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[NIP Wizard] 68 in a 70, but in a van.
fonzie
post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 11:58
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This was a fixed camera on the A1, heading North at Barrowby Thorns, I've passed this camera hundreds of times and never been flashed, so very very surprised to be caught as it's a 70 mile stretch for a car, but I was in a van, on cruise as well, the really annoying thing is this is at the bottom of a slight downward hill so your vehicle speeds up a little.

I really think I've got to take this on the chin and cough up some cash, but would still like to hear of any advice (except the obvious, stick to 60).

I always wondered if the cameras were intelligent enough to know if you were driving a van, I guess that questions ben answered now.






NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? -
Date of the offence: - November 2018
Date of the NIP: - 4 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 5 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - A1, Barrowby Thorns, United Kingdom
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - Not known
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? -
How many current points do you have? - 0
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - Travelling at 68 MPH on the A1 in a van.

Straight road, 7:30pm, a car travelling at a slightly faster speed next to me.



NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - Yes
Did the first NIP arrive within 14 days? - Yes
Although you are the Registered Keeper, were you also the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v3.3.2: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 11:58:42 +0000

This post has been edited by fonzie: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 12:08
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post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 11:58
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Logician
post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 12:57
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Could your vehicle be described as a ‘car-derived van’ which means a goods vehicle which is constructed or adapted as a derivative of a passenger vehicle and which has a maximum laden weight not exceeding 2 tonnes? That would have the same speed limits as a car.

Otherwise, you should be offered a course, provided you have not done one for an offence within the last three years. If not eligible, then it will be a fixed penalty.


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Jlc
post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 13:31
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Enforcement begins at 68mph, perhaps previously you've just been under...


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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KH_
post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 18:03
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QUOTE (fonzie @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 11:58) *
I always wondered if the cameras were intelligent enough to know if you were driving a van, I guess that questions ben answered now.


This Camera (when it was there) was known to ignore cars but flash trucks exceeding their specific limit.

I used to take great joy in driving past it at 62/63ish in a 7.5 ton, knowing I'd get flashed. Obviously, behave myself in the trucks with a 50 limit...

There were a few on that stretch, not all of them, that seemed to know the difference between cars and larger vehicles.
Maybe that's why they've gone, drivers causing work when no ticket would be due smile.gif

[Edit:] I really should proof read, 52/53, behave in a truck with a 40 limit...

This post has been edited by KH_: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 18:06
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fonzie
post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 20:31
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No, it's a 3.5 tonner.
I do have a Berlingo as well, I know that's classed as a car for speed limits.

I've not had a course in the last three years, so hopefully will be offered the course.

QUOTE (Logician @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 12:57) *
Could your vehicle be described as a ‘car-derived van’ which means a goods vehicle which is constructed or adapted as a derivative of a passenger vehicle and which has a maximum laden weight not exceeding 2 tonnes? That would have the same speed limits as a car.

Otherwise, you should be offered a course, provided you have not done one for an offence within the last three years. If not eligible, then it will be a fixed penalty.



QUOTE (Jlc @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 13:31) *
Enforcement begins at 68mph, perhaps previously you've just been under...



I think that must be the case, I've passed it hundreds of times, never an issue.

I did wonder if they've upgraded the camera recently.

Really annoyed with myself for getting caught on a road I know so well.





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andy_foster
post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 20:33
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QUOTE (fonzie @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 11:58) *
Straight road, 7:30pm, a car travelling at a slightly faster speed next to me.


It might be worth writing to them asking for 'photos to help to identify the driver' if there is a possibility that the speed recorded was the car not you.


--------------------
Andy

Some people think that I make them feel stupid. To be fair, they deserve most of the credit.
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fonzie
post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 20:36
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I think it's a stupid law, 60 for a modern van on a dual carriageway, but 70 on a motorway, there's just no logic to it.






QUOTE (KH_ @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 18:03) *
QUOTE (fonzie @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 11:58) *
I always wondered if the cameras were intelligent enough to know if you were driving a van, I guess that questions ben answered now.


This Camera (when it was there) was known to ignore cars but flash trucks exceeding their specific limit.

I used to take great joy in driving past it at 62/63ish in a 7.5 ton, knowing I'd get flashed. Obviously, behave myself in the trucks with a 50 limit...

There were a few on that stretch, not all of them, that seemed to know the difference between cars and larger vehicles.
Maybe that's why they've gone, drivers causing work when no ticket would be due smile.gif

[Edit:] I really should proof read, 52/53, behave in a truck with a 40 limit...

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The Rookie
post Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 21:59
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QUOTE (fonzie @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 20:36) *
I think it's a stupid law, 60 for a modern van on a dual carriageway, but 70 on a motorway, there's just no logic to it.

It’s hopelessly out of date, but it is what it is.


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There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
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cp8759
post Thu, 15 Nov 2018 - 15:36
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QUOTE (fonzie @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 20:36) *
I think it's a stupid law, 60 for a modern van on a dual carriageway, but 70 on a motorway, there's just no logic to it.

There's no logic to say that you can walk along a dual carriageway (in fact there's gaps in the barriers for pedestrians to cross) but not a motorway, or that learners can drive on a dual carriageway but not a motorway (subject to the exception for those driving with an approved instructor), and at the same time that the absolute speed limit on both is 70 mph. Basically all the distinctions between dual carriageways and motorways are meaningless. But the law is what it is.


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southpaw82
post Thu, 15 Nov 2018 - 16:28
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I thought the restrictions on learners and motorways had been lifted?


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Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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Logician
post Thu, 15 Nov 2018 - 17:15
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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Thu, 15 Nov 2018 - 16:28) *
I thought the restrictions on learners and motorways had been lifted?


Only partly, as CP8759 says, learners can only drive on them with an approved driving instructor, and in fact in a dual control car. LINK



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Jimzzr
post Thu, 15 Nov 2018 - 18:39
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QUOTE (fonzie @ Tue, 13 Nov 2018 - 21:31) *
I do have a Berlingo as well, I know that's classed as a car for speed limits.


Are you absolutely sure about that?

http://forums.pepipoo.com/lofiversion/inde.../t106958-0.html

you might want to check your v5 or avoid cornwall
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kernow2015
post Fri, 16 Nov 2018 - 06:33
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Check your vehicle type approval - M1 is car limits but N1 is goods vehicles and as such subject to the lower limits.
They are more aware of vans and their lower limits these days, so if there's a NIP the chances of it being incorrectly issued are slim.
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