Unpaid PCN - Enforcement agent Options

[eldrago12]

I have just received this letter. It reports my name on it but not the address where I'm living. It reports the registered office address of my LTD company. Now, at this registered office address I don't have a physical office but it's just a mail forwarding service and all official government mail is scanned and emailed to me within 1 working day.

I don't own a car so the only way this could happen is while renting a car. I indeed often use Zipcar for moving in London for work reasons, I usually rent cars for a few hours. On Zipcar I pay with my LTD company debit card so the billing address on Zipcar (the rental company) is the registered office address of my LTD company.

The problem is that I never got any letters related to any PCNs in the past so this is the first one and given it's amount (513£) I believe that this is something that may have occured months ago as I was using a lot Zipcar at the end of 2017-beginning 2018.



I don't know what to do as the amount is quite important.

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[eldrago12]

I don't see how I could know about it if they have been sending it to the wrong address.

Hang on; in what way was it wrong? Is is different to the address you used when registering with zip?

As I said above Zip doesn't require an address when registering. They ask you just the billing address (they confirmed me today over the phone this). In my case the billing address on Zipcar is the billing of my business debit card. And for obvious reasons the address of the business debit card must match the registered office address of the business.

[Neil B]

Ok, so not wrong then: They gave TH the only address they had.

[Neil B]

Zipcar will always inform a Member which one of these two courses of action it has taken

and they didn't?

---

We are looking for angles that will help you with the only course of action available; an 'out of time' application
to file a Witness Statement, to possibly reset the matter.
You need to work fast.

Also, would this affect my credit rating

No.
Can't be listed.

[eldrago12]

Zipcar will always inform a Member which one of these two courses of action it has taken

and they didn't?

---

We are looking for angles that will help you with the only course of action available; an 'out of time' application
to file a Witness Statement, to possibly reset the matter.
You need to work fast.

Also, would this affect my credit rating

No.
Can't be listed.

Thank you again.

So from what I understand it's useless at this stage getting in touch with the council? Also, should I ge in touch with the Northampton County Court Traffic Enforcement Centre?



Should I fill this form:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/...of-time-parking

And also te9 form?

[eldrago12]

Zipcar will always inform a Member which one of these two courses of action it has taken

and they didn't?

---

We are looking for angles that will help you with the only course of action available; an 'out of time' application
to file a Witness Statement, to possibly reset the matter.
You need to work fast.

Also, would this affect my credit rating

No.
Can't be listed.

Thank you again.

So from what I understand it's useless at this stage getting in touch with the council? Also, should I ge in touch with the Northampton County Court Traffic Enforcement Centre?



Should I fill this form:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/...of-time-parking

And also te9 form?

Can anyone help what should I do? Contact the council or Northampton County Court Traffic Enforcement Centre?

[Neil B]

Should I fill this form:
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/...of-time-parking

And also te9 form?

Yes and yes.
You have to understand what you are doing and complete carefully. We recommend you show members here a draft before filing.

TE7 is a request to file TE9 late.

[eldrago12]

Thank you again Neil. Is there anyway to make a donation to this forum?

[Neil B]

You need to back up statements with documentary evidence (see attached xxxxx) and actually include the addresses you are talking about.

It is always difficult to know what to write: See this thread for further thoughts (you are not alone!)
http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showto...120961&st=0

Other than that, it's not bad actually but focus a little on saying, specifically, that you did not receive statutory
notices. What you did receive is relevant because it alerted you but is somewhat secondary.

The sentence 'Maroon' used, nicked from another case, re wanting to 'settle' the matter, might help discourage TH from objecting.

There is a 4pm processing deadline each day at TEC, so you have time to hone it. But, more importantly, whatever you are
happy with.

[hcandersen]

You must set the context and not leap straight in.

At present I’m still unclear.

Your references to ‘you’ confuse matters. You are not you, you are an officer of the company and if the hire agreement with Zip Car was in the company’s name then you as you have no liability whatsoever and we can shoot this hare.

By whom was the vehicle hired? This has nothing to do with whose credit card pays invoices or whose account might be debited, IMO it is simply a case of in whose name was the vehicle hired?

If yours and there is no mention in the contract of you as an officer of the company, then the person liable is you as you.

If the company, then no liability attaches to you as you.

Nothng to do with addresses, just the contract.

The answer is....

[eldrago12]

You must set the context and not leap straight in.

At present I’m still unclear.

Your references to ‘you’ confuse matters. You are not you, you are an officer of the company and if the hire agreement with Zip Car was in the company’s name then you as you have no liability whatsoever and we can shoot this hare.

By whom was the vehicle hired? This has nothing to do with whose credit card pays invoices or whose account might be debited, IMO it is simply a case of in whose name was the vehicle hired?

If yours and there is no mention in the contract of you as an officer of the company, then the person liable is you as you.

