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Civil Enforcement Ltd, HAWLEY REATIL PARK, HINCKLEY, 2 hour limit, sure i was only half an hour or so.
gas man
post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 14:17
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PCN received after 9 days via royal mail. No PCN on vehicle windscreen. Empty car park blah blah blah. Can not prove the driver was only 30 minutes.

What if any steps can I take?

Kind regards

This post has been edited by gas man: Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 14:53
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post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 14:17
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kommando
post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 14:26
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Edit so as not to infer Drivers identity, refer only to the driver.


You need to post the PCN, but CEL normally fail in making the keeper liable.
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gas man
post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 14:54
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QUOTE (kommando @ Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 15:26) *
Edit so as not to infer Drivers identity, refer only to the driver.


You need to post the PCN, but CEL normally fail in making the keeper liable.


as in photo the front and back removing names and serial numbers etc.??
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kommando
post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 15:00
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Yes, leave dates but that does not matter too much as you have confirmed it came within 9 days.
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The Rookie
post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 15:27
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How long do they alledge the driver stayed?


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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gas man
post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 15:49
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 16:27) *
How long do they alledge the driver stayed?


over 3 hours in a 2 hour space

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This post has been edited by gas man: Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 15:36
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Redivi
post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 17:22
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There's a big difference between 30 minutes and 3 hours

Did the vehicle make two short visits that CEL has recorded as a single long one ?

This is a common mistake known as a double-dip
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cabbyman
post Sun, 12 Aug 2018 - 18:22
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Straightforward failure to invoke keeper liability under PoFA [Look it up!]

Dear sirs,

ref xxxxx

I am in receipt of your purported invoice.

As you know, your paperwork fails to comply with PoFa 2012 sched 4 para 9 if you wish to hold the keeper liable. You will be well aware, from previous appeals by others, that your refusal to accept this appeal can only result in a cost to you and yet another embarrassing loss at POPLA.

I beseech you to cut your losses and cancel this PCN. If, however, you think otherwise, please supply the required POPLA code when I will be delighted to arrange for you to be instructed to cancel it by your chosen alternative dispute resolution procedure.

For the avoidance of doubt, you have failed to identify the driver and there is no legal obligation on me to change that.

Love and kisses.


This is more aggressive than is normally suggested so await the comment of others before you send it. However, given my experience with CEL, you will win at POPLA anyway, so it's worth a punt at a bit of aggression, IMHO.


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Cabbyman 11 PPCs 0
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gas man
post Mon, 13 Aug 2018 - 17:14
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Im not too fussed about it being slightly aggressive. Can anyone else comment on this who hasn't read the drivers plight.

Kind regards
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cabbyman
post Mon, 13 Aug 2018 - 17:20
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It's not the driver's plight; it's the RK's plight! Hence the very careful wording of the suggested draft.

There's no rush; you have another couple of weeks to appeal yet so you can afford to wait a couple of days to see if any other comments are forthcoming.

Also, can you answer Redivi's question in post #7?

This post has been edited by cabbyman: Mon, 13 Aug 2018 - 17:21


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Cabbyman 11 PPCs 0
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gas man
post Mon, 13 Aug 2018 - 19:37
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The vehicle made only one journey into and out of the car park.. maybe half an hour was an estinate on the low side tongue.gif
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gas man
post Thu, 23 Aug 2018 - 14:04
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Am i to wait until the last moment to send this or does that not matter?
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 23 Aug 2018 - 14:12
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Makes no difference.
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Jlc
post Thu, 23 Aug 2018 - 14:25
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QUOTE (gas man @ Mon, 13 Aug 2018 - 20:37) *
The vehicle made only one journey into and out of the car park.. maybe half an hour was an estinate on the low side tongue.gif

So is that estimate severely on the low side and it was 3 hours after all? (Clue: it makes a big difference to how this is handled)

The PCN claims to be 'issued under Protection of Freedoms Act' but is woefully inadequate as already noted - no reason to delay whatsoever.

This post has been edited by Jlc: Thu, 23 Aug 2018 - 14:28


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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