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SIP NTK Received, Appeal
cpu2007
post Thu, 20 Oct 2016 - 15:16
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hi everyone

I hope someone can help me with this.

I have received an NTK from SIP for not appealing/paying for a parking charge notice.
This was given to me for not paying. This was paid by phone but because i paid by the phone service and was a bit late, I did it while going to work.
the paybyphone service was throwing a server error, I've tried a couple of times and it didn't work then I tried after half an hour and it worked and it worked.
However, when i returned I had the ticket.

Can I challenge this?

I didn't challenge the penalty charge notice and when I received the NTK they said I had no ground for appeal.
This is what I sent them:

QUOTE
Dear Sir or Madam,

This is my formal representation to SIP Parking Limited in regards to the Parking Charge Notice I have received for the following date: 19/10/2016
The Parking Charge Notice that I am appealing against is the following: ***

After receiving the Notice to Keeper (NTK) I have realised that the Parking Charge Notice you’re trying to enforce doesn’t comply with the protection of freedom act, therefore there is no keeper liability for the following reasons:

(a) The notice doesn’t specify the period of parking to which the charges relate.
(b) The outstanding tariff to which the charges relate,

Additionally, I would like to have photographic evidence showing where the car was parked and the period the Civil Enforcement Officer waited before issuing the ticket.


I look forward to hearing from you soon.

Yours faithfully

Their reply:
QUOTE
Dear Sir,

Please be advised, you have no ability to appeal, we have considered your email on the basis of extenuating circumstances and find no grounds to cancel the charge based on the points raised.

We suggest that you re-read the notice to keeper provided, within the documentation you will find the information you state is not enclosed.

No photographic evidence relevant with the keeper, the PCN will continue its normal recovery action.

Kind regards


What should I do ?

Thanks


PS:

I've attached the nTK document too.









This post has been edited by cpu2007: Thu, 20 Oct 2016 - 15:23
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cpu2007
post Tue, 12 Sep 2017 - 10:57
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Thank you, sorry I know I have been on this case for a long time but sometime it's hard to remember what exactly is needed
I have drafted this letter, which in my opinion it's witness statement
Please let me know if it needs changing.

QUOTE
SIP PARKING (Claimant)
v
******** (defendant)
Claim no:

Witness statement of Mr *******, defendant

1. I am the Defendant in this matter, I am unrepresented, with no experience of Court procedures. If I do not set out documents in the way that the Claimant may do, I trust the Court will excuse my inexperience.
In this Witness statement, the facts and matters stated are true and within my own knowledge, except where indicated otherwise.

2. On the 11th of August the defendant parked the vehicle on a private car parking off Mason street Manchester.

3. The private parking offers different payment methods and the defendant chose to use the online “paybyphone” method as this was the most
convenient for him as well as being one of the primary reasons for choosing that specific car park (no need to carry change).

4. When the defendant attempted to make the payment through the “paybyphone” website, the last stage of the payment was unsuccessful and the
website returned with an error “Server error”.

5. Coming from a technology background, the defendant understood that the error could be caused by multiple reasons but these are all related to
the “paybyphone” website not responding properly rather than it being an issue with the claimant’s smartphone or credit card.

6. This is also backed up by the fact that the defendant has used the website on multiple occasions and the same smartphone as well as credit card
was used to purchase these parking tickets.

7. However, the claimant decided to make another attempt after a couple of minutes, went through the process of submitting the registration
number of the vehicle, length of the stay and pin number of the credit card. Despite the second attempt, the response was unchanged.

8. The defendant was getting late and decided to walk towards his destination and attempt to make the payment after a while, hoping that the
“server error” would be solved.

9. The defendant does not remember how many more attempts were made afterwards but eventually the payment went through and a ticket was
purchased.

10. Despite the payment, the claimant decides to pursue the defendant for not displaying a ticket, which is what the defendant understands by the
look of the poorly written particular of claims by Gladstones (claimant’s representative).

