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Innovation Group threatening to sue me because my insurance won't pay, I was at fault for minor accident
Panda66
post Thu, 15 Feb 2018 - 21:44
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Was involved in accident last year in which I was at fault for.

I filled out the form to my own insurance company when they informed me about the 3rd party claim against me. Admitted guilt to them.

Got a letter today from some company called "Innovation Group" saying my insurance is refusing to pay for their client's hire charges (and to call my insurance company, etc.).

Letter says:
"Given that you were responsible for the accident, should legal action become necessary, a Country Court claim will be issued against you directly".

Firstly, I'm wondering what is the likelihood of me being sued personally if my insurance refuses to pay them? I didn't pay for the extra legal expenses cover with my insurance company.

Secondly, I keep getting letters from random claims management companies accusing me of causing accident on different dates (not the actual date of above accident) and demanding my insurance details. Is this person trying to make up more false claims against me?

My insurance company said they rejected his personal injury claim and will force the matter to court.

I did a Google search and it seems his brother (or very close relative, as it looks so much like him) was recently jailed for 2 years for insurance fraud (face pic in news report, mentions street and full name).

This post has been edited by Panda66: Thu, 15 Feb 2018 - 21:46
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post Thu, 15 Feb 2018 - 21:44
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DancingDad
post Thu, 15 Feb 2018 - 21:49
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Pass hire company letter to your insurance to deal with, inform other party that you have done so.
Tell claims management companies to do one.
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Fredd
post Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 07:31
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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Thu, 15 Feb 2018 - 21:49) *
Tell claims management companies to do one.

I'd suggest passing those letters on to the insurance company, too. If they relate to a claim (genuine or not) then your insurer needs to deal with them; if they're fraudulent then your insurer will have the full picture and can involve the police if necessary. There's no point in the OP risking not having told his insurer about an actual claim.


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The Rookie
post Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 08:48
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QUOTE (Panda66 @ Thu, 15 Feb 2018 - 22:44) *
Firstly, I'm wondering what is the likelihood of me being sued personally if my insurance refuses to pay them? I didn't pay for the extra legal expenses cover with my insurance company.

Fairly likely (depending on how good they think their chances of success are), your insurance company isn't liable for the losses incurred by the other party, you are, the fact your insurance is there to cover your liability doesn't change that. You get sued and your insurer pays if you loose, that's why you must keep them fully in the loop.


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PASTMYBEST
post Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 08:57
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My insurance company said they rejected his personal injury claim and will force the matter to court.


Insurance companies are taking this stance more often these days. They are still liable to indemnify you if it happened that it went to court and you lost.


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Fredd
post Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 09:01
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 08:48) *
You get sued and your insurer pays if you loose, that's why you must keep them fully in the loop.

Yes, except that in practice the insurer decides whether to defend the claim, and will run any defence (on your behalf, of course) itself - it isn't some passive entity that's just "kept in the loop".


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The Rookie
post Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 09:05
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QUOTE (Fredd @ Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 10:01) *
QUOTE (The Rookie @ Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 08:48) *
You get sued and your insurer pays if you loose, that's why you must keep them fully in the loop.

Yes, except that in practice the insurer decides whether to defend the claim, and will run any defence (on your behalf, of course) itself - it isn't some passive entity that's just "kept in the loop".

Indeed, sorry my post wasn't clear in that respect...yes your insurer will either decide to pay out or not, and if not they will supply your defence. That is the situation I had, rather fortunately as their claim failed and my counterclaim succeeded (when I had decided it wasn't worth using my own money for a claim).


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samthecat
post Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 09:47
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Its not surprising that more insurance companies are pushing back against inflated claims from accident management companies.

A colleague currently has an Audi A4 3.0 courtesy car whilst his is being repaired, this is £200 per day and he's had it for a month. The repair to his car hasn't been started yet, but when it is completed is unlikely to be more than a couple of grand. Add in a bit of personal injury and a minor bump will end up costing the thick end of 20k.

I'm waiting for his shocked indignation when the claim goes less than smoothly or he ends up with a bill for the excessive hire charges.....


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Redivi
post Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 13:27
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My father had a similar situation when a neighbour caught his Focus wheel-arch and wanted to put it through his insurance instead of paying in cash

My father's insurance company insisted that the repair was performed at its authorised repair company
The car had two long journey's on a low loader and my father was told that, if he didn't accept the Galaxy courtesy car, he would have to process the repair itself

Not surprisingly, the neighbour's insurance company refused to pay £2000 for a wheel-arch repair and my father's company issued a claim
He was told that, if he didn't visit their appointed solicitor to provide a statement, he would be billed for the full amount himself

He called the solicitor and explained that his statement would include the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth
This would include the £400 quote from the reputable local repairer that he'd told the neighbour and what the hire company had actually charged for the courtesy car
For some reason he was told shortly afterwards that his statement was no longer required
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notmeatloaf
post Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 13:59
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QUOTE (samthecat @ Fri, 16 Feb 2018 - 09:47) *
I'm waiting for his shocked indignation when the claim goes less than smoothly or he ends up with a bill for the excessive hire charges.....

