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care parking - Peel Centre Stockport, Parking charge Notice ex care parking - hire car
DaveJunction
post Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 12:45
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This notice arrived on the Sat 7th Sept. It seems the driver overstayed their welcome, by 19 mins, when doing some shopping at the Peel Centre in Stockport. The driver didn't see any signs on entry and there was no payment barrier on exit. The driver now believes it likely that there was only one hour free parking.

The vehicle was hired and it looks like the hire company did a 'Transfer Of Liability' to the hirer. So at least now the hire company can no longer just pay it and charge it to the hirer's credit card?

How should this be dealt with? Nobody wants any comeback hiring a car in the future.

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This post has been edited by DaveJunction: Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 12:25
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post Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 12:45
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ostell
post Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 12:59
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Edit so that the identity of the driver cannot be inferred. Use "the driver........." etc

I presume that with the notice you did not receive a copy of the hire agreement nor a copy of the original NTK to the hire company. If this is true then you send

Sirs

Ref PCN xxxxx VRM yyyyyy

I am the hirer/keeper of the above vehicle and am in receipt of the PCN you issued. I have no liability on this matter as you have failed to meet the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to supply the additional documents mandated by section 14 (2) (a) of the Act. You cannot therefore transfer liability from the driver at the time to me, the hirer keeper..

There is no legal requirement to identify the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.

Any further communication with me on this matter, apart from confirmation of no further action and my details being removed from your records, will be considered vexatious and harassment. This includes communication from any Debt Collection companies you care to instruct.

Yours etc.


Send first class with free certificate of posting from any post office. Send so that it arrives on day 19. This is so that they cannot reissue the notice correctly within the relevant period

This post has been edited by ostell: Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 14:00
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DaveJunction
post Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 14:00
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Edited as per your suggestion. Thanks,
'Limit for appealing'. Is that 28 days from when it was actually received? Or from when it should have been received?
No there was nothing else in the envelope.
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ostell
post Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 14:02
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If you read the notice it says 21 days. I've modified my post

The parking company will probably charge a admin fee. Check the contract to see if they are allowed to. This is not a fine ir a penalty

This post has been edited by ostell: Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 14:04
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DaveJunction
post Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 17:18
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On the front in paragraph 3 we have "after the period of 21 days beginning with the day after that on which this notice is given - etc" This is to do with payment.

On the back we have a section. "Contesting This Parking Charge". This says to write "within 28 days of receiving this letter".

So how to work out day 19 of 21? Or should it be day 26 of 28?
What's the day the notice was given? Is it the date of the notice? Two working days after date of posting? Or actual date of service?

And check the contract how? Do you mean check the car-park signs? If the latter it can't be done from here, nobody took pictures of the signs as nobody know about the parking charge notice.

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ostell
post Fri, 20 Sep 2019 - 20:39
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The relevant period is 21 days. Normally after 21 days they can hold the keeper liable. Spot the incorrect wording

So 19
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DaveJunction
post Wed, 25 Sep 2019 - 15:18
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We still don't understand when is day one of the 21 period or of the 28 day period?
So we're going to post the letter today unless that's a bad idea?
Thanks



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nosferatu1001
post Wed, 25 Sep 2019 - 15:27
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You have two periods

21 days is when they can hold the hirer liable
28 days is the limit for them accpeting an appeal submission
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DaveJunction
post Wed, 25 Sep 2019 - 15:38
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QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Wed, 25 Sep 2019 - 16:27) *
You have two periods

21 days is when they can hold the hirer liable
28 days is the limit for them accpeting an appeal submission

That's well understood.
However which day is day one (of the relevant periods)?
Is it perhaps the day of issue of the notice?
And it couldn't have been posted on the day of issue, 3rd Sep, as the website tell us that it was issued after 9pm on the 3rd.
So maybe day one is the 4th?
Or is it the day of service, which is Saturday the 7th?
Or what?

Thanks

This post has been edited by DaveJunction: Wed, 25 Sep 2019 - 15:46
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nosferatu1001
post Wed, 25 Sep 2019 - 15:46
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Saturday is not a day of service. Working days only

21 days begins the day after the notice is GIVEN ie served , under POFA
(Its 28 days for a normal NtK)

Their appeal period isnt given in law, of course, so the obvious thing to do si make sure it arrives after the 21 but before the 28
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DaveJunction
post Mon, 18 Nov 2019 - 14:03
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What to do now?

Posted a letter on Wed 25th Sep, 1st class. Contained member ostell's text as posted above. Received the below response. Postmarked 25th Oct. Apologies for the delay in postit up on the forum.

The letter states that "Care Parking have not issued this Notice to Keeper using POFA 2012, therefore your claims regarding this are irrelevant".

Presumably an appeal to POPLA needs to be submitted asap? By whom and on what grounds?

Also we're not sure why the fee was not paid in the first It might be that the signs at the entrance were not clear, or it might be that an attempt was made to pay but the VRM incorrectly entered. It's impossible to tell. This was a hire car after all.

And it seems that others are falling foul of the system. Please see this news article.

Page 1
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This post has been edited by DaveJunction: Mon, 18 Nov 2019 - 14:19
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 19 Nov 2019 - 11:34
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By the hirer , obviously.
You have maybe a week left

On the grounds of POFA not being used meaning the hirer has no liability. Theyve even told you. About as easy as possible to win, as the ONLY legislation they jhave to hold YOU, the HIRER liable, theyve admitted theyre not using. EASY!
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