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CPM PCN - what are my options?
storeman44
post Sun, 10 Nov 2019 - 21:35
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Hi received a ‘Parking Charge Notice’ in the post almost 2 weeks ago (I.e the discount rate will be gone soon and I’ll have to pay £100 instead of £60).

Link to PCN coming

The drivers work has 2 offices very close to each other (1min walk). The driver usually works out of office (A) which has some parking. On one particular day the driver was working in office (B). The drivers company have the downstairs area of the block and another company has upstairs. The driver parked next to a wall, where these isn’t specific bays but the area is used as the parking spaces every day.

The driver came outside the office late morning to make a private phone call and noticed a note from the upstairs office asking the driver to move the car (turns out the spaces aren’t related to the drivers company). The driver moved the car after seeing this.

A few weeks later I have received the PCN. There is a single picture of my car with no link to view further footage. CPM must have contacted the company I lease the car from to get my details, as its not in my name. The letter arrived 6/7 weeks after the ‘Incident’.

What are my options here? Thanks everyone.

This post has been edited by storeman44: Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 08:28
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post Sun, 10 Nov 2019 - 21:35
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Dave65
post Sun, 10 Nov 2019 - 22:48
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First edit your post and remove anything that may identify who drove the vehicle.

Refer only to " the driver" did this or that.

Also edit the PPN and remove any name on it.

Did any hire agreement papers come with the PPN?
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ostell
post Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 08:07
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You must edit your post so that the identity of the driver cannot be inferred. Use "the driver......."etc. This is very important.

To be able to claim from the hirer/keeper they have to also send copies of the hire documents AND the original NTK to the hirer. Most don't.

If the documents are not there then this is the response:

Ref PCN xxxxx VRM yyyyyy

I am the hirer/keeper of the above vehicle and am in receipt of the PCN you issued. I have no liability on this matter as you have failed to meet the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to supply the additional documents mandated by section 14 (2) (a) of the Act. You cannot therefore transfer liability from the driver at the time to me, the hirer keeper..

There is no legal requirement to identify the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.

Any further communication with me on this matter, apart from confirmation of no further action and my details being removed from your records, will be considered vexatious and harassment. This includes communication from any Debt Collection companies you care to instruct.

Yours etc.


First class post with free certificate of posting from a post office.

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storeman44
post Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 08:32
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QUOTE (ostell @ Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 08:07) *
You must edit your post so that the identity of the driver cannot be inferred. Use "the driver......."etc. This is very important.

To be able to claim from the hirer/keeper they have to also send copies of the hire documents AND the original NTK to the hirer. Most don't.

If the documents are not there then this is the response:

Ref PCN xxxxx VRM yyyyyy

I am the hirer/keeper of the above vehicle and am in receipt of the PCN you issued. I have no liability on this matter as you have failed to meet the requirements of Schedule 4 of The Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 namely, but not limited to, failing to supply the additional documents mandated by section 14 (2) (a) of the Act. You cannot therefore transfer liability from the driver at the time to me, the hirer keeper..

There is no legal requirement to identify the driver at the time and I will not be doing so.

Any further communication with me on this matter, apart from confirmation of no further action and my details being removed from your records, will be considered vexatious and harassment. This includes communication from any Debt Collection companies you care to instruct.

Yours etc.


First class post with free certificate of posting from a post office.


Thanks for the quick response. After the NTK I received a letter from the company I leased the car from letting me know they shared my details. I did not receive anything from CPM.

Do you know how likely they are to persue me after sending the above? Is there any reason why the appeal cannot be sent either online or via recorded post (which I can do via work but don’t have a post office near me).

Thanks again
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ostell
post Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 09:28
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So if CPM have not yet sent a Notice to hirer/keeper in your name then wait till you get one. I presume the copy you have got was forwarded to you by the lease company?

When you do respond to the NTH addressed to you then send it so that it arrives on day 19 after the date on the NTH. This is so that it arrives in time but not soon enough so that they can send a compliant version.

Yes you can send online but you will be restricted to the format of the web page. Make sure you appeal as the keeper and beware the drop downs that default to the driver and take screenshots as you go.

Never recorded (signed for these days) as it can be refused and all you get is proof of non delivery. Certificate of posting and it assumed delivered 2 working days later.
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storeman44
post Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 10:27
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QUOTE (ostell @ Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 09:28) *
So if CPM have not yet sent a Notice to hirer/keeper in your name then wait till you get one. I presume the copy you have got was forwarded to you by the lease company?

When you do respond to the NTH addressed to you then send it so that it arrives on day 19 after the date on the NTH. This is so that it arrives in time but not soon enough so that they can send a compliant version.

