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Notice of Proposed Disqualification.
VanBonkface
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 18:12
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Looking for a little help.
I came home to the notice of proposed DQ this afternoon, I was caught speeding back in May 38 in a 30, I couldn't identify the driver as it could have been me or the mrs, so a photo arrived (it was me). Fair cop, so when I got round to responding, births, deaths, new job and sent away on a training course unexpectedly all in June I noticed there was no form to say that it was actually me, so I called the ticket office and they said it had been sent to the court. The court sent a letter, I filled in the forms and forgot to send it before I went on holiday which meant it went over the 21 day limit, by 5 days. so now I receive this letter for failing to give information. My license currently has 0 points, as of June 15th this year. How likely is it that I will be banned and how should I approach this? I admitted to the first offence, just missed the window, and now missed the second one.

I must come across as so unorganised, but may/June were just manic and a sudden death on the other side of the country meant we were away for a fortnight unexpectedly arranging funerals etc.

Help!

Thanks in advance.
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post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 18:12
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southpaw82
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 18:26
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What offence(s) are you at court for?


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VanBonkface
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 18:33
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Failing to provide information of the driver. I thought it was harsh.....
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NewJudge
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 18:35
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And what is "the letter from the court"? Is it a Single Justice Procedure Notice? What makes you think you might be disqualified?
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paulajayne
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 18:49
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QUOTE (VanBonkface @ Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:33) *
Failing to provide information of the driver. I thought it was harsh.....



Why? That is exactly what you did.

How long have you had your licence?
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VanBonkface
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:01
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QUOTE (NewJudge @ Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:35) *
And what is "the letter from the court"? Is it a Single Justice Procedure Notice? What makes you think you might be disqualified?


It is a Notice of proposed Driving Disqualification, doesn't refer to a SJPN.

QUOTE (paulajayne @ Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:49) *
QUOTE (VanBonkface @ Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:33) *
Failing to provide information of the driver. I thought it was harsh.....



Why? That is exactly what you did.

How long have you had your licence?


That's not what I meant by harsh, failing to provide info would normally be 6pts and £1000 max

19 years.

The only thing I can think of is that when I committed the speeding offence I had 6 pts on my license, these were removed in June, is it possible they still think these are live and on my license so the 6points they would give would have put me on 12?

This post has been edited by VanBonkface: Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:02
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paulajayne
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:18
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I was checking to see if you were a new driver.

Check here:- HERE
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BaggieBoy
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:22
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QUOTE (VanBonkface @ Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 20:01) *
The only thing I can think of is that when I committed the speeding offence I had 6 pts on my license, these were removed in June, is it possible they still think these are live and on my license so the 6points they would give would have put me on 12?

Finally we get the vital information. By "removed" I suspect you mean they were 3 years old? In which case they were live at the time of the new offence (Failing To Furnish) and since that offence carries 6 points you are now facing a totting ban. You will need to go to court and present and exceptional hardship plea if you want to keep your licence.
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The Rookie
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:36
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Points aren’t removed until they are 4 years old so if they were really removed in June they wouldn’t count for totting but I suspect you mean they were then three years old. As BB points out it’s the offence dates that are used for totting so in the face of it you totted with the 6 points and now face a mandatory 6 month disqualification unless you can present a successful extreme hardship case.


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VanBonkface
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 19:42
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So even though the DVLA check is showing there is currently 0 points they are still there until 2019?
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BaggieBoy
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 20:02
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They are only active for 3 years but remain on your record for 4.When was the offence that caused these initial 6 points to be awarded.
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VanBonkface
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 20:36
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QUOTE (BaggieBoy @ Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 21:02) *
They are only active for 3 years but remain on your record for 4.When was the offence that caused these initial 6 points to be awarded.


June 2015, so no longer active as of this June.
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Jlc
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 20:39
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If the s172 occurred before the 3 years were up then totting will be considered.

Exact dates need to be checked. The s172 occurs 28 days after the request is made.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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NewJudge
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 21:28
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Yes you need to check the dates. The S172 offence is committed 28 days after the request for information was served on you (which, if you are the Registered Keeper would probably have been no more than a week or so after the original speeding offence). Courts do sometimes make mistakes. They may have calculated the three years from the date of the speeding offence instead of the S172 offence.

When is the hearing? You need to have checked the dates by then and, if "totting up" is in order, have an "Exceptional Hardship" argument prepared (if you intend to present one, that is).

This post has been edited by NewJudge: Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 21:31
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VanBonkface
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 22:27
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Ok, so the request for information was between 03 May and 11th July which was when the NIP and then the photos would have been sent I'd imagine, this is from the case details. The date is 2 maths long as I was unable to say whom was driving without photos. So I'd imagine that the Fail to give info would be from the 11/07/18?

I will have to get some representation for this as I am the only source of income for the household, and without my car I could not work as I work all over the country/europe at short notice. The hearing is about 6 weeks away yet, I only received the letter today.
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BaggieBoy
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 22:30
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Not sure on your date, the FtF offence would have occurred 28 days after you were served the NIP/S172 request. So probably at the end of May or very beginning of June.
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southpaw82
post Sat, 8 Sep 2018 - 23:28
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When does the charge say you committed the offence?


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Logician
post Sun, 9 Sep 2018 - 02:53
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You have the basis for an exceptional hardship argument if your family risks being made homeless if you do not work, and you cannot work without your licence. You do not really need a solicitor to say that, you can explain that yourself. The sad thing is, had you found 10 minutes to fill in the form and post it when you should, you would have been eligible for a course, provided you had not done one in the last three years, and would now have a clean licence.


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VanBonkface
post Sun, 9 Sep 2018 - 07:14
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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sun, 9 Sep 2018 - 00:28) *
When does the charge say you committed the offence?


It just says I failed to give information between 3/5 and 11/7. It has no further dates on it.

QUOTE (Logician @ Sun, 9 Sep 2018 - 03:53) *
You have the basis for an exceptional hardship argument if your family risks being made homeless if you do not work, and you cannot work without your licence. You do not really need a solicitor to say that, you can explain that yourself. The sad thing is, had you found 10 minutes to fill in the form and post it when you should, you would have been eligible for a course, provided you had not done one in the last three years, and would now have a clean licence.


I know, I felt sick whilst I was away as I knew the letter was sat on the worktop in the kitchen with a stamp on it ready to go.
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The Rookie
post Sun, 9 Sep 2018 - 07:53
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QUOTE (VanBonkface @ Sun, 9 Sep 2018 - 08:14) *
QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sun, 9 Sep 2018 - 00:28) *
When does the charge say you committed the offence?


It just says I failed to give information between 3/5 and 11/7. It has no further dates on it.


Well you need to bottom this out.

Does the paperwork include a copy of the original NIP and S172 request, normally it would, if so what is the date on that? There is not a date range on the date you actually committed the offence and your request for photos is totally meaningless in the context of the totting case you now face.

For clarity, what was the exact date in June your previous points became three years old, if we use 3/5 as the date on the NIP that would be presumed delivered on the 8th (2 working days later) and the offence committed on the 4th June. If 3/5 was the presumed service date then the offence was committed on the 30th May.


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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