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Parking Property Management and Gladstones
AnEmptyShelf
post Wed, 15 Feb 2017 - 22:05
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Good evening, thank you for your time in reading and also apologies in advance for any newbie mistakes!

First off, Im a little worried that too much information MAY give the game away as to my identity so I will do my best to provide as much information as possible without incriminating myself, but if you do feel as though Im somewhat lacking in some vital information please feel free to put me to rights rolleyes.gif

So a brief history into the situation:-

We bought a new flat which came with an allocated parking space which is leased from the landlord (the developer). At the time of moving in and signing the lease no parking restrictions were in place, all of the residents used common sense to park in what ever bay came with the flat they owned where applicable and everything was great. My lease is a fairly generic lease but it DOES NOT mention that parking restrictions are in force.

A few months later and the managing agent wrote to us and said that parking restrictions were going to be put in place and that we had to display permits by such and such date, or course, we forgot (as did quite a few other residents) and were issued with a couple of PCNs for not displaying a valid permit. We also used to receive Notices when ever we parked our vehicles in empty bays whilst nipping into our flats, unloading the shopping etc, or leaving our vehicles in known empty 'unoccupied' bays when we'd finished 16 hour + days. I ignored these tickets, and reminders, and all but one disappeared.

I then received what is best described as the worst formatted Letter Before Claim I have ever seen, from Gladstones, which turned up in the post off memory a couple of days before the County Court Claim Form.

At the time, I acknowledged the claim and filed my defence based on my lease and also wrote to the managing agent who subsequently had the claim dropped. Im not sure on what grounds this claim was dropped, but I received a Notice of Discontinuance and that was that, or so I thought.

Recently I have received another Claim Form, this time with no prior warning (with the exception of the reminder letters sent way back last year) or Letter Before Claim.

They are now claiming for two other PCNs which are dated one before and one after the first claim, which begs the question as to why they have only decided to act now. I suspect that they have sat back and looked at the numerous PCNs issued and decided to take action on the two that are the most likely to receive payment, where a vehicle registered to a business is parked in a bay which does not belong to the registered business (the others were all received in our bay)

I have acknowledged the claim on MCOL, but that is as far as I have got as I want to know where I stand before I start on my defence.

Id be interested to see what the experts on here think of the situation, any help would be greatly appreciated. Ive also listed some queries below:-

I have read several posts on here and also example letters to send to the managing agent and the DVLA regarding the misuse of my information etc but don't really know if they apply?

I also don't know if they can simply take a business to court without the knowledge of the driver? As it stands I have not put this information forward.

Does the lack of parking restrictions on the lease give any room for manoeuvre?

I also have written permission (via email) to use of the bay where the tickets were received, from a representative of the landlord which dates back years with no mention of when I had to stop using the bay. As it stands, work is STILL ongoing in the bay we own and we are STILL using the bay in question.

Signage in the car park is very limited, are there guidelines as to the layout that these must adhere to?


Any help would be greatly appreciated

P.S, whilst doing some epic googling I found a great youtube video of Gladstones Solicitors acting extremely professional, much like their letter before claim.
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Lynnzer
post Fri, 17 Feb 2017 - 09:44
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QUOTE (AnEmptyShelf @ Fri, 17 Feb 2017 - 07:49) *
QUOTE (Lynnzer @ Thu, 16 Feb 2017 - 09:45) *
Lots of useful template style letters on my signature link for residential parking.

You need the first one suitably edited to fit, then the one to the managing agent for tortious interference.

Post a copy of each before you submit them so we can check them out.


Lynzer, thank you for your reply. Ive just taken a quick look at the residential letter template however I am not a Freeholder as the Freehold is still owned by the developer. Would that template still apply albeit replacing Freehold with Leaseholder?

Same thing. It's a lease for a leaseholder or deeds/easements for a freeholder. Just edit to suit.

I would leave any claim for now. Just get on with the defence until you get an answer from the DVLA for something you haven't even asekd them for yet.
You need to write and ask who asked for your details and when. Do it asap. If you get an answer quickly you can add the counter-claim and it'll be easier than taking a separate action. However, it's a winner either way. You and your guests have the right to unfettered use of the parking areas.

The Managing Agent can be taken to task right away for tortious interferance.

QUOTE (Fed Up With Scam Artists @ Thu, 16 Feb 2017 - 20:20) *
Lynnzer - I realise this is not my post but I have some questions to ask you in relation to your residential-parking pdf. http://www.thebridesmother.co.uk/Media/res...ial-parking.pdf

How and where should I ask you my questions? I don't want to mess up this page for the original writer.

Many thanks.

QUOTE (Lynnzer @ Thu, 16 Feb 2017 - 09:45) *
Lots of useful template style letters on my signature link for residential parking.