11. The defendant managed to retrieve a bank statement from August 2016, which shows payment was made on the 11th of August 2016.

12. The defendant would like to bring to the judge’s attention that:

13. This matter refers to an apparent contravention occurred over a year ago and that the claimant has unnecessarily lengthen a case that could have
been solved easily simply by checking their accounting records (showing they received a payment).

14. Had the defendant not had paid online; he might not have had tangible evidences to prove his innocence because of the time elapsed since the
date of this apparent contravention.

15. The defendant is not liable not and it was not liable then, but this unwarranted harassment and baseless litigation has caused significant alarm
and distress to the defendant.

16. The defendant, strongly believes, this matter should be heard in court so that the defendant can question the claimant on the witness statement.

17. The defendant attempted to rectify this matter with the claimant without involving the court, but the claimant has shown no interest in that,
suggesting that he/she/they are more than happy to waste judge’s time.

18. Therefore it is believed that attempting to reason with the claimant’s on paper will be futile.

19. According to Civil Procedure Rules:
3.6A a party against whom judgment has been entered under rule 3.5 applies to set the judgment aside;
i. if the defendant is an individual, the defendant’s home court;

20. Therefore, the defendant requests this case to be dealt in the defendant’s home court.

Kind regards
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 12 Sep 2017 - 12:35
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I ask again


Why are you writing a Witness Statement now?

You are writing a covering letter to the court requesting that the claim is held in person, at your local court, and why. Thats it. Thats all you need right now.

what you wrote definitely stsrts off as a WS, but then segues into a requets for a hearing in person. Its waaaaaaay too long if its meant to be the request for a hearing in person, and doesnt set itself up as that - as the covering letter is NOT A WITNESS STATEMENT.
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cpu2007
post Tue, 12 Sep 2017 - 12:49
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Would this be ok?

QUOTE
To whom it may concerns:
1. The purpose of this letter is to provide a brief explanation as to why I, the defendant, believe this case should go to court hearing.

2. The defendant wishes to talk to the witness about expected issues with their witness statement.

3. The defendant attempted to rectify this matter with the claimant without involving the court, but the claimant has shown no interest in that, suggesting that he/she/they are more than happy to waste judge’s time.

4. According to Civil Procedure Rules:
i. 3.6A a party against whom judgment has been entered under rule 3.5 applies to set the judgment aside;
1. if the defendant is an individual, the defendant’s home court;

Therefore, the defendant requests this case to be dealt in the defendant’s home court.
Kind regards
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 12 Sep 2017 - 12:59
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Its still poor, hence why I asked you to search.

The Defendant has been informed that the Claimant has proposed a hearing on the papers because it considers the matter to be relatively straightforward.
The Claimant also requests to transfer the hearing to the claimants local court if the Defendant does not consent.

The Defendant objects strongly to these proposals.

The Defendant denies that the matter is relatively straightforward.

The issues in dispute include .............................................
As a litigant in person, the defendant would be seriously disadvantaged against the claimant, a parking company that has employed its trade association's solicitor to prepare its documents.
The defendant will probably also wish to question the claimant regarding its witness statement and other documents.
The defendant will in particular wish to verify that .............

The defendant therefore requests that the matter is transferred to his local court in accordance with the Civil Procedure Rules when the defendant is a consumer.


yes, this is for when the PPC have requested it, but adapating it to fit is the work of minutes.

This post has been edited by nosferatu1001: Tue, 12 Sep 2017 - 12:59
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cpu2007
post Tue, 12 Sep 2017 - 13:12
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sorry but when I looked at the post 2 of mse newbies, I saw witness statements and started reading about that, there was no sign of covering letters.

I feel like your last post includes everything I need in a covering letter, so the only thing to adapt is
"the issues in disputes include".... tell them why I believe this should go to court right?

QUOTE
The Defendant has been informed that the Claimant has proposed a hearing on the papers because it considers the matter to be relatively straightforward.
The Claimant also requests to transfer the hearing to the claimant’s local court if the Defendant does not consent.

