Statutory Declaration, Split from hijacked thread Options

[watermelona]

Hello everyone

I post here as my case is similar to the one listed by emptyhead

I need your precious help for this matter.
My bf got a sum retained from his pay slip. When asking the employer he found out that he was convicted in his absence of speeding offence.( which took place in April 2014)
He did a stat dec in front of the Magistrates and the Legal Advisor present there, which was accepted. ( it was within 21days)
In the same session ( the stat dec) he was imposed a new date for the trial by the Legal Advisor present there. ( the trial was relisted)
My bf insisted that this is not legal under Section 127 of the Magistrates Courts Act 1980, which says that a summons can't be made alive if
6 months have passed since the offence took place , and also stating that the stat dec voids all the proceedings ( fines, summons).

The Legal Advisor which should have been impartial told him that "under the law she can relist a trial and that the stat dec cancels the time limitation". wanted to enter no plea in order to receive a
new summons as he didn't receive any and seek for legal advice.

IS THIS LEGAL???
Normally from what I know and read the stat dec should have voided everything, and then it was to CPS to prosecute or not.
More than that he got a copy of the summons when exiting the court room, which contains only one page ( where it says the Offence)...

I feel that his rights were not respected by the Legal Advisor present there when making the stat dec, and that she was there more to prosecute than to make the stat dec.

Any advice is more than welcome as his hearing date is very close.


Thank you

This post has been edited by watermelona: Thu, 18 Jun 2015 - 17:43

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[johnjo42]

Your boyfriend is wrong. It's not a new summons but a reopening of the case and relisting of the old one.

If your boyfriend still thinks he's right, please ask him to state the legal authority for his belief.

JJ

[peterguk]

Hello everyone

I post here as my case is similar to the one listed by emptyhead

But since it isn't the same case, it should be in a thread of its own.

A Mod will move.

Hello everyone

I post here as my case is similar to the one listed by emptyhead

I need your precious help for this matter.
My bf got 500£ retained from his pay slip. When asking the employer he found out that he was convicted in his absence of speeding offence.( which took place in April 2014)
He did a stat dec in front of the Magistrates and the Legal Advisor present there, which was accepted. ( it was within 21days)
In the same session ( the stat dec) he was imposed a new date for the trial by the Legal Advisor present there. ( the trial was relisted)
My bf insisted that this is not legal under Section 127 of the Magistrates Courts Act 1980, which says that a summons can't be made alive if
6 months have passed since the offence took place , and also stating that the stat dec voids all the proceedings ( fines, summons).

The Legal Advisor which should have been impartial told him that "under the law she can relist a trial and that the stat dec cancels the time limitation".
When he was asked how he pleaded he said he wanted to enter no plea, and again the "Legal Advisor" present there told him that
" she can't allow him to enter no plea and he has to plea either guilty or not guilty". He then again said that he wanted to enter no plea in order to receive a
new summons as he didn't receive any and seek for legal advice.

The Legal Advisor refused again and again and finally made herself a not guilty plea on his behalf against his request and set a date for a new hearing.

IS THIS LEGAL???
Normally from what I know and read the stat dec should have voided everything, and then it was to CPS to prosecute or not.
More than that he got a copy of the summons when exiting the court room, which contains only one page ( where it says the Offence)...

I feel that his rights were not respected by the Legal Advisor present there when making the stat dec, and that she was there more to prosecute than to make the stat dec.

Any advice is more than welcome as his hearing date is very close.


Thank you

A stat dec simply returns the proceeding to the summons stage. CPS can re-issue the summons, and new trial date can be set.

[The Rookie]

Although this appears to be yet another SD treated as a plea to reopen the case and not as a true SD where the prosecution have to make a decision to reopen the case by re sending the summons, maybe you BF would have been better of focusing on that (correct) legal argument.

[watermelona]

Hello everyone

Thank you for your replies.

I want to add the fact that he did his Stat Dec at another Magistrate Court( as the initial one was to far from us to go).
Secondly the CPS wasn't present the day he made the Stat Dec only this Legal Advisor.

Although this appears to be yet another SD treated as a plea to reopen the case and not as a true SD where the prosecution have to make a decision to reopen the case by re sending the summons, maybe you BF would have been better of focusing on that (correct) legal argument

The Rookie, what can he do now since the Legal Advidor set the trial date? ( he knows he was right but I need your help to prove it)
Also Under what law she had the right to refuse his 'no plea' and deciding on his behalf to plead 'not guilty'?
He stated that argument many times , but not only she refused it she got nervous and told him' I repeat the 4th time, I can relist the trial and that the stat dec kills the time limitation so I can relist it'.
And she set a new date for the trial. What could he do? And what can he do now?

