Late buying ticket..Parking Charge Recieved |
Late buying ticket..Parking Charge Recieved |
Fri, 31 Jul 2020 - 16:44
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
Hi,
Is it worth appealing on the below? We arrived at the car park at 11am, fully intending to pay for the parking. However we didn't have enough change to pay for the required duration and couldn't find anywhere to get change within a short distane of the car park. We tried to pay on our phone, but the app didn't have the required time we wanted (Only offered all day parking). We then decided to pay for the minimum stay (1 hour) and go and get some change and then pay for 4 hours. However it was 20 minutes after we arrived at the car park when we bought the initial ticket. We then eventually returned to the car park with the change and paid for 4 hours parking. We have now recieved a "Notice to Keeper" from I Park Services Ltd in Cockermouth, asking for £60.. Reason for Issue "Failure to purchase a period of parking after being on site greater than 10 minutes" To summarise: We entered the car park at 11am (as per picture on the letter they sent) Bought a one hour ticket at 11.20am Then bought a four hour ticket at 12.19pm We left the car park at 4.19pm (as per picture) If there is any help anyone could offer that would be great, or if you require any information from me please let me know. Just a bit disappointed that we spent ages running round to get change, and really didnt need to bother as we got a fine anyway! Thanks Garf |
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Fri, 31 Jul 2020 - 16:44
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Fri, 31 Jul 2020 - 16:45
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 41,506 Joined: 25 Aug 2011 From: Planet Earth Member No.: 49,223 |
Who has issued the charge?
Can you post a redacted copy of what you've received. -------------------- RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it. |
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Fri, 31 Jul 2020 - 16:57
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#3
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
Post up a redacted copy of the Notice to Keeper you received but leave dates.
Which car park was it? One of the ones I saw had the condition signs not visible as you drive in. Can you get a photo of the signs? |
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Fri, 31 Jul 2020 - 17:35
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
Thanks both for your quick responses.
It was Staithes Bank Top in North Yorkshire. (The Private not Council car park) Unfortunately I live nowhere near so cannot get a picture of the car park sign I'm just trying to reduce the size on the redacted letter jpeg so I can upload it. I've looked at the thread about pictures, but it seems a bit out of date. |
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Fri, 31 Jul 2020 - 18:06
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#5
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
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Fri, 31 Jul 2020 - 21:47
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
Upload any pictures to a hosting site such as imgur and put the link on here.
What was the location? |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 09:30
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 11:05
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
Insufficient detail to find the car park. What does the NTK say about location? Why not use Google maps to tell us the .location of the car park. One I have found is a council owned one which could you be to your advantage
Unfortunately they seem to have got the format of the NTK correct, it all depends on the signage. |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 14:31
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#9
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
The council car park and the private car park where we got the ticket next to each other
I cant find any sign of the private car park online, but the address on NTK is Staithes, Staithes, TS13 5AD if that helps. Google street view doesnt cover the car parks. This post has been edited by Garfresco: Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 14:35 |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 14:58
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#10
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
If that is all they have given the they have failed POFA 9 (2) (a), not specified relevant land. A single post code is insufficient
Where was the driver visiting? Just to get some idea of the location. |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 16:20
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 8,582 Joined: 9 Feb 2006 Member No.: 4,813 |
If that is all they have given the they have failed POFA 9 (2) (a), not specified relevant land. A single post code is insufficient Especially as the postcode refers to the location as Staines Beck and is in the middle of a wood. If, as may be the case, the RK wasn't the driver how in hell could the location be identified. -------------------- The Asda shopping trolley parking ticket enthusiast
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 19:55
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#12
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
If that is all they have given the they have failed POFA 9 (2) (a), not specified relevant land. A single post code is insufficient Where was the driver visiting? Just to get some idea of the location. Thanks, this sounds quite hopefull Is there a template letter I can send please? This post has been edited by Garfresco: Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:48 |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:04
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#13
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
Specially for you, one of my regular letters suitably amended. I'd lose those details in your last post
Dear Sirs, I have just received your Notice to Keeper xxxxx for vehicle VRM xxxx You have failed to comply with the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection Of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to give the location of the relevant land as required by section 9 (2) (a) of the Act. I cannot, as the keeper determine the location of the alleged breach of your conditions by the wide area covered by the post code you have given and i am therefore unable to challenge your invoice. The wide area includes both private and public areas , public areas where I would have no liabilities You cannot, therefore, transfer liability for the alleged charge from the driver at the time to me, the keeper. There is no legal requirement to name the driver at the time and I will not be doing so. I do not expect to hear from you again, or your debt collectors, except to confirm that no further action will be taken on this matter and my personal details have been removed from your records. Yours etc First class post with free certificate of posting from any post office. Delay sending so that it doesn't arrive before day 13 so that they can't correct and resend within the relevant period. This post has been edited by ostell: Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:23 |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:09
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#14
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
Thanks a million Ostell, I'll send this on Monday and see how I get on.
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:25
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#15
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
See my edit !!
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:34
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#16
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:45
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#17
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
Therefore remove the detail in post #12, para 3 just so they don't realise the PCN from the details and get in 1st. They are known to read forums.
Don't get your Hope's up, they will reject, because they can. Dont appeal to the IAS because you will lose, just wait to see if a letter before claim turns up With the amount paid how much parking would that have purchased, if the driver can remember. Scales are usually non linear This post has been edited by ostell: Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:48 |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:52
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#18
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Member Group: Members Posts: 12 Joined: 31 Jul 2020 Member No.: 109,293 |
I've edited post 12
So I'll respond to them, they are likely to reject my response, and then do I just hope that they don't take me to court as they realise they are in breach of section 9a etc and will lose. With regard to the price of parking. I think the amount paid in total (£6.20) would have got the driver 24 hours parking. This post has been edited by Garfresco: Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 20:55 |
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Sat, 1 Aug 2020 - 21:06
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#19
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
So by the failure of their pay online system to give a choice of amounts this resulted in a frustration of contract. The payments eventually given meant that there had no failure to pay for the time parking
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Mon, 3 Aug 2020 - 09:19
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#20
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Member Group: Members Posts: 14 Joined: 28 May 2019 Member No.: 104,052 |
Well I never! I just came onto this forum to see if anyone else has received a ticket for taking too long to pay for parking, saw this thread and was amazed to discover that, of all the car parks in the UK, it deals with the exact same car park where both my sister and I received tickets for the exact same reason last week!
In my case, 18 minutes elapsed between entering the car park and purchasing a ticket. While this may seem a long time, bear in mind that: 1) often 5+ minutes can easily elapse between driving past an ANPR camera and actually finding a parking space, esp. if you see someone is about to leave and wait for them to vacate a parking space, leaving you much less than 10 minutes of actual time to pay; 2) there may be a queue of several people waiting to pay at the machine, and each driver is required to type in their registration number on a fiddly keyboard making this an often slow process; 3) after reaching the front of the queue, and finally being able to copy down the URL for paying with a debit card (not via an app, like every other car park in the UK, but by navigating to their website), you spend a minute or two logging in as a guest to this website only to discover that you cannot pay for anything less than 24 hours by card! This 10-mins-to-pay rule is clearly designed to catch unsuspecting people out, and it's easy to see how people could be hit with a ticket even if this is clearly displayed on signs and a driver reads it. How many people set a stopwatch on entering a car park counting down the 10 minutes in which they have to pay? 4 mins to find a space + 4 mins waiting in a queue + 2 mins trying to pay via their website and discovering it's not possible, and BOOM! you've got yourself a ticket! Even if you have the exact change, you could easily get a ticket at this car park. |
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