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CEL PCN recieved
ElmoCool
post Thu, 6 Dec 2018 - 23:28
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Hi guys,

Driver of the car went to a late night desert place (24/11/2018) and parked on a non-lit car park just across from the place, they were there for just shy of 3 hours according to the letter, from 20:53 till 23:50 and they're trying to fine for £60 if paid within 14 days or it goes up to £100 thereafter.

The PCN was issued on the 30/11/2018, I received the letter on 05/12/2018

The parking area states it's for permit holders according to the letter but at the parking area there wasn't any obvious clear signage due to the poorly lit area, I'm just curios as to whether I can dispute this and how the best way to go about it was

The letter received was from CEL, what other information do i need?

Thanks in advance!

This post has been edited by ElmoCool: Fri, 7 Dec 2018 - 07:33
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post Thu, 6 Dec 2018 - 23:28
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Redivi
post Thu, 6 Dec 2018 - 23:45
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Edit your post to remove any hint of who was driving

The driver recently went etc
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ElmoCool
post Fri, 7 Dec 2018 - 07:35
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Done, sorry... not used to the forum stuff
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ostell
post Fri, 7 Dec 2018 - 09:51
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Get the driver to go back and take photos at the same time without using flash to show that the signs can't be seen.. Then with flash so that the signs can be read ans commented on.

If this is permit holders only then as the driver did not have a permit then there was no contract to park and therefore no breach of contract nor agreement to pay. The only claimant is the landholder for nominal trespass. That's why we need the signs.
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ElmoCool
post Mon, 10 Dec 2018 - 20:50
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The driver returned to take some images, the first one here without flash https://gyazo.com/65ecc63909202534dc54cb0c6a27251a
and the second one with flash https://gyazo.com/95d043bac02e7c2320adfa245b651a0b
the camera has auto features for making dark images brighter whether that is a factor?
Also the site is on a one way road so the entrance is to the left of the sign and from the image the one way system heads to the right of the image so the sign isn't facing the drivers direction upon entering the car park

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cabbyman
post Mon, 10 Dec 2018 - 20:58
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We could doi with a few more pics that show the sign in context and to illustrate the description you have given in post #5.

Meantime, please post a GSV link.


--------------------
Cabbyman 10 PPCs 0
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ostell
post Mon, 10 Dec 2018 - 22:38
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That looks as though the flash was used in both. Turn the Auto feature off.
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ElmoCool
post Mon, 10 Dec 2018 - 23:02
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here's a GSV link https://www.google.com/maps/@53.7586135,-2....6384!8i8192
He's going to go back tomorrow to get some better photos
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cabbyman
post Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 18:46
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Please clarify the name of the PPC. CEL are members of BPA and use POPLA. Those signs, your pics and GSV, appear to have IPC logos.

Please post a copy, front and back, of the PCN, redacting any identifying details.


--------------------
Cabbyman 10 PPCs 0
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ElmoCool
post Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 20:17
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Here's the front of the letter https://gyazo.com/5a439822c9ba55ea80cd8ca05b67f153
and here's the rear https://gyazo.com/75f841fc53c27e746d46795264b36fe4
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Jlc
post Tue, 11 Dec 2018 - 20:53
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Non-PoFA - easy win at POPLA should they want to go there.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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ElmoCool
post Thu, 13 Dec 2018 - 19:52
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So should the driver initiate the appeal process through their website first?

This post has been edited by ElmoCool: Thu, 13 Dec 2018 - 19:53
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SchoolRunMum
post Thu, 13 Dec 2018 - 23:12
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Yes of course, but NEVER the driver!
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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 14 Dec 2018 - 09:25
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The KEEPER does everything
The driver plays no part inthe appela process.
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ElmoCool
post Mon, 17 Dec 2018 - 11:19
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Okay so the keeper is initiating the appeal process under the grounds that the ticket violates the PoFA?
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nosferatu1001
post Mon, 17 Dec 2018 - 11:52
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Yes
The NtK does not mee thte strict conditions set out in POFA Schedule 4 para 9 (this assumes you never got a windscreen ticket) to hold the keeper liable

You can specify which failures here if you want, or leave it for the likely rejection and then appeal at POPLA.
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ElmoCool
post Wed, 9 Jan 2019 - 21:46
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Hello everyone happy new year!

Only just got round to this as it escaped the mind, as expected they denied the initial appeal, would this now mean the keeper can go to POPLA with this code and submit an appeal on the same grounds or is there anything extra to add before it gets sent?

This post has been edited by ElmoCool: Thu, 10 Jan 2019 - 19:41
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ostell
post Thu, 10 Jan 2019 - 09:05
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So where is your POPLA appeal? You are running out of time.
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 10 Jan 2019 - 11:03
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Well yes, five mionutes of reading around tells you to submit a POPLA appeal
WHich times out in 28 days from generation

You draft your appeal here
Your research, which you must have done, will have shown you the lengthy appeals that get sent to POPLA.
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SchoolRunMum
post Thu, 10 Jan 2019 - 17:50
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Very easy to copy/adapt one someone did earlier, and you could find one in an evening of reading similar threads on here or on MSE.
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