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2 PCN and Towed charged for missing car in edinburgh, Got 2 PCN and Towed charged for reported missing car
Sunny84
post Wed, 14 Nov 2018 - 22:49
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Hello Dear Group members,

First of all I really appreciate that you guys are taking your own time in helping other people on this forum. This is really helpful and very kind of you. I have been reading threads from this forum and so now I am looking for some advise on how to deal with my situation.

So, last Saturday on 10/11/18 at 3:00 pm my wife parked her car on control zone in Edinburgh city center ( parking restricted for Mon-Fri 9:30 to 5:30). She cam back at 3:45 and her car wasn't there. She then looked at the few other streets around from where she actually parked. At 5:00 pm we decided to contact police and report a missing car. Police then checked their system and said it's not been move or lifted by Edinburgh council. So then we decided to registered a complaint for stolen car. I also reported it to our insurance company and they started their procedure with claim. Then on at 7:00 pm in the evening two police office cam to see us regarding the incident and took our statements and said they will check with Edinburgh council and find out if it's been lifted or not.

Since then we have not had any updates from police. No update on 11/11/18 and 12/11/18. On 13/11/18, Tuesday I contacted police in order to get some update around 4 pm and at that time I have been told that its been impounded by council and I have been asked to contact Edinburgh impound. I contacted Edinburgh Impound and they said your car has been lifted today Morning ( Tuesday Morning at 11:00 am ) and it had tickets from Monday and Tuesday , and strange thing is that it was found from another street which is just 5 minutes away from the place where my wife first parked her car. So I contacted police and they said I need to go and check my car in order to see if it's been damaged or any sign of theft. When I went to impound my car was in perfect condition and had no sign of theft. Now When I ask for my car I have been told that I need to pay charges £210 to get my car back ( £150 + £30 +£ 30 ). I contacted police and they said it's now a dispute between me and Edinburgh council and I should contact Edinburgh council to wave off my charges. And police also suggested me that I should get my car out as soon as possible to stop getting any daily charges. So I paid £210 to get our car back and All I am looking for is to appeal against my charges. A representation of removal of my vehicle and parking tickets.

I am thinking that It's very unfair that I have to pay these charges because First , my wife parked a car at different place and it was not under any parking restriction at the time ( free parking during the weekends) . Second how did our car end up on different street and third one is if we are not aware about any fines on our car the how am I going to pay the ticket. so I think all the charges to us are irrelevant and should be refunded.

I am looking for some advise from members from this group on how should I best approach to this situation and raised my representation against council.

Thanks in advanced
Sunny
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post Wed, 14 Nov 2018 - 22:49
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Sunny84
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 00:21
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Hi Everyone,

Thanks for your responses on my post. With some ideas and help from your advises I have now drafted a letter that I am going to attached with my representation. Please see the letter below and I will highly appreciate any advise and feedback on the letter.

Dear Sir /Madam,

I am writing in regards to the issue of PCN number XXXX and XXXX, and the subsequent towing and impounding of my vehicle XXXX on Tuesday 13th November 2018 in relation to this notice.

I am appealing on the ground of
B) The vehicle had been taken without my consent

On Saturday 10/11/2018 at 3:00 pm I parked my car at Chalmers Crescent, near German church (Uncontrolled Zone on Saturday as it says Mon- Fri, 9:30-5:30). Then I went to sick kid’s hospital and came back at 3:45 and I didn’t find my car where I parked. I got totally shocked that my car wasn’t in front of me. I then started searching for my car on Chalmers Crescent and other streets around Chalmers Crescent. When I didn’t find my car I decided to contact Police and around 5:00 pm I contacted police in order to report a missing car.

I called police Scotland and explained them what happened, Police then put me on hold and checked on their system to find out if the car has been lifted or moved by council. They didn’t find any records of my car. Then they registered my complaint for stolen car (Police incident number: XXXXX). I also informed to insurance company regarding the incident and they started their procedure for theft claim. Then later on in the evening around 7:00 pm two police officers from local police station came to see us for statements. They assured me that they will check with Edinburgh council that if my vehicle has been moved or lifted by council and they will get back to me, one of the police officer also mentioned that they will put a markdown on my car as a stolen car.

Since then I had no updated from police, two days 11/11/18 and 12/11/18 passed without any updates of my car. Then on 13/11/18 I decided to contact police in order to get any updates for my car. When I phoned police on 13/11/18 around 3:00pm, police mentioned that my car has been lifted by Edinburgh council and it is in Edinburgh car pound. I then contacted car pound and they said my car has been picked up from Hatton place on 13/11/18 (Tuesday) and it has got two PCNs from last two days (Monday and Tuesday). I was totally shocked on hearing that it has PCNs from last two days, which means my car was there from last two days.