The Defendant objects strongly to these proposals.

The Defendant denies that the matter is relatively straightforward.

The issues in dispute include unclear Particulars of Claim and total lack of acknowledgement regarding originals or copies of any evidence or proof of the alleged charge.
As a litigant in person, the defendant would be seriously disadvantaged against the claimant, a parking company that has employed its trade association's solicitor to prepare its documents.
The defendant will probably also wish to question the claimant regarding its witness statement and other documents.
The defendant will in particular wish to verify that evidence of the alleged breach and required documents with statutory wording under The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 have been served to the Defendant.
The defendant therefore requests that the matter is transferred to his local court in accordance with the Civil Procedure Rules when the defendant is a consumer.

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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 12 Sep 2017 - 13:24
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You asked what a WS was. I pointed you to where you could find out about WS (post 2)

I then said, in an entirely new subject in a new para, that we need your response to the hearing on paper issue. Which is not a WS, I never said it was a WS, I said it was a letter. I even pointed you at the phrases to look for in your research on "special directions" because i KNOW theyre easily found, and can be adapted in seconds.

YOU are the one who talked about writing a WS, when you dont even have a hearing date yet!

Yes, the "..." was for you to fill out specifics.

I cant recall the specifics, so only include the line around POFA documents if you are using lack of POFA compliance i..e the driver hasnt been identified to the parking company.
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cpu2007
post Tue, 12 Sep 2017 - 13:48
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Thank you I will send the covering letter to the court as well as to gladstones via email, let's see what happens next.
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cpu2007
post Tue, 28 Nov 2017 - 15:13
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I have received the witness statement from SIP parking



What action do I need to take now?

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emanresu
post Tue, 28 Nov 2017 - 16:02
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There are 3 SIP car parks in Mason Street and an Euro Car Parks one. Which was it?

Have you prepared a WS as suggested a couple of months ago and when do you have to send yours in.

This post has been edited by emanresu: Tue, 28 Nov 2017 - 16:03


--------------------
Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Daily Court List. See who is doing what and where here
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
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ostell
post Tue, 28 Nov 2017 - 16:21
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That is absolute rubbish. You point out that as payments are allowed to be made by phone then there can be no ticket to display.

9 is rubbish

10 Beavis established that there was a need to maintain a turnover of vehicles in the free car park and hence the penalty rule could be set aside. This ruling only applied to this particular set of circumstances and the driver admitted that he overstayed. This is a paid for carpark and the penalty rule still applies

12 Elliot v Loake did not make the assumption that the keeper was the driver. The keeper was found to be the driver on the basis, amongst other things, or the forensic evidence produced. Perhaps SIP can produce the required forensic evidence.

13 This statement is true if all the conditions in the remainder of the paragraph have been met. This is an attempt to blind the court.

15 There is no requirement under the act to identify the driver. This is another attempt to mislead the court. paragraph 5 (2) has nothing to do with the keeper being required to name the driver.

16 This is irrelevant as there was no attempt to use the ticket machine, simply the pay by phone application.

17 When the failure of the phone app was found the defendant was away from the site and therefore the number was not available.

18 Again payment attempted to pay by phone and hence not at location and unable to leave.

20 The defendant attempted to pay by phone but a failure of the claimants equipment meant that this was not possible. With this failure of course there can be no record of any payment.

21 There was no charge due because of a failure of the claimants own equipment and therefore there can be no claim for damages. Was payment of the charge within 28 days a condition on the signage?


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emanresu
post Tue, 28 Nov 2017 - 16:47
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As above. Take their 4 pages and add Ostell's comments then on the day just go through them. Saves doing a WS (though one is recommended)


--------------------
Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Daily Court List. See who is doing what and where here
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
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cpu2007
post Tue, 28 Nov 2017 - 17:43
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Thank you so much @ostell, that's very exhaustive and I will look into each point and try to understand them before the date.