If the company, then no liability attaches to you as you.

Nothng to do with addresses, just the contract.

The answer is....

The hire contract with Zipcar is in my name. Zipcar made the mistake of passing to the council the billing address of the payment card used for the hire. The payment card used for the hire is my ltd company business card.

IMO I never received any postage related to the PCN at my home address.

Instead this postage was sent to the billing address of my business card. That billing address is just a registered office address service (ltd companies often use this kind of service). At this billing address there is no physical office, it's just a mail forwarding service. You can google it: 20-22 Wenlock Road. There are thousands of companies registered at that address. Their duty is to forward official government mail received for routine matters with Companies House and HMRC.

Hope this helps.

This post has been edited by eldrago12: Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 23:24

[stamfordman]

So, what seems to have happened is that the council sent the PCN etc to your name at the billing address, but the forwarding is only done for your company name?


If you have a permanent home address I'd get rid of this mailbox idea - I run a ltd company from home and everything is sent to me at one place.

[eldrago12]

So, what seems to have happened is that the council sent the PCN etc to your name at the billing address, but the forwarding is only done for your company name?


If you have a permanent home address I'd get rid of this mailbox idea - I run a ltd company from home and everything is sent to me at one place.

I'm renting and landlords usually forbid to use a regitered office address for a company when you're a tenant. For that reason many use these registered office addresses service. Their duty is to forward just official mails from the government.

[eldrago12]

[eldrago12]

I have just sent them an email with the signed forms te7/te9. Hope this works. Will keep you informed

[hcandersen]

Does Schedule 2 not apply to your hiring agreement?

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2000/2546/made

So, OP, you were required to supply your drivng licence details to Zip Car, and of course these would have shown your real address. Similarly, you had to insert an address in your hiring agreement.

Your account is that these were different.

The details which the registered keeper is required to supply to the authority do not have anythng to do with who pays and billing addresses, there are prescribed elements in agreements and I’m still confused, as much because you are interpreting telephone conversations and not posting letters or emails which contain the replies which you say you received.

But the point of this post is to test the approach to your OOT. If you supplied the company with your own address, as you should have been required to do by virtue of your driving licence, then you might claim that this is the address you expected and required them to use, but which for reasons unknown to you and beyond your control they did not. Therefore unbeknown to the authority they were sending notices to an invalid address. Clearly no blame attaches to them, but nonetheless the outcome is unfair as you have not been able to deal with the penalty in a timely fashion.

This post has been edited by hcandersen: Sat, 23 Jun 2018 - 09:38

[eldrago12]

Does Schedule 2 not apply to your hiring agreement?

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2000/2546/made

So, OP, you were required to supply your drivng licence details to Zip Car, and of course these would have shown your real address. Similarly, you had to insert an address in your hiring agreement.

Your account is that these were different.

The details which the registered keeper is required to supply to the authority do not have anythng to do with who pays and billing addresses, there are prescribed elements in agreements and I’m still confused, as much because you are interpreting telephone conversations and not posting letters or emails which contain the replies which you say you received.

But the point of this post is to test the approach to your OOT. If you supplied the company with your own address, as you should have been required to do by virtue of your driving licence, then you might claim that this is the address you expected and required them to use, but which for reasons unknown to you and beyond your control they did not. Therefore unbeknown to the authority they were sending notices to an invalid address. Clearly no blame attaches to them, but nonetheless the outcome is unfair as you have not been able to deal with the penalty in a timely fashion.

Thanks hcandersen for your detailed answer. Zipcar has a copy of my driving licence and I rented cars abroad in the past and in one occasion I got a fine during a rental which was sent to the address on the driving licence as everyone would expect. This is Zipcar's answer in relation to the address passed to the Council.



So according to Zipcar they can disclose just the billing address to the Council. Is this true?

Also, haven't got any reply back after sending te7/te9 forms? What should happen next?

This post has been edited by eldrago12: Mon, 2 Jul 2018 - 12:27

[Neil B]

Also, haven't got any reply back after sending te7/te9 forms?

No acknowledgement e-mail ?

What should happen next?

The process takes weeks.
You should periodically check with TEC, from about 18 days onwards, increasing frequency as time passes.

[hcandersen]

Their reference to billing address is tosh.

They are required to supply to the authority the address of the person who signed the hiring agreement.

[eldrago12]

More than 1 month now and I haven't received any letters/emails from TEC. Are they supposed to call me or email me? I have just got the "TEC Acknowledgment" on 22n June and nothing else.

[Neil B]

More than 1 month now and I haven't received any letters/emails from TEC. Are they supposed to call me or email me? I have just got the "TEC Acknowledgment" on 22n June and nothing else.

Out of thousands of cases at any one time you won't be getting courtesy phone calls !

See post #37