10 minute overstay - smart parking, Best route to appeal ticket? Options

[idontuseforums]

Hello - looking for advice please.

Been issued a parking charge notice by Smart Parking.

The overstay was a grand total of 10 minutes and 51 seconds.

Currently I have been through their internal appeal, explaining that it was a genuine mistake, we believed the time was paid for, and that we would be happy to pay for the time overstayed. This was rejected - surprise surprise. I have also written to the land owner and explained the situation, on the off chance they might be able to get it cancelled. But I don't want to just rely on this.

I've had success fighting a private car parking ticket before way back in 2015 by going through popla, but it looks like quite a lot has changed since then and seems like things aren't very clear at the moment with government guidance having seemingly been withdrawn?

I think I have a fairly solid argument in the grace period rule:
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2015/56...gulation/2/made

60 minutes was paid for, and the stay was 70 minutes and 51 seconds from entry to exit of the car park, as recorded via ANPR cameras. However there is no way that the car was actually stationary for more than 70 minutes, as it would have taken more than 51 seconds just to find a parking space having entered the car park.

Will this hold water, or do I need to go further? Since the Beavis case, can I still argue the fine is not based on a genuine pre estimate of loss, no commercial justification (we are after all a paying customer for the leisure centre) etc? Is there anything in signage? I know there aresome small signs dotted around, but I don't remember anything else, is it worth going back for evidence?

Any advice appreciated.

This post has been edited by idontuseforums: Mon, 27 Mar 2023 - 22:42

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[idontuseforums]

So the first point has been changed to say:

The BPA CoP Section 21.2 states:
"As long as the strict conditions of Schedule 4 are met, you may claim payment from the keeper or the hirer of the vehicle rather than from the driver"

The PoFA 2012 Schedule 4 Para (5) states the conditions which must be met for the purposes of claiming unpaid parking charges from the keeper of a vehicle:
"The first condition is that the creditor—
(a)has the right to enforce against the driver of the vehicle the requirement to pay the unpaid parking charges; but
(b)is unable to take steps to enforce that requirement against the driver because the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver."

Notice of the parking charge was delivered to me (the registered keeper) by post, and the driver has not been identified at any point. The keeper has been identified as paying for the parking and using the facilities of the landowner, but this does not in any way infer who was driving the vehicle at the time, and no presumption can be made from this - a vehicle can be driven by any person with the consent of the owner, as long as the driver is insured.

I have attached copies of the original Notice to Keeper, and a letter of response to my initial internal appeal, dated 22 March 2023.

It should be noted that neither the Notice to Keeper, nor the response letter, state that Smart Parking Ltd (the creditor) is attempting to hold the driver liable for the parking charge, nor has any other communication been made to this effect at any point. The creditor must therefore rely on keeper liability in order to claim the parking charge.

The PoFA Schedule 4 Para 9(2)(e) states that a notice which is given to the keeper of a vehicle must:
"state that the creditor does not know both the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and invite the keeper—
(i) to pay the unpaid parking charges; or
(ii)if the keeper was not the driver of the vehicle, to notify the creditor of the name of the driver and a current address for service for the driver and to pass the notice on to the driver"

As the notice does not state any of this information, it does not comply with the strict conditions of the PoFA Schedule 4 - as required by the BPA CoP Section 21.2 quoted above - and cannot be considered an enforceable Notice to Keeper.

hcandersen - I think that covers your point, if I have understood it correctly?

This post has been edited by idontuseforums: Wed, 5 Apr 2023 - 21:20

[idontuseforums]

Thank you all for your help on this. The appeal was withdrawn by Smart Parking:

"Dear xxxx,

The operator has contacted us and told us that they have withdrawn your appeal.

If you have already paid your parking charge, this is the reason your appeal will have been withdrawn. Unfortunately, you cannot pay your parking charge and appeal, which means that POPLA’s involvement in your appeal has ended. You will not be able to request a refund of the amount paid in order to resubmit your appeal to us.

If you have not paid your parking charge, the operator has reviewed your appeal and chosen to cancel the parking charge. As the operator has withdrawn your appeal, POPLA’s involvement has now ended and you do not need to take any further action.

Kind regards

POPLA Team"

They clearly realised they were going to lose and didn't even bother to fight it!

The final appeal I used is attached if it is of use to anyone in future.

Thanks again.


Edit: The forum won't let me upload the final version. Nevermind.

This post has been edited by idontuseforums: Tue, 25 Apr 2023 - 18:36

[DWMB2]

Smart Parking doing their usual trick of pulling out at the last minute.

Good result, well done!

You'll need to use a third party site if you want to upload anything. Alternatively, copy and paste it into the thread.

This post has been edited by DWMB2: Tue, 25 Apr 2023 - 19:05

[Redx]

Thank you all for your help on this. The appeal was withdrawn by Smart Parking:

They clearly realised they were going to lose and didn't even bother to fight it!

The final appeal I used is attached if it is of use to anyone in future.

Thanks again.


Edit: The forum won't let me upload the final version. Nevermind.

Use postimg or imgbb or imgur or a similar hosting site and add links, for files

[idontuseforums]

Here you go

https://docdro.id/Msm48jY