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premier park pcn, no parking and leaving site
marketman
post Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 10:15
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Hello there, received a pcn from premier parking for 'parking and leaving site'.
This is a first for one of these, the warden must have taken the photo as soon as we moved away from car literally, but I saw nothing.


This post has been edited by marketman: Thu, 1 Feb 2018 - 09:21
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post Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 10:15
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ManxRed
post Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 10:26
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Premier Park have a few hurdles to overcome here.

Do the signs properly define 'the site'? Is it boundary marked or is there a map?

Why did the attendant who took the photo not try to warn the person that they were potentially breaching Premier's contract? He would have a duty of care to mitigate.

Do the photos clearly identify which person (if any) was actually driving, or could they have simply been passengers?

Did the driver purchase anything at any of the stores onsite and do they have a receipt? Not that they have to have bought anything, browsing is fine, but obviously a receipt is a bit of evidence which could be used to put pressure on the store to intervene.

How many days elapsed between the incident and your receipt of Premier's Notice to Keeper?

I wouldn't advocate paying Premier.

This post has been edited by ManxRed: Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 10:27


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marketman
post Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 14:20
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We must have just left the car when the park attend took the picture, why couldn't he have warned us?
There's 1 sign on entry, quit high, not easily noticable from the drivers seat, that says private land, I'll have to go back for more photos.
There are the usual signs around park but also some banners which say 'no parking and leaving'.
Here's the pcn.sorry won't upload.
Nothing was purchased from site so no receipts.
Found another case online, apparently the site was managed by VCS in 2017, there's a case vcs v ibbotson.
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The Rookie
post Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 14:25
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More like why WOULDN'T he warn you, simple, they don't actually want to stop you leaving (although that is exactly what they are employed by the landowner to do), they want the money for trying to charge you for the pleasure.


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ManxRed
post Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 15:29
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QUOTE (marketman @ Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 14:20) *
... there's a case vcs v ibbotson.


Bingo. Have a read of it, especially the bit where the judge comments on VCS's warden's responsibility to mitigate, and warn the driver not to leave site.

There's a beautiful toothbrush comment in there as well.


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ostell
post Mon, 29 Jan 2018 - 15:52
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And the judges statements about the boundaries of the car park.
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marketman
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 12:27
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Looking around this site and MSE, PP seem to havr their act together and popla seem to be swinging in theses firms favor.
I do t seem to have a great defense except for mitigating loss and evidence of my leaving site, although it maybe argued that the wardens word is enough.
The contractual stuff seems to have been done to death.
All the signs including the banners are all in place, I was apparently seen leaving site, what argument can there be?
PP are winning with Popla, it would have to be a GOOD argument.
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ostell
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 12:35
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So what defines the site, have you read the "toothbrush" case? Why not post up the signs and the NTK and let others decide.
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marketman
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 14:02
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Well there you go tried again to upload to no avail, what am I doing wrong, can't attach signs or other photos so no help there.
I'm clicking browse then photos then upload not working.
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kommando
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 14:52
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Open an account on a photo hosting site like postimages.org, load the images on that site and then include the links in your post.
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ostell
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 15:27
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And someone has posted up on another thread an appeal that includes all the relevant bits of VCS v Ibbotson.
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marketman
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 16:31
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Ive seen and read the VCS v ibbotson case, but this eas only won on a technicality and not mitigation, although the judge did mention it, it wasnt what won the case.
Also , at the bottom of PP parking sign there is a statement that reads ' we are a space maximisation scheme only'.
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cabbyman
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 17:43
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Mitigation will never win. 'Technicalities' win cases.

Upload images to TinyPic and copy the [IMG] tags into this thread.

Have you sent a simple appeal to Premier Park yet? They will reject and send a POPLA code which you then win with a 4000+ word appeal.


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marketman
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 21:29
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QUOTE (ostell @ Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 12:35) *
So what defines the site, have you read the "toothbrush" case? Why not post up the signs and the NTK and let others decide.

If you look at earlier posts it was me that introduced it
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marketman
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 22:21
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This is really grinding now, tinypic's log on system not working, other photo hosting also struggling.
The site has signs all round it's perimeter, which I was well in, the sign itself is quite clear although gives no map or definition of the site.
It says on the bottom' premier park operates a space maximisation scheme only'.
I have alot of pressure on me at the moment and do without this, if there's only a chance of winning, then £60 is better than 100 or double that if I lose in court along with more stress.
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marketman
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 23:15
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SchoolRunMum
post Wed, 31 Jan 2018 - 23:25
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QUOTE
I received a pcn from premier parking last week for 'parking and leaving site'.


Seriously EDIT your first post, urgently.

A case suggesting that a driver 'left the site is so easy to win at POPLA it's laughable because they will have no evidence, except if a poster decides to post all over a public forum that they...they...did...something... (I won't repeat it as I want you to edit it OUT!).

Almost all cases are won at POPLA and a 'left the site' one should be easy if you edit quickly, NOW.

No-one here would pay.
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marketman
post Thu, 1 Feb 2018 - 09:09
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Why the panic, there is absolutely no indication of my identity in the whole of this thread, no way of knowing whatsoever of who I am and when this happened.
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ostell
post Thu, 1 Feb 2018 - 09:25
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QUOTE (marketman @ Thu, 1 Feb 2018 - 09:09) *
Why the panic, there is absolutely no indication of my identity in the whole of this thread, no way of knowing whatsoever of who I am and when this happened.

The PPCs will print out the thread and use it in court (they have done) pointing out the similarities between the thread and the case and on the balance of probability persuade the judge that it was you.

Have you got a receipt for an on site store? That would satisfy the requirement for use of store customers

This post has been edited by ostell: Thu, 1 Feb 2018 - 09:37
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marketman
post Thu, 1 Feb 2018 - 17:03
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Unfortunatly no reciepts as nothing was purchased. I wonder though, surely this cannot be defended on the leaving site aproach, surely they would have thought of that, they have a witness after all, also i cannot see a problem with boundaries being defined on this site. So really the only argument would be to challenge their right to pursue this and the unfsirness of the charge, with maybe the unfairness of not being stopped or warned by the warden.Im not trying to be negative, but just pointing out good argument,.
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