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[NIP Wizard] 9 points, possible 3 more
Emslice
post Wed, 25 Jul 2018 - 17:21
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NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? -
Date of the offence: - June 2018
Date of the NIP: - 28 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 29 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - Queenswood drive,Leeds BET QUEENSWOOD GARDENS & 229 QUEENSWOOD DRIVE, UNITED KINGDOM
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - Not known
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? - Work van, via hire company
How many current points do you have? - 9
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons -

NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - Yes
Did the first NIP arrive within 14 days? - No
Was there a valid reason for the NIP's late arrival? - Unsure
Although you are the Registered Keeper, were you also the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v3.3.2: Wed, 25 Jul 2018 17:16:32 +0000

A quick edit I’m Not the registed keeper, itnis a works van via a hire company,
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post Wed, 25 Jul 2018 - 17:21
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Emslice
post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 16:50
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Not checked but online licence would only show current points, not offences which I took speed awarnese course
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notmeatloaf
post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 19:36
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It is 99.9% certain they have checked the NDORS database and have the correct dates, they get a cut if you take a course so have incentive to offer one.

With your EH you are looking at it the wrong way. The court will be aware that many people lose their job and thus income as a result of a ban as most people especially in well paying jobs drive to work.

You need to focus almost entirely on the impact that will have on your family and, if it will be difficult to replace you, on your employer.

It might be worth thinking carefully because anecdotally about 75% of EH pleas don't succeed. You will be quizzed about it by the magistrates so be prepared not least for the inevitable "if your licence is so valuable to you why did you continue speeding".

Posters here include a judge so it could be worth your while posting a draft for critique
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The Rookie
post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 19:56
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QUOTE (notmeatloaf @ Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 20:36) *
anecdotally about 75% of EH pleas don't succeed.

Where do you get that from?


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
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Council PCN's
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Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

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southpaw82
post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 21:28
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 20:56) *
QUOTE (notmeatloaf @ Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 20:36) *
anecdotally about 75% of EH pleas don't succeed.

Where do you get that from?

The inverse of your oft repeated suggestion that 25% are successful? Like this. And this. And this.


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Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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The Rookie
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 05:56
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Indeed, but the number who try and fail is not the opposite of the number who succeed as it assumes everybody tries an EH plea which I think is unlikley?

For example If only 50% of totters try and make an EH plea then the number who try and fail is circa 50%.


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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NewJudge
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 08:02
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 06:56) *
Indeed, but the number who try and fail is not the opposite of the number who succeed as it assumes everybody tries an EH plea which I think is unlikley?

For example If only 50% of totters try and make an EH plea then the number who try and fail is circa 50%.

But it is the reciprocal of those who try and succeed. You said 25% of EH pleas are successful. NML said 75% of such pleas fail. You both mentioned "pleas". Neither of you mentioned "totters".
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southpaw82
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:29
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What he said.


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Moderator

Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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The Rookie
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:31
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No I said that 25% of totters make a successful EH plea, I've always tried to make that quite clear (admittedly didn't in one of those three links), that's not 25% of applicants, we have never had that data.

Seeing as how it was originally my calculation (and nothing anecdotal), I do know what it referred to.

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:59


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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Emslice
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:49
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Spoke to the ticket office, i wasn’t offered speed awareness course as I sat the course on 4 of July 2015 and my offence was 26 of June 2018, they are using the course date as the 3 year marker not the offence it was for
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Jlc
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 11:31
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QUOTE (Emslice @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 11:49) *
Spoke to the ticket office, i wasn’t offered speed awareness course as I sat the course on 4 of July 2015 and my offence was 26 of June 2018, they are using the course date as the 3 year marker not the offence it was for

You may wish to discuss this with them.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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Emslice
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:22
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I will thank you, I am trying to phone them but line aslways busy, do every police force follow these rules or does West Yorkshire have there own
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Jlc
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:31
Post #32


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NDORS is the national scheme - they should follow the guidelines. But ultimately there's no absolute right to a course.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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thisisntme
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:31
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 11:31) *
No I said that 25% of totters make a successful EH plea, I've always tried to make that quite clear (admittedly didn't in one of those three links), that's not 25% of applicants, we have never had that data.

Seeing as how it was originally my calculation (and nothing anecdotal), I do know what it referred to.


Unfortunately my post quoting your post stating pleas is no longer there. You definitely did say pleas, and NML has said pleas throughout.


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I reserve the right to be wrong.
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Emslice
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:38
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 13:31) *
NDORS is the national scheme - they should follow the guidelines. But ultimately there's no absolute right to a course.


Ye I know that, Just making sure they follow them guidelines as if there stating that as the reason then I can challenge why here using that as a reason as it’s not in there guidelines
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Emslice
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:52
Post #35


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Good news Finally got through to the ticket office again, and they have made a mistake, they looked at course date rather then offence date and are now offering me a course rather then a court date, thanks for everyone’s help
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The Rookie
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:56
Post #36


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From: Warwickshire
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QUOTE (thisisntme @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 13:31) *
Unfortunately my post quoting your post stating pleas is no longer there. You definitely did say pleas, and NML has said pleas throughout.

I did the original calculation so know what it referred to. Circa 25% of totters make a successful EH plea, unless EVERY totter makes an EH plea the failure rate is less than 75%.


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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Jlc
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 13:17
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QUOTE (Emslice @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 13:52) *
Good news Finally got through to the ticket office again, and they have made a mistake, they looked at course date rather then offence date and are now offering me a course rather then a court date, thanks for everyone’s help

icon_thumleft.gif Drive carefully now.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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Logician
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 16:08
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The Rookie and I have discussed these numbers in the past, my calculations gave more like 11% of totters making a successful EH plea, but given the figures are simply not available and have to be derived unreliably from elsewhere it is not possible to be definitive.


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