Multiple PCNs for parking in flat car park |
Multiple PCNs for parking in flat car park |
Sun, 2 Jul 2017 - 19:58
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#1
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
At the end of 2016 the block of flats I live in introduced parking permits and PCNs.
I didn't actually get a permit through the post, but most people did in the block. Consequently the car I own which was parked in the car park had 7 PCNs within a 4 week period and the total invoice is £1,160 I ignored the letters that came in the post, but now they have sent me the attached letters for a not insubstantial amount Does the fact that I didn't get a permit through the post before they enforced the tickets count as a defence? Eventually they sent me one by recorded delivery at which point I had had several tickets. Quite miffed to be PCNd in my own home. This post has been edited by HenryHippo: Sun, 2 Jul 2017 - 19:59 |
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Sun, 2 Jul 2017 - 19:58
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Sun, 3 Dec 2017 - 17:23
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#241
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
It's worth asking the court why. Is it because the Court requires this or because the other side has requested a deferment. If the latter then I'd be inclined to ask the Court what the reason is and say that it's not convenient for you since you've planned your business around the original date and ask the Court to either re-instate the original date or bring it forward as much as possible. Here's the actual letter they sent: Small Claims Trial listed to take place on 8/12/17 has been adjourned until 16/3/18 and has been relisted as a Fixture Also it mentions that 2 hours has been allowed for the trial. There wasn't a duration for the case before and it wasn't a "fixture" either It is also at a "Hearing Center" at the law courts I will call the court this week to ask what is going on, but any ideas? https://www.dropbox.com/s/1qu3cmcwbuinri1/C...edited.jpg?dl=0 |
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Thu, 7 Dec 2017 - 11:59
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#242
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
Called the court.
Original date was a provisional date that can be bumped if something more urgent comes up in court. A "fixture" should in theory never be bumped and will go ahead The 14 day to respond deadline has now been moved in line with the new court date. Makes no odds to this case as both parties responded in time, but it is annoying for my other case as the other party were late to respond and now won't be punished for it The court confirmed that there were no other changes to the case than the date move |
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Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 14:16
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#243
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
4 weeks to go now until it kicks off again
Do I need to do anything apart from reread my defense and turn up to court? (i.e. I don't need to resubmit my documents) Are the other party able to add anything else to their case, or did the "submit documents within 14 days" apply to the original Dec 17 date and not the new date? |
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Tue, 20 Feb 2018 - 14:20
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#244
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Member Group: Members Posts: 28,687 Joined: 27 Nov 2007 Member No.: 15,642 |
It applied to the original date, as that is what the Order specified
THey can try to add stuff now, but you can always object if reasonable. |
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Wed, 21 Feb 2018 - 21:57
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#245
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
Great. Will of course object to anything new on the day
I also own another car which has also attracted its fair share of tickets a few months after the car in this thread. Tickets and threats followed on the 2nd car too, but no legal action has been instigated. Shows that UKPC aren't confident about this case, or they would have gone after both cars simultaneously |
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Wed, 21 Feb 2018 - 22:26
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#246
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Member Group: Members Posts: 28,687 Joined: 27 Nov 2007 Member No.: 15,642 |
That assumes intelligence on their part. I’d always go with incompetence myself
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Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 19:35
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#247
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
UKPC are getting really cheeky now
This morning 10+ cars received PCNs (inc mine). All but one of them had a permit. The PCNs all claimed parking without a valid permit. Everyone had a permit properly displayed Very odd tactics, are they just mass ticketing cars with permits in the hope that a small % pay, as clearly this would have an even worse chance in court than my case |
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Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 19:59
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#248
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Member Group: Members Posts: 353 Joined: 19 Dec 2017 Member No.: 95,634 |
UKPC are getting really cheeky now This morning 10+ cars received PCNs (inc mine). All but one of them had a permit. The PCNs all claimed parking without a valid permit. Everyone had a permit properly displayed Very odd tactics, are they just mass ticketing cars with permits in the hope that a small % pay, as clearly this would have an even worse chance in court than my case be a kind soul and print out some flyers and put them on people vehicles explaining scam. |
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Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 21:16
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#249
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
UKPC has a lot of form for faking photographs and ticketing cars on land they don't manage
This could be yet another rogue operative It's also possible that the Management Agent has kicked out UKPC and it's having a last feeding frenzy It's certainly time to demand that they are kicked out In my view, this is a case where it's better not to appeal on Day 26 Instead let UKPC set themselves up for nine complaints to DVLA for requesting keeper details without reasonable cause Everybody can also appeal and refer to the mass ticketing UKPC has to either admit the operative's action or refuse the appeals If the appeals are refused, everybody makes a second appeal to POPLA and provides witness statements for each others Whatever the result of the first appeal, everybody complains to the BPA |
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Mon, 26 Feb 2018 - 09:42
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#250
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Member Group: Members Posts: 9,985 Joined: 20 Aug 2008 Member No.: 21,992 |
UKPC also have a track record of incentivising staff based in number of tickets issued (something which is not encouraged within the industry, but UKPC don't care). Maybe your local rep has had a poor month on the fixed odds betting machine down at Ladbrokes.
-------------------- Sometimes I use big words I don't understand in an effort to make myself sound more photosynthesis.
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Mon, 26 Feb 2018 - 22:06
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#251
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
It's a great idea, but speaking to people here and they are scared of UKPC.
