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insurance, underwriter cancelled my insurance
battleagainstins...
post Sat, 11 May 2019 - 17:11
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Dear all

I would like to apologise in advance if I am in the wrong forum but I hope someone could help. Today I received a letter from Admiral Insurance which informed me about the cancellation of my policy due to unappropriated language.

The problem started when I renewed my car insurance in March 2019. I paid for my car insurance in full. In about 10 days after I paid for the insurance I received a letter from Admiral where they advised that an additional £125.20 was added to my premium which they demanded to be paid. I reluctantly but have paid it.

When I challenged them Admiral told that I forgot to inform them about a "theft/accident" which occurred in 2017. They could not say whether it was theft or accident. All they said it is registered as theft/accident. In 2017 whilst my car was parked at Tesco, the third party hit my car but there was no damage. I, as a stupidest man, informed my insurance about the accident but decided not to pursue it unless the third party decided to claim against me. The claim has never been investigated, there was no financial lost and importantly I was not compensated neither was my car repaired. The claim was genuinely forgotten and never was an issue even in the following year 2018-2019.

I accept I used an inappropriate language whilst I communicated with their staff. During the renewal time my mum was diagnosed with a skin cancer called melanoma. The CT scan revealed another tumour on her lung which they still believe does not relate to her skin cancer. Mum is soon to have a lung biopsy.

Admiral formally responded to my claim and as expected did not upheld any of the points I raised. I then decided to take my complaint to the Financial Ombudsman. So as soon as I complained to the Ombudsman, Admiral decided to cancel my policy.

Your advise would be very much welcomed and I would like to apologise in advance for my poor syntax and grammar. I am dyslexic and English is not my first language. Thank you all

This post has been edited by battleagainstinsurance: Sun, 12 May 2019 - 16:25
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post Sat, 11 May 2019 - 17:11
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southpaw82
post Sat, 11 May 2019 - 18:32
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Is the short version that (i) you didn’t answer their questions truthfully when you took out the policy (accidentally or deliberately) and (ii) you swore at their call centre staff about it when they challenged you?


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nigelbb
post Sat, 11 May 2019 - 20:24
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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sat, 11 May 2019 - 19:32) *
Is the short version that (i) you didn’t answer their questions truthfully when you took out the policy (accidentally or deliberately) and (ii) you swore at their call centre staff about it when they challenged you?

It looks like (ii) but Admiral cancelling the insurance when a complaint was made to the Financial Ombudsman seems worthy of another complaint to the Financial Ombudsman.


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southpaw82
post Sat, 11 May 2019 - 20:31
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Depends on whether they were entitled to cancel it for either of those reasons and acted fairly in doing so. I’ve seen bank accounts closed because customers were acting like asses to staff on the phone.


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battleagainstins...
post Sat, 11 May 2019 - 21:00
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Without having access to my car I will loose my job, thus I cant afford to lie to insurance people. I genuinely forgot about the accident in 2017 but reluctantly I had paid the required balance. I will upload the letter I received from the current insurance. I accept I was rude, very rude but am I the only one who expressed the feeling to the insurers ? Surely, they are used to for "compliments".

This post has been edited by battleagainstinsurance: Sat, 11 May 2019 - 21:11
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southpaw82
post Sat, 11 May 2019 - 21:19
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Is there a term in your contract with them that allows them to cancel it if you’re abusive to their staff? It’s not that uncommon.

QUOTE (battleagainstinsurance @ Sat, 11 May 2019 - 22:00) *
I accept I was rude, very rude but am I the only one who expressed the feeling to the insurers ? Surely, they are used to for "compliments".

Oh well, that’s alright then, eh? Perks of their job I guess.


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Mat_Shamus
post Sat, 11 May 2019 - 23:20
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I've worked in call centres before for different service suppliers for just over a decade.

If you go into a shop and become aggressive, or are swearing at the staff it can be considered as a form of abuse and / or intimidation and they are well within their rights to refuse you service for behaving that way.

