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Parking Control Management v My daughter, Gladstones Solicitors
Howard0181
post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 20:22
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Gladstones have started a County Court Claim against my daughter. Issue date is 12th August 2018

It is addressed to my daughter in her maiden name. She was married about one year ago.

To complex matters its been addressed to my home address which is her former address from about three years ago.

The first we realised about this was about three weeks ago when we had a letter before action from Gladstones. We emailed Gladstones and the parking company advising that they had written

to the wrong address and that this is the first we have been made aware of the allegation. No response.

My daughter is the RK of the car but she was not driving the car.

The Claim says "for breaching the terms of parking on the land at Redbridge Lane East - IG4"

Redbridge Lane East is a long road and there is absolutely no private parking in this road. There is Redbridge Underground Station Car Park so its possible that is the location.

The allegation is dated 1st September 2017 and my daughter and son in law have no recollection of this. We have no documentation.

Any advice please? My daughter is prepared to take this to Court.

This post has been edited by Howard0181: Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 20:14
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post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 20:22
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Eljayjay
post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 20:35
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The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims - google it for the precise wording - dictates that a claimant must give a potential defendant 30 days to respond to a letter of claim.

So, if they have issued the claim already within the 30-day period, they have acted prematurely.

Was the letter of action kept? If so, when was it dated?

This post has been edited by Eljayjay: Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 20:36
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Howard0181
post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 21:07
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Letter of Action dated 19th July 2018
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Eljayjay
post Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 21:35
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Just in case...

Do the letter before claim and the claim form relate to the same parking event?


On a separate note, it seems likely that your daughter failed to report the change of address on the vehicle’s V5. She needs to do that because it is an offence.

This post has been edited by Eljayjay: Wed, 15 Aug 2018 - 21:36
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Howard0181
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 06:45
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It the same date so its the same event...My daughter has changed the address details earlier this year....

What should we do now......

Thanks for any advice.
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ostell
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 08:12
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Did she change both her driving licence AND the registration details of the car?

Remove the hint of who could have been driving from the first post

This post has been edited by ostell: Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 08:13
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 09:12
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The DEFENDANT has to do all of this. Cannot be done FOR them.

They must go online using the details on the form, and ACKNOWLEGDE servvice. DO NOT contest jurisdiction unless the DEFENDANT lives outside england and wales. DO NOT start the defence. THIS IS KEY - if ANYTHING is put into the defence, THAT becomes the defence. Even a full stop.

this must be done today. THis gives 33 days from 12/08/18 to get the defence to the court.

Good job the defendant is prepared to "take" it to court, trouble is it is BEING taken to court for her. SHes not in control of this process, the claimant is.

Then teh defendant obviously needs to come up with a defence.

Assuming this is the Station car park, then that IS "private", but it is NOT relevant land IF there are byelaws in place - so the DEFENDANT needs to find this out. Dont ask how - google, visit site, etc. Do some legwork.

If it is NOT relevant land then IF they dont know who drove - whcih youve basically told them above, so get editing! - the keeper is NOT liable. If the keeper can prove THEY did not drive, then there is no possible liability. POFA Schedule 4 defines when a keeper is liable, and land with byelaws is not "erlevant land" for the purpose of this piece of legislation.
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ostell
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:05
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As it may be the station car park then the next time (soon!) that someone is in the area then check to see if byelaws are mention. Looking at the signs they very well could be.

Write to Gladstones and inform of the correct contact details in this matter. Send the letter first Clas and get a free certificate of posting from a Post Office.

GSV, as of August 2017, shows the station car park as NCP.

It is unreasonable, and contrary to the requirements of POFA, to not define the parking location. As you said Redbridge Lane East is a large area and covered and I am assuming that it is maintained by the local council and therefore not relevant land for the purpose of holding the keeper liable.

The first line of the defence will be that the PoC are embarrassing and do not clearly define the cause of action that gave rise to the alleged breach

Then it will be the road named is a road maintainable at public expense and therefore there can be no keeper liability

Perhaps mention the station car park, which is similarly not relevant land.

