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Parking charge notice
jedi134
post Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 09:39
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A driver parked a car with a disabled occupant with a valid blue badge, in a free car park disabled bay at a shopping center. But forgot to display their badges, and unfortunately got a PNC asking for £80 or if paid within 14 days £45.

Where do they stand with this?

Parking company I presume are private, Horizon Parking.co.uk

Thanks

This post has been edited by jedi134: Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 11:02
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post Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 09:39
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kommando
post Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 09:43
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NA

This post has been edited by kommando: Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 11:27
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ostell
post Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 10:19
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In the first instance go into the shop and complain to the manager, not the help desk, the manager.
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jedi134
post Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 11:04
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Ok thanks will try this 1st
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cabbyman
post Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 17:38
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BUT........... Have a read and see how you should compose an initial appeal to Horizon. This needs to be in parallel to your complaint to the store. Do not lose sight of Horizon's arbitrary deadlines. If the store drag their feet, you don't want to give Horizon an excuse to get the upper hand.


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hexaflexagon
post Sun, 1 Oct 2017 - 21:24
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As always with these things, and after a request to the organisation (especially a shop) that they instruct the PPC to cancel the PCN, the starting point for any sort of defence is the signage.

Please upload pictures so that we can understand the situation.
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jedi134
post Mon, 2 Oct 2017 - 10:11
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Will get photo of signage asap... What should be said to the shop keeper? Forgot to display badges, can you cancel for me?
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ostell
post Mon, 2 Oct 2017 - 10:33
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Exactly that. You could talk about liabilities unde the discrimination (?) Act that could be criminal but that may be a bit too much. If the driver was a regular customer then I don't see a problem.
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cabbyman
post Mon, 2 Oct 2017 - 10:38
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Equalities Act. Once they are aware they must make reasonable adjustments. They should require the PPC, their agent, to cancel. Try and get confirmation of their demand confirmed to you in writing.



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nosferatu1001
post Mon, 2 Oct 2017 - 10:59
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Equality Act 2010.
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jedi134
post Mon, 2 Oct 2017 - 18:45
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So.... Manager was not willing to help,said nothing they can do, was refered to customer service, who again said nothing they can do, and gave contact details for Horizon Parking and said contact them.

So I presume I have to appeal to Horizon Parking? Is there a template letter for forgetting to dispaly blue badges?


[attachment=51088:20171002_122959.jpg]

This post has been edited by jedi134: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 - 18:58
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nosferatu1001
post Mon, 2 Oct 2017 - 21:49
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No
There’s the template BPA appeal on MSE forum NEWBIES thread.
Sibmit at 9am tomorrow, see if you beat the 2hour record for cancellation.
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jedi134
post Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 04:45
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Sorry i dont quite understand, on what grounds should I appeal?

And is this the mse thread you speak off


Clicky Here!

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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 05:41
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There’s a template appeal for BPA members in that thread. Appeal using that template. Blue one.

If Horizon cancel within two hours you beat the current record.

And don’t go back there. Clearly they dint care about you as a customer, so why give them money? Remember your blue badge has NO meaning on private land, it’s only what the signs say.
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jedi134
post Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 08:21
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This template letter?

"Dear Sirs

Re: PCN No. ....................

I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car.

I believe that your signs fail the test of 'large lettering' and prominence, as established in ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis. Your unremarkable and obscure signs were not seen by the driver, are in very small print and the terms are not readable to drivers.

There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. You must either rely on the POFA 2012 and offer me a POPLA code, or cancel the charge.

Should you obtain the registered keeper's data from the DVLA without reasonable cause, please take this as formal notice that I reserve the right to sue your company and the landowner/principal, for a sum not less than £250 for any Data Protection Act breach. Your aggressive business practice and unwarranted threat of court for the ordinary matter of a driver using my car without causing any obstruction nor offence, has caused significant distress to me.