I believe that my representation of appeal under the “Taken without Consent” ground is valid in the above circumstances. It was clearly never my intention to leave the car in contravention and at least by the council to remove it and reporting this to police. I had certainty regarding its whereabouts which was my main concern, something which the police had signally failed to achieve in the best part of 3 days. If I would have been notified of my car being found on another place then I would have removed it from there before the parking restriction applies (Before Monday 9:30 am) and without any penalties. The fact that I received 2 PCNs for the same offence and further charges of removal of my car (£210 in total), which I believe is completely unfair in my situation due to the fact that I never had a chance to discover my vehicle or any of the PCNs.

The fact about I reported to Police that my car was missing on Saturday (10/11/18) and not receiving any updates about my car until Tuesday (13/11/18) caused me huge amount of stress and money. As the above circumstances clearly states that I had no possession of my car when two PCNs has been served and the car has been impounded, I therefore request that the charges of serving two PCNs and removal of my vehicle should be reimbursed.

I look forward to hearing your response to this appeal and should you required any further information then please do not hesitate to contact me.



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DancingDad
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 07:57
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Loses focus.

While the police report and basic story is fine for background and shows timeline that supports, the basis of your challenge must be:-
Wife parked the car in Chelmer's Crescent.
Car disappeared and could not be found despite our efforts and those of police
Car was removed having been left in contravention in Hatton Place
I have no idea how it got to Hatton Place and can only assume that it was left there by persons unknown.

The problem is that there is no evidence of why or who may have moved it and this will come down to credibility.
Did you do as suggested and have a look at either location to see if any CCTV may be available.
If nothing else you must put in something about why wife is sure that she did not park it in Hatton Place.
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Mad Mick V
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 08:29
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I would also ask they Council if they relocated the vehicle since there are various works taking place in that area:-

http://edinburgh.cdmf.info/public/disrupti...6F752DA611C5551

Mick
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DancingDad
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 08:38
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Could you also confirm if when you collected your car, that you paid for both PCNs?
If only one, the first or second ?
You should be aware that only one PCN will be automatically covered by this challenge, the second may need a separate challenge.
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hcandersen
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 09:05
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Are you sure?

Sums payable to recover the vehicle should be total owing, I don't know that an authority has any right to claim otherwise.

Vehicle may only be removed if PCN served and it is that PCN which legitimises removal.
But IMO once removed the charges to recover should be the toal outstanding, not just that PCN.

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DancingDad
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 09:12
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QUOTE (hcandersen @ Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 09:05) *
Are you sure?

Sums payable to recover the vehicle should be total owing, I don't know that an authority has any right to claim otherwise.

Vehicle may only be removed if PCN served and it is that PCN which legitimises removal.
But IMO once removed the charges to recover should be the toal outstanding, not just that PCN.



I agree with you but we have seen before that the payment required only covers one PCN despite two being served.
Worth checking and not falling foul of it by assuming.
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disgrunt
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 09:20
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Definitely remove the bit about search other streets. It implies your wife wasn't certain where they parked it.
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DancingDad
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 09:29
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QUOTE (disgrunt @ Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 09:20) *
Definitely remove the bit about search other streets. It implies your wife wasn't certain where they parked it.



Dunno about that.
If the car is not where thought, anyone is going to look around.
But it does need to be stressed that wife was certain but searched around after beginning to doubt herself.
And that no way it was parked where removed from because..... ?
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hcandersen
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 10:15
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+1

The account must read as one would expect:

Car not there. Initial shock, then maybe I'm out by a little, perhaps senior moment.
Carry out simple checks.
Satisfied that it's missing and notified those agencies you'd expect i.e. police and insurer.
Gave statement to police which carried an implied if not actual statement of truth.


Personally I would add a note of disaapointment that the police were not able to find the vehicle which was hiding in plain sight albeit a few streets away. If they had, you'd have moved it before it was in contravention.
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cp8759
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 11:10
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My main concern is that the council will simply reject the vehicle, on the basis that there is no direct evidence it was taken without consent. I would send an unrelated enquiry to the council asking if any parking restrictions were put in place on Chalmers Crescent. And you need to make those CCTV enquiries.

At the moment, on the balance of probabilities, it's still more likely than not that the wife just didn't recall the location of the car accurately, you need something to tip the balance the other way and at present you have nothing at all.


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If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
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stamfordman
post Mon, 19 Nov 2018 - 11:44
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We haven't seen council pics of car in contravention. This may shed some light on this.
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