Isnt't this ILLEGAL what she did? And if so what can we do to have this "relisting" cancelled?
He doesn't want to avoid a trial, but he wants that the CPS decide wheter or not to prosecute.

A stat dec simply returns the proceeding to the summons stage. CPS can re-issue the summons, and new trial date can be set.

peteruk the trial date was set by the Magistrates (Legal Advisor' indications) the same day he made his stat dec

She gave him a date and an hour of the trial, at the initial Court , wihtout him accepting it, as he wanted to enter 'no plea'
I am a little bit lost, about wheter the copy of the summons serves as a new summons, or he is in his rights to make a complaint to the Court Manager and Legal Ombudsman about her actions ( refusing his 'no plea' and relisting the case)?

But since it isn't the same case, it should be in a thread of its own.

A Mod will move

Thx...Please let me know where it's moved

Your boyfriend is wrong. It's not a new summons but a reopening of the case and relisting of the old one.

If your boyfriend still thinks he's right, please ask him to state the legal authority for his belief.

JJ

My questions are:
1. Were the Legal Advisor's action of relisting the case and refusing his action to enter 'no plea' , LEGAL?
2.If not what can he do now since the hearing date is set?
3. Should he prepare himself for the hearing as a normal case, or write to the Court treating the case that he didn't receive any summons?
4. What should he do? ..he is not guilty of the alleged offence


I am desperate as he doesn't know exactly where he stands


Thank you again for your indications

V

This post has been edited by watermelona: Thu, 18 Jun 2015 - 17:50

[Jlc]

Section 127 of the Magistrates Courts Act 1980...the offence took place in April, the trial was in September...and in June the case was reopen ( more than six months since April)

Don't get hung up on the 6 months. As long as the proceedings were initiated within the 6 months (it appears they were) then the limitation doesn't apply.

[The Rookie]

The LA's actions were wrong, the SD should rest the case to the point where proceedings have been started but not the summons served, the prosecution should then decide whether to re-issues the summons or not but they were what they were, there is little to be gained by making a big issue of them as even if overturned (and that will be a long and costly journey to do that) they are unlikely to have a material effect.

He needs to prepare himself for the first hearing, will he plead guilty or not guilty? If NG what will his defence be?

[watermelona]

The LA's actions were wrong, the SD should rest the case to the point where proceedings have been started but not the summons served, the prosecution should then decide whether to re-issues the summons or not but they were what they were, there is little to be gained by making a big issue of them as even if overturned (and that will be a long and costly journey to do that) they are unlikely to have a material effect.

He needs to prepare himself for the first hearing, will he plead guilty or not guilty? If NG what will his defence be?

He is not guilty...

Thank you

V

This post has been edited by watermelona: Thu, 18 Jun 2015 - 17:46

[Jlc]

He is not guilty...

in the copy of the summons he received he received also the witness statement of the police officer ( apparently it was only one) , my bf details and everything....
It says nothing about the radar the type and model used, just a declaration from the officer that he was driving with 44 in a 30mph zone.


he wants to plead not guilty, but wants to
1. see the photographic evidence as he can't remember the offence
2. see the calibration documents of the radar
3.I looked on the goggle maps and there is no sign to indicate the speed limit.

Steady.

Are you saying he was travelling under 30mph or are trying a defence based on misassumptions?

The mention of calibration (and make/model) sets alarm bells running and the limit was probably a restricted limit as designated by street lighting (where no signs are required).

This will be an expensive exercise unless he understands fully.

This post has been edited by Jlc: Wed, 17 Jun 2015 - 09:18

[TonyS]

What was the reason for the deduction from his pay?

[watermelona]

He is not guilty...

in the copy of the summons he received he received also the witness statement of the police officer ( apparently it was only one) , my bf details and everything....
It says nothing about the radar the type and model used, just a declaration from the officer that he was driving with 44 in a 30mph zone.


he wants to plead not guilty, but wants to
1. see the photographic evidence as he can't remember the offence
2. see the calibration documents of the radar
3.I looked on the goggle maps and there is no sign to indicate the speed limit.

Steady.

Are you saying he was travelling under 30mph or are trying a defence based on misassumptions?

The mention of calibration (and make/model) sets alarm bells running and the limit was probably a restricted limit as designated by street lighting (where no signs are required).

This will be an expensive exercise unless he understands fully.

What are the evidence required for the defence based on misassumptions? ( He wants to see the photographic evidence)
he wants also to know how the officer made the assumption, and also to know how he used the radar and what was the method to know that the speed was the one he said it was.

Regarding the signage, can you please give me the law that says it ( no sign required)?