@emanresu, I was asked not to make a witness statement until I get the hearing date, I got the hearing date last month and then I called the court if I had to go to the court(as there was a fee to pay by the claimant to the court and in the letter it stated that it if it wasn't paid, the claim will struck out).
The staff told me the claimant paid for it and the date for the 18th of december is set.
However, I didn't see any deadline for the witness statement. Is this something I have to do by a specific date?
In your last comment,it seems like I can have one and not send it and just use it in court on the day.
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 28 Nov 2017 - 20:18
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Yes, absolutely it will have a date. It will be under the documents sections - usually 14 days before but possibly earlier. Read through it carefully - I suspect you skim read to ONLY look for the words witness statement. It will likely use documents, as that is ws plus any photos letters etc you wish to enter into evidence.

Check NOW

8) is rubbish. They’re claiming that instead of sending copy documents out at a cost of about £1 a defendant is expected to visit the site, which could be hundreds of miles away. Point out to the court that this is unreasonable, obstructive and utterly fails to meet gladstones duty to the court first, iveriding ibj3ctives of the cprs.
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SchoolRunMum
post Wed, 29 Nov 2017 - 21:53
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QUOTE
I was asked not to make a witness statement until I get the hearing date, I got the hearing date last month


That was the time to write your WS, when you got that date through, as the advice before already said.

The letter will have told you the date by which both parties MUST serve and exchange the evidence (that means the WS and evidence).
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cpu2007
post Thu, 30 Nov 2017 - 19:20
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THank you guys, I am making my witness statement, I will upload it tomorrow.
Just one question in the meantime.
You're saying that I need to provide WS and evidence, some of my evidences is bank statement showing money coming out of my card to pay for the ticket and a text message received stating that I purchased the ticket.
Now these are all photographic evidences.

In the WS of the claimant in the Paragraph 2, the claimant states they intend to rely on the photographs of the incident but they haven't supplied those .

My question is, if the claimant isn't showing any photographic evidence in the ws, should I show any in the WS?
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emanresu
post Fri, 1 Dec 2017 - 06:47
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QUOTE
n the WS of the claimant in the Paragraph 2, the claimant states they intend to rely on the photographs of the incident but they haven't supplied those .


It is quite likely the court's version has them.

You send your pics and in your WS point out that SIP appear to be sending two different WS as you were not sent pics though the court may have received it. Add in a costs schedule appended to the WS and your pics.

[These are the sorts of "administrative mistakes" that SIP use all the time to wrong foot people and you will likely get a last minute discontinuance so have your costs in with your WS so they can't duck it.]


--------------------
Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Daily Court List. See who is doing what and where here
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 1 Dec 2017 - 10:34
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Yes, you MUST include ALL evidence you rely upon. You CANNOT ambush at court. Thats the fast way to getting your evidence excluded.
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cpu2007
post Fri, 1 Dec 2017 - 14:36
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QUOTE
SIP PARKING (Claimant)
v
******** (defendant)
Claim no:

Witness statement of Mr *******, defendant

1. I am the Defendant in this matter, I am unrepresented, with no experience of Court procedures. If I do not set out documents in the way that the Claimant may do, I trust the Court will excuse my inexperience. 

2. On the 11th of August the defendant parked the vehicle on a private car parking off Mason street Manchester.

3. The private parking offers different payment methods and the defendant chose to use the online “paybyphone” method as this was the most 
convenient for him as well as being one of the primary reasons for choosing that specific car park (no need to carry change).

4. When the defendant attempted to make the payment through the “paybyphone” website, the last stage of the payment was unsuccessful and the 
website returned with an error “Server error”.

5. Coming from a technology background, the defendant understood that the error could be caused by multiple reasons but these are all related to 
the “paybyphone” website not responding properly rather than it being an issue with the claimant’s smartphone or credit card. 

6. This is also backed up by the fact that the defendant has used the website on multiple occasions and the same smartphone as well as credit card 
was used to purchase these parking tickets.

7. However, the defendant decided to make another attempt after a couple of minutes, went through the process of submitting the registration 
number of the vehicle, length of the stay and pin number of the credit card. Despite the second attempt, the response was unchanged.