You need the first one suitably edited to fit, then the one to the managing agent for tortious interference.

Post a copy of each before you submit them so we can check them out.


Just point me to your topic and I can follow through on there.


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The Rookie
post Fri, 17 Feb 2017 - 09:59
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Occupier.... you have legal occupation rights to the property (and attachments such as parking space or rights to park) in question.


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AnEmptyShelf
post Mon, 20 Feb 2017 - 23:01
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QUOTE (Lynnzer @ Thu, 16 Feb 2017 - 09:45) *
Lots of useful template style letters on my signature link for residential parking.

You need the first one suitably edited to fit, then the one to the managing agent for tortious interference.

Post a copy of each before you submit them so we can check them out.


Sorry for the delay guys, Ive been so busy with work and the likes I haven't had a minute to get involved in this...

So, as advised please see my edited version of the letter which will be winging its way to Gladstones. Ive omitted my personal info and vehicle reg.

20th February 2017

Gladstones Solicitors
The Terrace
High Leigh Park Golf Club
Warrington Road
Knutsford
Cheshire
WA16 6AA
I refer to claim form- *******

Letter before action
The above Claim Form has been served on me as the registered keeper of vehicle Reg, ******. This draws my attention to the fact that you are using my allocated car parking areas for your own business purposes. My lease allows unfettered occupational rights to the parking areas, which means you are operating a predatory business on land, which you have no overriding rights in.
Your involvement on this land will have supposedly been to prevent parking by uninvited persons, for the benefit of the actual leaseholders and their invited guests. Instead you carry out a predatory operation on those very people whose interests you are purportedly there to uphold.
In any case, my lease in respect of the common areas of the grounds and my designated parking area places no restrictions on the parking facilities such as those you have tried to imply, let alone a penalty regime for an alleged contractual offer to use my own allocated parking area I already have such rights. You cannot offer me something I already have, and I am not obliged to accept an offer in such circumstances.
My lease remains the same as when it was originally agreed as part of my residential rights. There are no restrictions on parking within it and I believe you are acting unlawfully by attempting to take legal action when I have an absolute right of peaceful enjoyment on the land.
If you feel that you have been misled by the Managing Agents insofar as they have contracted with you to operate here, then that is something you must take up with them directly. It is of little interest to me as I have unequivocal unfettered right of peaceful enjoyment on the land.
I draw you attention to the case of Jopson v Homeguard , case 2906J in Oxford County Court where the appeal heard by his honour Judge Harris QC. This was an appeal against a previous hearing which was awarded in favour of Homeguard, in similar circumstances as those addressed in my dispute with you. The Judge allowed the appeal in favour of Mrs Jopson.
As you have seen fit to attempt to charge me the sum of £395.17 as a legitimate amount for the use of my own leaseholder rights to the areas of the property, I hereby claim an amount of £395.17 for damages for the tort of trespass and for the attempt to restrict my rightful use of the designated area.

Additional matters
You have obtained my details from the DVLA when you have no right to do so.
I am of the opinion that you don't care if you have rights and perhaps rely on your victims believing that some contract with the Managing Agent of the premises or even the landowner, allows you to apply parking terms on the car parking spaces at the premises. This is a mistaken assumption, as you will know anyway.
I am a resident at the premises to which the parking is attached as a lease and which allows unfettered rights to the use of the communal areas and parking facilities.
You have a duty of care to comply with the necessary Code of Practice of your Accredited Trade Association, the International Parking Community. The requirements laid out in the Code of practice make it clear that you must only operate on land where you have the landholder’s permission. You have failed in that duty. Your involvement in your supposed parking management arrangements place on you an obligation to ensure that proper consideration is given to all the facts. Lax contractual assessment is not an excuse for a derogation of your duty. A breach of the Data Protect Act is a matter of fact. You have either breached it or you haven't. Whatever excuse you present for the breach does not excuse it in any way as you are under the requirement to show due diligence and a duty of care to ensure that personal details are obtained lawfully and then used lawfully from then on.
You will know that as this is a residential location the residents will have some sort of property rights, either by way of a lease or as a freehold resident with attached easements. It is incumbent upon you to consider the resident's rights in respect of the use of parking spaces. If you contracted with the managing agents to “control” the parking facilities they have misdirected you, although it is common knowledge that they often get a kick-back in commission for allowing predatory parking companies to take control of land. They have no other real interest otherwise.
If it was the landowner who contracted with you then the same applies. A landowner cannot restrict a privilege within an agreed covenant and it is your responsibility to ask the right questions and ensure that the operation of parking control is lawful. However you look at this, as I have an absolute right to use of the parking facilities without any intervention from you or anyone else, a breach of the Data Protection Act HAS occurred as you had no reasonable cause to apply for and use my personal details from the DVLA.
I am therefore submitting a complaint to both the DVLA and the Information Commissioner’s Office about your misuse of personal data.
I now make a claim against you for punitive damages to the extent of £750.00 for the wrongful application for, and misuse of my information from the DVLA. This is a serious matter and one which is both stressful and degrading. It impinges on my rights as a leasehold resident, has caused some considerable anxiety and distress and to top it all off, you are now warning me of a claim being likely in a country court for the sum of money you deem you are entitled to. This is an atrocious situation without any merit at all, and I believe may also be a fraudulent action under the auspices of the Fraud Act 2006 for Fraud by false representation which is a criminal offence that carries a sentence of up to 12 months imprisonment on summary conviction.
BE AWARE that this matter is now in your knowledge. An excuse of not knowing a criminal act had occurred due to the ill-constructed contract you have to “manage” the parking, now has no merit. I will ensure that anyone else within the residential complex who is being targeted by you from now on will be made full aware of your illegal activity and I will also be considering legal action against you for fraud myself anyway. I will first see how you handle this claim before I make a complaint to the police.
I now claim the amount of £395.17 for your trespass against my covenanted rights.
An additional amount of £750.00 for the damages is also claimed for wrongful application of, and misuse of the data from the DVLA. This is already adjudicated on as being reasonable as evidenced by the case of Halliday v Creation Consumer Finance Ltd [2013] All ER (D) 199
The total amount claimed is therefore £1145.17