The keeper was not the driver at the time of the alleged breach.
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:07
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The defendant was not the driver.
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Howard0181
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:10
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Thanks for response. There are four people who potentially could drive this car. Looking at my daughters diary she was not driving the car.

What I mean is that we are fully prepared to defend this in court.
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nosferatu1001
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:40
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PLease confrim when the acknowledgemnt is done

You MUST then file a defence. A lot of people think - for some reason - they will then get told a date to submit a defence by. You do not get one, you already HAVE one - once acknowledged, 33 days from the date of issue.

The defendant must confirm the status of teh car park, as if you can show that either the location is a street, whcih is not relavnt land OR the location is a byelaw-controlled car park, then the Keeper of a vehicle has an absolute defence if they can ALSO show they were not driving.
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Eljayjay
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 11:46
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I would suggest that your daughter contacts the CCBC in Northampton and has a chat about the possibility of getting the claim struck out due to the Claimant’s failure to comply with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims. I suspect that, as the CCBC is simply an administration hub not staffed with legal eagles, they will probably say that your daughter will need to wait until the case is referred to a court and then taken up with the Judge to whom it is assigned.

I would further suggest that, in addition to what other poster's have recommended, your daughter should write to Gladstones to complain that both the letter of claim and the timing of the formal claim were non-compliant with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims.

Her letter will be a combined formal response to the letter of claim and a letter of complaint.

If you and your daughter have not read the Protocol from beginning to end, do so. You can google it and click on the justice.gov.uk entry to access it. Section 3 INITIAL INFORMATION TO BE PROVIDED BY THE CREDITOR lists what the letter of claim should contain. You and your daughter need to identify the information and documents missing from the letter of claim.

You could try something along the lines of the draft letter below. [Sadly, on pasting from Word, it has lost some of its formatting.] You may already know that, when sending letters to parking companies and their solicitors, you should use first-class mail, hand over the envelope at a Post Office counter, and request a free certificate of posting.


Dear <salutation>,

Thank you for your letter of claim dated <date of letter of claim>.

This letter is serves two purposes: it is a formal response to the letter of claim; and it is a complaint about your behaviour not only by failing to provide a letter of claim which complies with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims but also by failing to allow adequate time between issuing the letter of claim and commencing court proceedings.

Information and documents that should have been provided (but which you have failed to provide) in accordance with the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims are as follows:-

<list here everything which you have found to be missing>

I shall be grateful if you will explain why you have failed to provide the documents and information mentioned above and, of course, provide them now.

I shall also be grateful if you will explain why you failed to “enclose a copy of the Information Sheet and the Reply Form at Annex 1 to this Protocol” as required in paragraph 3.1©.

If you had supplied the requisite reply form, I would have ticked Box D and I would have stated that I still dispute the debt because, despite my previous representations, I have not received an adequate explanation as to why your client believes it has a right to any parking charge from me. In addition, I would have ticked Box I and would have stated that I need more documents or information in order to assess the validity or otherwise of your client’s claim.

The Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims does, of course, provide this further opportunity to narrow the issues between your client and myself following the issue of the letter of claim. Accordingly, I take that opportunity by requesting now the documents and information described below:-

1. evidence of ownership of the land;

2. the parking contract between your client and the owner or occupier of the land purporting to grant the right to your client to charge for parking on the land;

3. if the land is owned and/or occupied by a company and the parking contract has not been signed by a director of the company (readily identifiable as such by reference to the company’s records at Companies House), corroborative evidence from a director of the company (who is readily identifiable as such by reference to the company’s records at Companies House) that the signatory has been authorised to enter into the parking contract on behalf of the owner or occupier of the land;

4. if the land is owned and/or occupied by a company, corroborative evidence from a director of the company (who is readily identifiable as such by reference to the company’s records at Companies House) that the site plan is a true and accurate representation of the land which your client purports is the subject of the parking contract;

5. the accredited trade association’s code of practice to which your client claims to adhere;

6. a copy of the site plan provided by your client to its accredited trade association;

7. a copy of the written contract for the alleged debt;

8. notes giving details of the due diligence process undertaken by your client to ensure that not only the contract between your client and its principal but also the purported contract between your client and the driver met the “Implied term about care and skill” requirement contained in the Supply of Goods and Services Act 1982;

9. notes explaining how, under the rule of privity, a contract between your client and its principal can impose obligations on a person who is not a party to that contract;

10.a transcript of any previous judgement or judgments in any case or cases involving the same land and your client; and

11.any information and documents not mentioned above on which your client will rely in Court.