8. The defendant was getting late and decided to walk towards his destination and attempt to make the payment after a while, hoping that the 
“server error” would be solved.

9. The defendant does not remember how many more attempts were made afterwards but eventually the payment went through and a ticket was 
purchased.

10. Despite the payment, the claimant decides to pursue the defendant for not displaying a ticket, which is what the defendant understands by the 
look of the poorly written particular of claims by Gladstones (claimant’s representative).

11. The defendant managed to retrieve a bank statement from August 2016, which shows payment was made to SIP Parking on the 11th of August 2016. (see fig1)

12. Furthermore, the defendant, decided to investigate this matter further and retrieved records of payments from “paybyphone” the method the claimants offers at their car park and the records show that in fact a payment was made on the 11th of August 2016. (see fig1)

12. The defendant would like to bring to the judge’s attention that:

13. This matter refers to an apparent contravention occurred over a year ago and that the claimant has unnecessarily lengthen a case that could have 
been solved easily simply by checking their accounting records (showing they received a payment).

14. Had the defendant not had paid online; he might not have had tangible evidences to prove his innocence because of the time elapsed since the 
date of this apparent contravention.

15. The defendant is not liable not and it was not liable then, but this unwarranted harassment and baseless litigation has caused significant alarm 
and distress to the defendant.

16. The defendant, strongly believes, this matter should be heard in court so that the defendant can question the claimant on the witness statement.

17. The defendant attempted to rectify this matter with the claimant without involving the court, but the claimant has shown no interest in that, 
suggesting that he/she/they are more than happy to waste judge’s time. 

18. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 10, Beavis established that there was a need to maintain a turnover of vehicles in the free car park and hence the penalty rule could be set aside. This ruling only applied to this particular set of circumstances and the driver admitted that he overstayed. This is a paid for carpark and the penalty rule still applies

19. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 12, Elliot v Loake did not make the assumption that the keeper was the driver. The keeper was found to be the driver on the basis, amongst other things, or the forensic evidence produced. Perhaps SIP can produce the required forensic evidence.

20. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 13, This statement is true if all the conditions in the remainder of the paragraph have been met. This is an attempt to blind the court.

21. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 15, There is no requirement under the act to identify the driver. This is another attempt to mislead the court. paragraph 5 (2) has nothing to do with the keeper being required to name the driver.

22. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 16, This is irrelevant as there was no attempt to use the ticket machine, simply the pay by phone application.

23. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 17, When the failure of the phone app was found the defendant was away from the site and therefore the number was not available.

24. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 18, payment attempted to pay by phone and hence not at location and unable to leave

25. In response to the claiman’ts witness statement, paragraph 20, The defendant attempted to pay by phone but a failure of the claimants equipment meant that this was not possible. With this failure of course there can be no record of any payment.

26. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 8, the claimant’s expectation is unreasonable, obstructive and utterly fails to meet gladstones duty to the court.

27. In response to the claimant’s witness statement, paragraph 2, the claimant’s appeart to be sending different witness statement as the defendant has not received any photographic evidence of the incident, which the court might have received.

In this Witness statement, the facts and matters stated are true and within my own knowledge, except where indicated otherwise. 

Kind regards


This is my WS, you mentioned the cost schedule but I'm not sure what that is and/means.
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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 1 Dec 2017 - 14:54
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A listing of your costs to date.
Normal costs are those on the day of hearing, so how much you’d claim for lost earnings or leave, capped at £95
Mileage to from court at the normal rate per mile
Parking costs at court.

If you can show they have behaved unreasonably then £19 per hour for time spent so far, research writing defence etc. You need to read cpr 27.14 and the Denton case to understand how to show unreasonable behaviour.
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cpu2007
post Fri, 1 Dec 2017 - 15:03
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what details do I need to provide for the lost of earnings? payslips?
I will look at the denton case and 27.14 for the unreasonable costs as well as time spent on this case as it's been over a year, thanks
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