I told them "not showing a permit is irrelevant, the lease mentions nothing about permits" then they say "but my permit was real, I don't want this to go to court, i will appeal to UKPC about the permit being displayed and real" So they are clinging to the defence of the permit being on display, and either not hearing or not believing me when I mention the permit doesn't actually have to be displayed. Perhaps when their appeals are declined at UKPC they will look deeper into the picture No helping some people! |
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Mon, 26 Feb 2018 - 23:22
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#252
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Member Group: Members Posts: 442 Joined: 14 Feb 2015 Member No.: 75,738 |
You have done as much as you can.
Take some solace from the fact that you simply cannot educate pork. |
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Mon, 26 Feb 2018 - 23:45
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#253
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
Another guy who got a ticket when he had a permit on display, told me confidently that he will win his appeal with UKPC, because once he was ticketed by a council and got that appealed for insufficient signage
Definitely not the same.. |
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Tue, 27 Feb 2018 - 01:31
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#254
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
There are times that I quite support the saying that it's immoral to let a sucker keep his money
Your neighbours' attitude is very common A few years ago I was talking to a ParkingEye representative at a trade show and expressed surprised that so many parking notices were paid when people only had to Google his company He looked at me like I was an idiot and told me that in fact very few people do He said that 80-85% paid up as soon as the notice arrived and most of the remainder followed after one reminder |
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Tue, 27 Feb 2018 - 04:20
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#255
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Member Group: Members Posts: 56,196 Joined: 9 Sep 2003 From: Warwickshire Member No.: 317 |
This morning 10+ cars received PCNs (inc mine). All but one of them had a permit. The PCNs all claimed parking without a valid permit. Everyone had a permit properly displayed This is another PPC (and UKPC have form for it) trick, they change the permits but know full well that the new permits take time to cascade down to the individuals concerned and then starting ticketing those with the old permit........ -------------------- There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!
S172's Rookies 1-0 Kent Council PCN's Rookies 1-0 Warwick Rookies 1-0 Birmingham PPC PCN's Rookies 10-0 PPC's |
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Tue, 27 Feb 2018 - 09:33
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#256
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
This morning 10+ cars received PCNs (inc mine). All but one of them had a permit. The PCNs all claimed parking without a valid permit. Everyone had a permit properly displayed This is another PPC (and UKPC have form for it) trick, they change the permits but know full well that the new permits take time to cascade down to the individuals concerned and then starting ticketing those with the old permit........ Good point |
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Sun, 11 Mar 2018 - 18:56
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#257
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
Friday 16th is the day
Do I need to submit the below cost schedule on Monday, or can I bring it with me to the trial? If they are unreasonable then you can claim LIP rate of £19 ph for time defending AND your time in counterclaiming, itemised separately. Please see below my costs. Broken down into main and then counterclaim. Any feedback? Defendant’s Cost Schedule: Costs of attending Court 1. Lost earnings for a half day of work. I earn £200 a day, therefore I will claim the maximum of £95.00 2. Mileage to court. 40 miles at £0.45 per mile. £18.00 3. Parking for 3 hours. £11.00 SUBTOTAL: £124.00 Time Spent Reading: 4. Statement of Claim Form: 30 minutes. 0.5 hours 5. Emailing FirstPort three times: 10 minutes x 3. 0.5 hours 6. Official Copy of Register: 15 minutes. 0.25 hours 7. Lease: 1 hour 8. Chartered Trust V Davies: 30 minutes. 0.5 hours 9. Popla 2015: 30 minutes. 0.5 hours 10. Letter to SCS Jul 2017: 30 minutes. 0.5 hours Time Spent Drafting: 11. Acknowledgement of Service Form: 30 minutes. 0.5 hours 12. Statement of Defence: 4 hours 13. Directions Questionnaire: 30 minutes. 0.5 hours 14. Witness Statement: 4 hours 15. Administration (printing, scanning, assembling documents and time to post): 2 hours TOTAL TIME: 16.75 hours at £19.00 per hour = £318.25 Disbursements 16. Printing of documents: 100 pages at £0.10 per page = £10.00 17. Postage of Witness Statement to Court = £2.50 18. Postage of Witness Statement to SCS = £2.50 Subtotal: £15.00 GRAND TOTAL: £457.25 Signed Henry Hippo Defendants Counter Claim Cost Schedule Time Spent Reading 1. Telegraph Article: 15 minutes. 0.25 hours 2. Consumer Rights Act 2015: 30 minutes. 0.5 hours 3. Data Protection Act 1998: 1 hour 4. Parking Eye V Beavis: 1 hour 5. IPC Code of Practice: 1 hour 6. Ferguson V British Gas: 1 hour 7. Vidall-Hall V Google: 1 hour 8. Halliday V Creation: 1 hour Time Spent Drafting 9. Counter Claim: 3 hours 10. Administration (printing, scanning, assembling documents and time to post): 2 hours TOTAL TIME: 11.75 hours at £19.00 per hour = £223.25 Disbursements 1. Printing of documents: 100 pages at £0.10 per page = £10.00 2. Counter Claim Fee = £35.00 Subtotal: £45.00 GRAND TOTAL: £268.25 Signed Henry Hippo |
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Sun, 11 Mar 2018 - 20:20
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#258
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18,751 Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Member No.: 32,130 |
You must get a copy emailed to Gladstones and a copy to the court, ideally not less than 48 hours before the hearing. Print off proof of sending.
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Sun, 11 Mar 2018 - 22:24
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#259
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Member Group: Members Posts: 235 Joined: 17 Mar 2017 Member No.: 90,917 |
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Mon, 12 Mar 2018 - 00:05
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#260
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Member Group: Members Posts: 18,751 Joined: 20 Sep 2009 Member No.: 32,130 |
Personally I would hand deliver things to court as a hard copy.
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