Thanks

What was the reason for the deduction from his pay?

the money was taken ( stolen) without any warning
If he hadn't looked on the pay slip he would have never found out what happened

peterguk , The Rookie can you please advise on this furthermore?

I used the advice you gave on different posts which was very helpful.

I just want to add the fact that the Legal advisor told my bf" stop reading on the Internet"...

So I bet she is also on these forums trying to mislead other people and giving vague information.

About this case I am confident we will have a chance to win it and we will....as I feel that a lot of errors have been made...

Thank you all for your future help and advice ...I will keep you updated

This post has been edited by watermelona: Thu, 18 Jun 2015 - 17:47

[Jlc]

Regarding the signage, can you please give me the law that says it ( no sign required)?

Assuming there was street lighting...

Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984

This post has been edited by Jlc: Wed, 17 Jun 2015 - 09:45

[watermelona]

Regarding the signage, can you please give me the law that says it ( no sign required)?

Assuming there was street lighting...

Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984

Even if it would be that my bf he is not English...

[peterguk]

Regarding the signage, can you please give me the law that says it ( no sign required)?

Assuming there was street lighting...

Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984

Even if it would be that my bf he is not English...

And?

If he is driving on UK roads, it is his responsibilty to know the laws that govern driving - same for all road users.

If his defence is "there were no signs indicating 30 limit" and there were streetlights, then he has no defence.

This post has been edited by peterguk: Wed, 17 Jun 2015 - 10:01

[emsgeorge]

get boyfriend to stop and step back from this for a moment, and think about what can of worms he may be opening.

Is he saying there is no way he could of been over the speed limit, and therefore the police officer was wrong.

Or is he looking for some sort of 'get out of jail free' card on a technical defence, got from a friend down the pub ?

So the bad news:

If he pleads not guilty, and says 'his radar (PS they don't usually use radar these days, its laser) was defective', the prosecution will trot out an expert from the laser manufacturers, or a company called RSS, to the tune of about £2000. If your boyfriend looses, he pays the costs of the expert.

Then there's the prosecution / trial costs of about £700, and the fine itself.

So, before listening to his mates, or reading a bit up on the internet, he really needs to think how fast was he really going. Proving the device was wrong will be a massive uphill battle, with lots of zeros at the end of it needing to be paid if he looses.

[Jlc]

What are the evidence required for the defence based on misassumptions? ( He wants to see the photographic evidence)

Without knowing the particulars of the case it's hard to comment fully.

Depending on the method of capture, there might not be photographic evidence - nor is it strictly required.

What I'm saying is the calibration route is unlikely to fly too.

[watermelona]

Regarding the signage, can you please give me the law that says it ( no sign required)?

Assuming there was street lighting...

Road Traffic Regulation Act 1984

Even if it would be that my bf he is not English...

And?

First of all he doesn't remember this offence.
Secondly it is not clear for someone who drives and is new to this country that if there are no signs the speed to be 30mph.
I didn't see any of Google maps and that is why it is not evident.
If they were my bf would have never broken them he is a very correct person.

[Jlc]

My suspicion is that he was travelling at 44mph and is now trying to find a 'technical' defence as noted above.

How do the matter progress to court anyway? That speed would normally see a 3 point £100 fixed penalty.

First of all he doesn't remember this offence.
Secondly it is not clear for someone who drives and is new to this country that if there are no signs the speed to be 30mph.
I didn't see any of Google maps and that is why it is not evident.
If they were my bf would have never broken them he is a very correct person.

I'm sure he's a really nice guy but none of this provides a defence in law.

I suggest you speak to a specialist motoring lawyer (of which there is already on this thread) before he ends up digging himself into a very expensive hole.

[peterguk]

First of all he doesn't remember this offence.

No defence

it is not clear for someone who drives and is new to this country that if there are no signs the speed to be 30mph.

No defence

I didn't see any of Google maps and that is why it is not evident.

No defence and not relevant as a snapshot of up to 3 years ago has no relation to the signage on the day in question.

[watermelona]

On the Statement of Witness he received he has

" The police vehicle remained at a constant distance to it rear.I checked the speedometer in the police vehicle and found the speed to be a constant 44mph"

thank you again for all the advice

First of all he doesn't remember this offence.

No defence

it is not clear for someone who drives and is new to this country that if there are no signs the speed to be 30mph.

No defence

I didn't see any of Google maps and that is why it is not evident.

No defence and not relevant as a snapshot of up to 3 years ago has no relation to the signage on the day in question.

Hi peterguk

first of all thank you for the replies.

secondly on goggle maps it says 2014 oct...so it is more than 7 months since the photos were taken

thirdly he want to see the camera and see the car and the speed

This post has been edited by watermelona: Thu, 18 Jun 2015 - 17:48