. I taxed my car religiously every year, but only for six months so I was pulled quite a lot. In those days all that happened was the police reported you to DVLA. If you had paid the back duty before that report went in nothing happened.

I forgot one time and recieved a letter telling me I had to pay, I think it was £40 + the back duty or they would prosecute. I let them, went th othe mags and plead guilty, was fined a fiver + the back duty, it cost me £13

How times have changed


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DancingDad
post Wed, 30 Oct 2019 - 12:26
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Similar to the traditional buy 12 months tax and get one free.
For less then a month out, cops would usually give a warning.

Had one when I actually was going to post office to tax the beast and as I parked, beat cop (remember them) clocked the tax was out of date.
He waited by my car to ensure I came back with a valid disc.
Another I was pulled by a motorcycle cop who was concerned about a rear wheel wobble.... very pleasant cop, I didn't like to tell him that I had slid it into a kerb the night before and was going to a scrapyard for a replacement half shaft..... After we had inspected the wheel, tyre and I had profusely thanked him and assured him that I would go and get it checked straight away, he returned to his bike.
Casting a final comment over his shoulder.... "By the way, your tax is out of date"
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PASTMYBEST
post Wed, 30 Oct 2019 - 14:06
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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Wed, 30 Oct 2019 - 12:26) *
Similar to the traditional buy 12 months tax and get one free.
For less then a month out, cops would usually give a warning.

Had one when I actually was going to post office to tax the beast and as I parked, beat cop (remember them) clocked the tax was out of date.
He waited by my car to ensure I came back with a valid disc.
Another I was pulled by a motorcycle cop who was concerned about a rear wheel wobble.... very pleasant cop, I didn't like to tell him that I had slid it into a kerb the night before and was going to a scrapyard for a replacement half shaft..... After we had inspected the wheel, tyre and I had profusely thanked him and assured him that I would go and get it checked straight away, he returned to his bike.
Casting a final comment over his shoulder.... "By the way, your tax is out of date"


Ha, the note in the disc holder "tax applied for " or "tax in the post" usually yellowing with age. Oh the good old days


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roythebus
post Wed, 13 Nov 2019 - 23:27
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Heading home coastbound along the M20 earlier this year in the early hours, at my usual cruise control speed in lane 1, there were a few cars in lane 2 that I was catching up with. I tailed them for about 7 miles, then the 2nd car put blue lights on and pulled the lead car.

He'd been doing about 75 in lane 2 with lane 1 empty. I suspect they'd done him for speeding, driving without due care, and not driving on the left! I reckon had he been doing 75 in lane 1 they wouldn't have bothered. I've not been pulled by the police on that bit of road, but the bloody average speed cameras are a pain! And I always use lane 1 when it's possible, any time of day or night.
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cp8759
post Thu, 14 Nov 2019 - 13:42
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QUOTE (roythebus @ Wed, 13 Nov 2019 - 23:27) *
Heading home coastbound along the M20 earlier this year in the early hours, at my usual cruise control speed in lane 1, there were a few cars in lane 2 that I was catching up with. I tailed them for about 7 miles, then the 2nd car put blue lights on and pulled the lead car.

He'd been doing about 75 in lane 2 with lane 1 empty. I suspect they'd done him for speeding, driving without due care, and not driving on the left! I reckon had he been doing 75 in lane 1 they wouldn't have bothered. I've not been pulled by the police on that bit of road, but the bloody average speed cameras are a pain! And I always use lane 1 when it's possible, any time of day or night.

They will have done him for middle lane hogging i.e. careless driving. The back-office won't process a TOR for 75 in a 70.


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Formfeed
post Fri, 15 Nov 2019 - 00:47
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The limit is 70, no more, but in my experience most motorway cars do less so that traffic is forced to pass or conspicuously tuck in behind, at which time they find out what else is wrong.

Whether you will be done for going 72? Technically yes but in practice its not necessary, there's normally other reasons for the stop as per this example.
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cp8759
post Fri, 15 Nov 2019 - 12:02
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QUOTE (Formfeed @ Fri, 15 Nov 2019 - 00:47) *
The limit is 70, no more, but in my experience most motorway cars do less so that traffic is forced to pass or conspicuously tuck in behind, at which time they find out what else is wrong.

Whether you will be done for going 72? Technically yes but in practice its not necessary, there's normally other reasons for the stop as per this example.

No, the enforcement threshold is 79. We've had someone on here who got a NIP for doing 76 and when he called the ticket office to query it, they admitted it had been sent out in error and it got cancelled. Aside from anything else, last time I checked the requirement for Home Office type approval was a margin of error not exceeding 2 mph up to 66 mph and not more than 3% for speeds over 66 mph, so a reading of 72 would not prove guilt beyond reasonable doubt.


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