I do not give you consent to process data relating to me or this vehicle. I deny liability for any sum at all and you must consider this letter a Section 10 Notice under the DPA. You are required to respond within 21 days. I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and look forward to your reply.

Yours faithfully,"



THE NAME AND ADDRESS OF THE KEEPER GOES HERE. THE DRIVER IS NOT IDENTIFIED.

NO NEED TO USE YOUR REAL SIGNATURE - BUT DON'T POST UNLESS YOU HAVE TO - ALWAYS USE THE ONLINE APPEAL PAGE BECAUSE THE APPEAL CANNOT GET LOST AND YOU CAN KEEP A SCREEN PRINT. USE ANY EMAIL APPEAL OPTION IF FIRMS OFFER IT.



You can add to the template above, 'in order to resolve the dispute I attach copies of...': the driver's receipts/bank transactions (or Hospital Appointment/Hotel booking, etc.) that day as 'they' were a genuine customer/patient, etc. You can add to the template above, 'in order to resolve the dispute I attach copies of...': the driver's receipts/bank transactions (or Hospital Appointment/Hotel booking, etc.) that day as 'they' were a genuine customer/patient, etc.


What do you mean by the blue badge has meanings on private land? Is this a easy win appeal?

This post has been edited by jedi134: Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 08:27
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hexaflexagon
post Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 09:03
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QUOTE (jedi134 @ Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 09:21) *
This template letter?

[color="#0000FF"][b]"Dear Sirs

Re: PCN No. ....................

I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car.


I believe that's the one that was suggested. You should perhaps modify slightly the 2nd sentence/paragraph to reflect more accurately the spot where you parked.

I believe that your signs fail the test of 'large lettering' and prominence, as established in ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis. Your unremarkable and obscure signs were not seen by the driver, are in very small print and the terms are not readable to drivers. The prominent large standard disabled sign says 'Disabled badge holders only' - there are no conditions mentioned in that sign and I am a holder of a disabled badge.
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 11:58
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Horizon have been cancel;ling quickly on seeing that template. Not g'teed

No appeal is usually £easy". Parking companies make their money from tickets and nothing else , so they have NO usual incentive to cancel on appeal.

I meant example what i said; Blue Badges, as your hand book explicitly tells you, mean NOTHING on private land. The only thing that matters on private land is what the signs say you need to do, and whether those signs can be found and read.
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jedi134
post Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 14:05
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So the signage is wrong is it? That is grounds to appeal is it? Why do the others have a red cross through them?


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cabbyman
post Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 14:56
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You are trying to overthink this. Send that letter as suggested.


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jedi134
post Tue, 3 Oct 2017 - 16:40
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I dont know? Im scarred, Confused....I surpose unsure.gif confused1.gif

will this surfice:



"Dear Sirs

Re: PCN No. xxx

I challenge this 'PCN' as keeper of the car.


I believe that your signs fail the test of 'large lettering' and prominence, as established in ParkingEye Ltd v Beavis. Your unremarkable and obscure signs were not seen by the driver, are in very small print and the terms are not readable to drivers. The prominent large standard disabled sign says 'Disabled badge holders only' - there are no conditions mentioned in that sign and I am a holder of a disabled badge.
There will be no admissions as to who was driving and no assumptions can be drawn. You must either rely on the POFA 2012 and offer me a POPLA code, or cancel the charge.

Should you obtain the registered keeper's data from the DVLA without reasonable cause, please take this as formal notice that I reserve the right to sue your company and the landowner/principal, for a sum not less than £250 for any Data Protection Act breach. Your aggressive business practice and unwarranted threat of court for the ordinary matter of a driver using my car without causing any obstruction nor offence, has caused significant distress to me.

I do not give you consent to process data relating to me or this vehicle. I deny liability for any sum at all and you must consider this letter a Section 10 Notice under the DPA. You are required to respond within 21 days. I have kept proof of submission of this appeal and look forward to your reply.

Yours faithfully," Mr/Mrs/Other X
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