Likewise with service suppliers. But in all those 13 or so years for all those different companies i worked for i only heard of a very small handful of people getting their services cancelled and being denied service in the future. The person would have had to have been very abuse for them to do that because most of the companies would rather the staff took the odd bit of cheek on the chin, rather than risk potentially bad PR and losing a paying customer. If people were annoyed and let out an odd swear word in general out of frustration i never batted an eye lid. But if they swore at me and started to make it personal then i'd give them a fair warning first, then next instance terminate the call and report it to the line manager so it can be pulled and a decision made if to terminate or let it slide.

I'm a little rusty now but if i remember you can normally request a copy of all your data, including all the recorded calls (all calls should be recorded and backed up, usually for 6 years IIRC) for £10

Are you still awaiting a response from the Ombudsman at present?


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battleagainstins...
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 00:34
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Hello Matt I cant wait for Monday to speak with the Ombudsman.
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nigelbb
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 07:56
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QUOTE (Mat_Shamus @ Sun, 12 May 2019 - 00:20) *
I'm a little rusty now but if i remember you can normally request a copy of all your data, including all the recorded calls (all calls should be recorded and backed up, usually for 6 years IIRC) for £10

A Subject Access Request is now free. If you look on this Admiral webpage you will find an email link to submit a SAR https://www.admiral.com/your-privacy-and-security

QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sat, 11 May 2019 - 21:31) *
Depends on whether they were entitled to cancel it for either of those reasons and acted fairly in doing so. I’ve seen bank accounts closed because customers were acting like asses to staff on the phone.

Closing an account because a customer submits a complaint to the Financial Ombudsman does not strike me as acting fairly.


--------------------
British Parking Association Ltd Code of Practice(Appendix C contains Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 ) & can be found here http://www.britishparking.co.uk/Code-of-Pr...ance-monitoring
DfT Guidance on Section 56 and Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/syste...ing-charges.pdf
Damning OFT advice on levels of parking charges that was ignored by the BPA Ltd Reference Request Number: IAT/FOIA/135010 – 12 October 2012
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henrik777
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 08:48
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QUOTE (nigelbb @ Sun, 12 May 2019 - 08:56) *
QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sat, 11 May 2019 - 21:31) *
Depends on whether they were entitled to cancel it for either of those reasons and acted fairly in doing so. I’ve seen bank accounts closed because customers were acting like asses to staff on the phone.

Closing an account because a customer submits a complaint to the Financial Ombudsman does not strike me as acting fairly.



It's not but if they can dress it up as something reasonable they'll get away with it. If they operate a zero tolerance approach to staff abuse then they could have a good excuse.
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DancingDad
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 08:57
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QUOTE (nigelbb @ Sun, 12 May 2019 - 08:56) *
........Closing an account because a customer submits a complaint to the Financial Ombudsman does not strike me as acting fairly.


No it isn't and IMO reason enough to get another complaint going.
But if the stated reason is because OP was rude ("I accept I was rude, very rude...") then ombudsman is likely to focus on the given reason not the supposition.
I don't see why call centre staff should be expected to accept anyone being offensive and suspect Admiral's T&Cs include a clause that allows them to terminate.

Personally I would be prioritising getting new insurance at the best price, with at least one serious black mark (cancelation of a policy) against rather then focussing on any complaint.
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seank
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 09:01
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This needs sorting out, because one of the questions a new insurer will ask you is "have you ever been declined insurance?"
The answer is "yes"and a new insurer might just refuse to cover you, or may load your premium.
My own company has sections which are public-facing, both wholly-owned dealerships and franchised dealers operating under our brands.
I'd suggest contacting Admiral, with a completely different tone. You need to show them that you're deeply sorry for what you did and beg that they will keep you as a customer.
I recognise the situation you were in, but you need to see that you can't treat people as you did and hope to retain their support. If Admiral relents and accepts your humble apology, you're laughing. If not, you might struggle to find another insurer.
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nigelbb
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 09:51
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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Sun, 12 May 2019 - 09:57) *
QUOTE (nigelbb @ Sun, 12 May 2019 - 08:56) *
........Closing an account because a customer submits a complaint to the Financial Ombudsman does not strike me as acting fairly.