As you are no doubt aware, paragraph 5 of the Protocol reads as follows:-

5 DISCLOSURE OF DOCUMENTS

5.1 Early disclosure of documents and relevant information can help to clarify or resolve any issues in dispute. Where any aspect of the debt is disputed (including the amount, interest, charges, time for payment, or the creditor’s compliance with relevant statutes and regulations), the parties should exchange information and disclose documents sufficient to enable them to understand each other’s position.

5.2 If the debtor requests a document or information, the creditor must –

(a) provide the document or information; or

(b) explain why the document or information is unavailable,

within 30 days of receipt of the request.

Naturally, I fully expect your client (or your firm on its behalf) to meet the requirements mentioned paragraph 5.2 above.

Turning to the timing issue, in addition to Section 5 of the Protocol, I would also refer you to Section 4 RESPONSE BY THE DEBTOR which states:-

"In any event, the creditor should not start court proceedings less than 30 days from receipt of the completed Reply Form or 30 days from the creditor providing any documents requested by the debtor, whichever is the later."

In addition, I would refer you to Section 8 TAKING STOCK which states:-

"Where the debtor has responded to the Letter of Claim but agreement has not been reached, the creditor should give the debtor at least 14 days’ notice of their intention to start court proceedings, unless there are exceptional circumstances in which urgent action is required (for example, because the limitation period is about to expire)."

As there no exceptional circumstances, I shall be grateful if you will explain why you have blatantly ignored what the Protocol has to say about the timescales which apply between the letter of claim and the commencement of court proceedings.

Naturally, given your failings in complying with the Protocol, I shall apply to Court for the claim to be struck out.

Nevertheless, I do look forward to your reply.

Yours sincerely/faithfully,

<your daughter’s signature>

<your daughter’s full name>

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Howard0181
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 17:21
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Thanks


Its Redbridge Station Car Park run by this parking company. When I next go I will get a photo. I have acknowledged Court Claim.
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ostell
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 18:19
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But that's not what the PoC is saying, it is saying Redbridge Lane East. You should not be expected to guess where they mean. If the NTK is also giving the same location then it has failed. Has the running of the car park changed hands from NCP to Parking Control Management?

If it is suspected that it is the station car park then look for any mention of byelaws.

And edit that first post as requested.

This post has been edited by ostell: Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 18:21
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Howard0181
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 20:16
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I am going to the car park over the weekend but from memory there are no station bye laws. It the private car parking terms and conditions.

Thanks for all of the advice.
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ostell
post Fri, 17 Aug 2018 - 06:18
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If you have the original Notice to Keeper then post it up, suitably redacted. If not then email Gladstones and request that in order to narrow the issues, as the court would expect, would they please forward to you within 7 days all the documents that they intent to rely on in court. In particular the Notice to Keeper that their client issued. As they have raised a claim you will expect them to have all the documents to hand.

I am working on, as well as other items, if the NTK states the same location then they have failed 9 (2) (a) and hopefully no keeper liability. Can the keeper show she was elsewhere at the time?

Mention of Byelaws in the station car park may very well be on a seperate and inconspicuous notice.
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Howard0181
post Sat, 18 Aug 2018 - 19:59
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my daughter has a diary and she was not at this location on the said date.

Thanks for all the information. Very helpful
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Eljayjay
post Sat, 18 Aug 2018 - 21:16
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...but, even if she is not liable as the driver, if she does not provide the driver's name and address, she may be liable as the keeper.

If I were you, I would get your daughter to send the letter which I drafted for her.

She can always ask extra questions about POFA 2012 and so on when you know what to ask.
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