To prevent this matter being taken to court I require payment within 14 working days from 2 days of the date of this letter. Failure of this will result in a court claim being instigated and consequential separate costs being added for the added expense.
I have made it known already that I will also be considering a police complaint for the fraud dependant on the response to this claim.

Yours sincerely

*****

So, assuming that this is okay, should I send this to anyone else other than Gladstones?


The claim was filed on 2/2/17, how much time do you think I have to get my defence all sorted? I appreciate Ive left things a little on the late side.

Many thanks




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Lynnzer
post Tue, 21 Feb 2017 - 07:24
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Send it ONLY to PPM.
Gladstones are merely acting under instructions from them.

Also do a Tortious interference claim against the MA.



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AnEmptyShelf
post Tue, 21 Feb 2017 - 07:39
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QUOTE (Lynnzer @ Tue, 21 Feb 2017 - 07:24) *
Send it ONLY to PPM.
Gladstones are merely acting under instructions from them.

Also do a Tortious interference claim against the MA.


Thank you!

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AnEmptyShelf
post Tue, 21 Feb 2017 - 08:08
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DVLA letter where a breach of DPA has occurred by passing details to MIL or others.

Dear Sir,

I wish to draw to your attention a serious breach of the Data Protection Act which impacts on you KADOE Agreement with parking companies. My personal details were accessed by Parking and Property Management on numerous occasions on or around 20th April 2016, 10th August 2016, 31st October 2016 and 19th November 2016. As far as I can ascertain this was within the reasonable cause criteria and I make no complaint about that. My concern is that the company who accessed my details has sold them to a third party as an assignment of debt. That company is Gladstones Solicitors and I am of the opinion that there was no permission granted to Parking Property Management to pass those details over to a 3rd party. This is a serious breach of the Data Protection Act and a breach of the KADOE Agreement by the parking company. I will be making an official complaint to the Information Commissioner so that action can be taken as necessary for the breach and in the meantime I ask that you apply sanctions against both of the companies involved in this instance.

The wrongful use of my details and a confirmed disregard of the KADOE Agreement places the DVLA in a poor light. It puts doubt on the operational effectiveness of having to make agreements with dodgy parking companies who have little regard to protocol or lawful behaviour and deserves them being prevented from using the services of the DVLA on future occasions.

Yours Sincerely


So, first off should I only mention the two tickets the claim form is referring to or do I include all of them?

And which Dept. do I send this to at the DVLA?

Thanks





Also, I have emailed the managing agent again, see email below.

I have removed the part regarding the counter claim for now.

Dear ****,

I am the recipient of a county court claim from ***** for an alleged contravention of parking conditions on my allocated parking area. I am extremely annoyed that where my lease gives me unfettered rights to parking that someone has sought to override my landholder rights in this manner.
I have reasonable assumption that Parking Property Management was contracted to operate a parking management scheme on the land and that yourselves, as managing agent would have contracted with them to do so.

As my lease has primacy over any subsequent terms placed on the use of the land, then the action of placing parking conditions where none are shown in my lease, is unlawful. In fact this even has a name. It carries the grand description of Tortious Interference. You may care to Google it to see why I am now considering action against you for the neglect and deliberate interference you have shown towards my rights as a leaseholder.