No it isn't and IMO reason enough to get another complaint going.
But if the stated reason is because OP was rude ("I accept I was rude, very rude...") then ombudsman is likely to focus on the given reason not the supposition.
I don't see why call centre staff should be expected to accept anyone being offensive and suspect Admiral's T&Cs include a clause that allows them to terminate.

Of course Admiral are within their rights to terminate the policy for abuse of staff but that is not why the OP said they cancelled the policy.


--------------------
British Parking Association Ltd Code of Practice(Appendix C contains Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 ) & can be found here http://www.britishparking.co.uk/Code-of-Pr...ance-monitoring
DfT Guidance on Section 56 and Schedule 4 of POFA 2012 https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/syste...ing-charges.pdf
Damning OFT advice on levels of parking charges that was ignored by the BPA Ltd Reference Request Number: IAT/FOIA/135010 – 12 October 2012
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Slapdash
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 09:54
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It sounds as though the timing of the formal cancellation could easily be mere coincidence (or dressed up as such).

The customer complains so Admiral pit it on hold whilst they go through the complaints.
The customer gets the "wrong answer" so goes to fsa.

In parallel Admiral notify the cancellation. Just an unfortunate overlap.

Did Admiral cancel because of the non disclosure or because of the abuse ?

In any case you need to find alternate insurance. Even if the fsa eventually find in your favour that will be quite some time away.

This post has been edited by Slapdash: Sun, 12 May 2019 - 09:58
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seank
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 09:55
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QUOTE (battleagainstinsurance @ Sat, 11 May 2019 - 18:11) *
Dear all

I would like to apologise in advance if I am in the wrong forum but I hope someone could help. Today I received a letter from Admiral Insurance which informed me about the cancellation of my policy due to unappropriated language.


The Op has made conflicting comments about why Admiral responded as they did.
If my staff were being subjected to alarm, harassment or distress at such comments, I would respond exactly as they have.
We just don't need a few Pounds' profit from people like this.
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southpaw82
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 10:49
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QUOTE (nigelbb @ Sun, 12 May 2019 - 10:51) *
Of course Admiral are within their rights to terminate the policy for abuse of staff but that is not why the OP said they cancelled the policy.


I doubt that Admiral wrote to say they cancelled the policy because he’d made a complaint to the FOS. It’s much more likely that the stated reason was one or both of his non-disclosure and his abuse of staff, both of which are potentially fair reasons for cancelling the policy.

QUOTE (seank @ Sun, 12 May 2019 - 10:55) *
If my staff were being subjected to alarm, harassment or distress at such comments, I would respond exactly as they have.
We just don't need a few Pounds' profit from people like this.

Precisely.


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cp8759
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 17:27
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If Admiral accepted an additional premium in exchange for covering the heightened risk due to the "theft/accident" from 2017, I don't see how they can then backtrack and say "we've changed our minds and are cancelling the policy". They found out about the incident and then accepted an additional premium and with it the additional risk, they cannot now resile from that.

As for the staff abuse, I'd be interested to see the policy wording. This is not like a transaction in a shop, the insurer has accepted the premium and insured a risk for a fixed period of time. I can see how they may well impose certain restrictions to protect their staff, for example by saying that contact may only be made in writing and they will not accept phone calls from the customer. But to resile from the contract of insurance they would need something more than an abusive phone call.

I'm not convinced we've been given all the facts.


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stereophoney
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 17:40
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Just looking at the policy document from 06/03/19 it states:

QUOTE
Our cancellation rights
We can cancel your policy at any time by sending 7 days notice in writing to your last known
address if you:...

- harass or use abusive or threatening behaviour towards our staff
- behave in a manner that makes it inappropriate for us to continue your insurance


Admiral Car Policy Documents
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cp8759
post Sun, 12 May 2019 - 19:25
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So battleagainstinsurance when did you take out the policy, exactly?


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Korting
post Mon, 13 May 2019 - 06:06
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QUOTE (Mat_Shamus @ Sun, 12 May 2019 - 00:20) *
If you go into a shop and become aggressive, or are swearing at the staff it can be considered as a form of abuse and / or intimidation and they are well within their rights to refuse you service for behaving that way.

Likewise with service suppliers.


Does the same apply to HMRC and their agents?
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