Yes you can send online but you will be restricted to the format of the web page. Make sure you appeal as the keeper and beware the drop downs that default to the driver and take screenshots as you go.

Never recorded (signed for these days) as it can be refused and all you get is proof of non delivery. Certificate of posting and it assumed delivered 2 working days later.


Sorry for the confusion. Firstly I received a 'Parking Charge Notice' from CPM in my name. It was issued on 28th October (is this the same as a NTK?)

A week or so later I received a letter from the car leasing company letting me know that they have passed on my details and sent the original PCN they received. They have said that if I don't action the notice and they get another letter, they will pay the fine and invoice me, along with an admin fee.

Would the 'Parking Charge Notice' in my name be the same as a a NTH?

Are you saying that I should now wait 19 days after receiving the letter to send the response below?

Thanks again!
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nosferatu1001
post Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 12:45
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If its sent through the post, to the keeper, then yes it is a Notice to Keeper. If it is sent to the hirer - thats YOU - then it is a Notice to Hirer. Get the terms clear, these are used all over the forum you MUST be reading to understand the issue you are in.

You MUST - MUST - appeal to the PPC within the timescales they give you, do it AS HIRER and never any other name you can think of (not driver, keeper, etc - just hirer)

Point out they have fialed to meet the requirements of POFA... youll find these on any notice to hirer thread - and have no liability. As noone now has liability, you must also not go back to the hire company, falsely claiming to still have rights to claim from them, as if you do and I am charged for this, I will have a direct, provable loss for which I WILL takew legal action to recover from you.

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ostell
post Mon, 11 Nov 2019 - 13:24
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Check the lease conditions. Do they allow for a charge or payment to be made for an invoice or does it just mention penalties or fines?
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storeman44
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 16:31
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Update - Appeal rejected. I rejected used the template posted by Ostell.

What next? Thanks guys. Appeal response below:

"Thank you for your appeal against the above PCN.

We have carefully considered your appeal but on this occasion, I am writing to inform you that
your appeal has been unsuccessful as a breach of the terms and conditions of parking
occurred. The decision has been made on the basis that:

Our records indicate that vehicle registration XXXXXXX (as shown in the photographic
evidence above) was not authorised to be parked at the location, therefore the above vehicle is
in breach of the terms and conditions stipulated on all signage displayed within the car park.
Signage clearly states “A VALID UK CPM PERMIT MUST BE CLEARLY DISPLAYED IN THE
FRONT WINDSCREEN AT ALL TIMES ”

It is the driver’s responsibility when leaving their vehicle unattended to observe the area and
check parking is permitted. There is clear signage placed throughout the parking areas stating
that the land is private property and restrictions apply.

Please be advised, the above Parking Charge Notice has been issued under Contract Law as
a breach of the parking conditions has occurred. UK CPM can obtain keeper details through
the Reasonable Cause Criteria within 6 months of the incident date to the driver of the vehicle.

Please note. You now have 14 days from the date of this letter to make payment at the
reduced fee of £60.00. If payment is not received within 14 days, the fee will increase to the full
amount of £100.00.
How to pay:
Online: www.paymyticket.co.uk
Telephone: 0845 463 4040 (24hr)
Post: Payments & Collections, PO Box 3114, Lancing, BN15 5BR

The Independent Appeals Service (www.theIAS.org) provides an Alternative Dispute
Resolution scheme for disputes of this type. As you have complied with our internal appeals
procedure you may use, and we will engage with, the IAS Standard Appeals Service providing
you lodge an appeal to them within 21 days of this rejection. All PCN's will be uploaded to the
IAS website by the end of this working day.

If payment is not received within 28 days of the date of this letter then additional charges may
be incurred, for which you may be liable. The matter maybe referred for litigation in the County
Court which could result in a County Court Judgment being made against you. This may
impact on your ability to obtain credit in the future.

If you appeal this charge then you will lose the ability to pay at the reduced rate, in the event
the appeal is unsuccessful, the full amount will then be payable. If you appeal and then
subsequently pay the charge prior to that appeal being determined, then the appeal will be
cancelled and you will not be given a further opportunity to contest the charge.
Yours sincerely

Appeals Department
UK Car Park Management Ltd"
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ostell
post Mon, 9 Dec 2019 - 22:08
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If all you sent was the appeal suggested, and nothing else was added, then just ignore. An appeal to the IAS will be rejected.
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storeman44
post Tue, 10 Dec 2019 - 09:33
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Will they not continue to chase me for payment?
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 10 Dec 2019 - 15:17
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Yes, and? Its just debt collector letters
LBA? Come back having done some research into how to respond
Court claim? Come back having akcnowledged ONLINE after the 5 days.
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