The terms of my lease are being interfered with. I have not signed, nor even been consulted on any changes to my lease and you have allowed an outside company to start their operations on land to which I have a right of peaceful enjoyment without any restrictions or penalties placed on parking in the manner claimed by Parking Property Management.
I demand that you tell Parking Property Management to desist from placing any parking tickets on my vehicles, regardless of whether or not I use a permit and to cancel any pending tickets. I do not care of the consequences to you for an early cancellation of the parking contract. That is something you will have to sort out yourselves, having been discourteous to contract with them in the first place.

I also wish to have a copy of the contract you have with Parking Property Management for my own records.

I require a response to this email within 7 working days.

Yours sincerely
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Lynnzer
post Tue, 21 Feb 2017 - 11:16
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Nooooooo. Leave the DVLA complaint. Gladstones haven't purchased the debt. They just act as an agent of PPM. Different to the MIL cases entirely.

You can however do that complaint against PPM for accessing the DVLA database where no reasonable cause exists. It cannot be reasonable for them to access the database when the person they are pursuing is a legitimate user - leaseholder with unfettered rights to park.

For the MA. You can make a claim right now if you wish but if you've emailed them already that at least puts them on notice of a pending action against them. Be prepared to make the claim though as they'll bluff and bluster through it.


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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 21 Feb 2017 - 13:51
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Defnce: assuming you acknowledged then you have 33 days from the date of issue

Get any letters out the way NOW, and THEN IMMEEDIATELY get your defence sorted
That is not optional. COUNTERclaims are optional.
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AnEmptyShelf
post Sat, 25 Feb 2017 - 10:24
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Quick update guys,

So Ive had a response from the managing agent regarding my email above, as expected they are not willing to get involved.

Dear ***

Thank you for your e-mail.

Taking each paragraph of your e-mail in turn:-

1. You have a right to use the car parking space this is contained within your lease. You do not own the car parking space.
2. Crest Nicholson as the landowner have the right in the lease to introduce estate regulations. Previous e-mails refer. Shakespeare Martineau Property Asset Management as the appointed agent for Crest Nicholson were instructed by Crest Nicholson, the landowner, to introduce the estate regulation as they have the right to do.
3. I do not intend to Google Tortuous Interference.
4. Please confirm where in the lease which says that you as a leaseholder must be consulted about the introduction of an estate regulation.
5. I will not be telling P& P Management to desist from placing any PCNs on your vehicle. If you do not display a current permit in accordance with the published and notified rules of the scheme then you will receive a PCN.
6. The contract between Crest Nicholson, our client, and P&P Management will not be provided to you. You are not a Director of either Company and therefore do not have the right to have sight of this contract.

I trust that the foregoing assists and should you be unsure as to your obligations under the lease then I would respectfully recommend that you take independent legal advice.




Im going to get my defence together this weekend....

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emanresu
post Sun, 26 Feb 2017 - 07:19
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Were you parked in your allocated space or in the common area such as road or visitor parking?.


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Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Daily Court List. See who is doing what and where here
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
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AnEmptyShelf
post Sun, 26 Feb 2017 - 10:31
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I was parked in the bay adjacent to mine, which is not occupied by any resident. Not my allocated one.
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emanresu
post Mon, 27 Feb 2017 - 06:03
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QUOTE
which is not occupied by any resident


That's going to be your problem so wouldn't mention that. It will likely be allocated to another owner for their exclusive use.

The generic lease you mentioned at the beginning looks like the Law Society one that most of the builders use on their new build. Going through the process now.

Spaces are either allocated by plot number to a plot for the plot owners exclusive use or allocated as visitor parking on very narrow terms. I think it says something like short term use. The Managing Agents are appointed to look after the site and you may even have been invited to a member of the committee that appointed them. The MA should be able to stop it if you hassle enough.

Technically the plot owner should be able to cancel too, but as that space is leased to them as well, the parking rights may be a bit obscure but it might be worth identifying whose space it was. If they agree that they do not mind you parking there, it won't be a killer to the claim but it will muddy the waters as the judge will have to look at all the rights the lease gives in detail.


--------------------
Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Daily Court List. See who is doing what and where here
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
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AnEmptyShelf
post Wed, 13 Sep 2017 - 11:33
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Hi all,

I know its been a while since my last comments on here but today was the court date for the first of three cases against myself/company.

The case was heard at Brentford County Court, and the claimant did not turn up.

Judge struck out the claim and awarded costs due to unreasonable conduct by the claimant which amounted to £415.

Very happy with the decision.

Will keep you posted on the next two in due course.

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cabbyman
post Wed, 13 Sep 2017 - 11:40
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Brilliant. Well done. Can you start a new topic in completed cases with a link back to this thread, please? smile.gif


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nosferatu1001
post Wed, 13 Sep 2017 - 14:10
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Nice!
If theyre all for the same type of claim, get onto the next courts judge and warn them off the claimants prior conduct.
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