The issue is that insurance companies reject almost any claim someone tries to bring which forces people into claim management companies.

About a year ago I was knocked off my pushbike by a BMW. Zero dispute about fault. My losses totalled about £500 all in for repairs and some agency work I had to cancel. Obviously both are easily documented.

Insurance company refused to even discuss a direct claim because apparently they do not deal with cyclists so it has gone through solicitors who have had to get a consultant report which has probably cost more than the agency work in the first place.

God knows how much it will all cost but I would imagine several times what it would ever be if they had just paid in the first place. Chap who knocked me off will probably rightly be incensed at the cost of repairing a pushbike but what other choice do you have?

(FWIW the chap did offer to pay at the scene but he also gave a false numberplate so I'm not really especially minded to trust him.)

This post has been edited by notmeatloaf: Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 14:02
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4101
post Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 16:52
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Armchair lawyers may like this

http://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWHC/QB/2017/3088.html

crash for cash gorn wrong.
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notmeatloaf
post Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 17:14
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Always an enjoyable read.

QUOTE
Might it be mere coincidence that over a two-month period in the Autumn of 2011 the six drivers in the six alleged crashes were all victims of negligent driving in North London by six different middle-aged East European cleaners from Margate (or some other seaside town in the South East) who were many miles from home, driving old cars which had only just been insured TPF&T with LVI? The answer, obviously, is no.


You have to wonder about people that would take out false insurance policies, stage fake crashes, use a fake claims management company - and then tell all their family what a great idea it is as well.
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4101
post Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 17:25
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QUOTE (notmeatloaf @ Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 17:14) *
Always an enjoyable read.

QUOTE
Might it be mere coincidence that over a two-month period in the Autumn of 2011 the six drivers in the six alleged crashes were all victims of negligent driving in North London by six different middle-aged East European cleaners from Margate (or some other seaside town in the South East) who were many miles from home, driving old cars which had only just been insured TPF&T with LVI? The answer, obviously, is no.


You have to wonder about people that would take out false insurance policies, stage fake crashes, use a fake claims management company - and then tell all their family what a great idea it is as well.



https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/03/crash...cash-insurance/

get a dashcam
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DancingDad
post Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 18:02
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QUOTE (4101 @ Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 17:25) *


QUOTE
It said the worst postcode for ‘induced accidents’ in the whole of the UK is Birmingham’s B11 postal zone, spanning the areas of Sparkhill, Sparkbrook and Tyseley.

Comes as no great surprise seeing those areas topping the list.
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4101
post Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 18:21
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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 18:02) *
QUOTE (4101 @ Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 17:25) *


QUOTE
It said the worst postcode for ‘induced accidents’ in the whole of the UK is Birmingham’s B11 postal zone, spanning the areas of Sparkhill, Sparkbrook and Tyseley.

Comes as no great surprise seeing those areas topping the list.



Ahem, no comment.
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bill w
post Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 20:03
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I've never quite worked out the logistics of installing a dashcam, due to having 8 vehicles, 4 bikes and 4 four wheelers, so I'm rather pleased that this little scam didn't occur against me; It's a shame that the lady concerned pointed out the presence of her camera, rather than just calling the police.

Youtube Moped crash for cash video
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andy_foster
post Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 20:35
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QUOTE (bill w @ Sat, 24 Feb 2018 - 20:03) *
I've never quite worked out the logistics of installing a dashcam, due to having 8 vehicles, 4 bikes and 4 four wheelers


You install a dashcam in each 4 wheeler, and either use a RAM mount or helmet mount for whichever bike you're riding. However, the chances of 2 scrotes deliberately backing a moped into a proper bike for an insurance claim is probably less - unless they want the personal injury claim to have very realistic looking injuries.


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Redivi
post Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 06:16
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The bikes only require a single helmet cam

You can hard-wire the four-wheelers so that you only need one dashcam

Crash for cash teams are usually going to be looking for victims that will pay up without making a fuss such as the elderly, middle aged females and drivers of expensive cars

We should also be alert for signs such as tatty cars with occupants looking over their shoulders and keep well back especially at roundabouts and traffic lights
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notmeatloaf
post Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 11:53
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QUOTE (Redivi @ Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 06:16) *
We should also be alert for signs such as tatty cars with occupants looking over their shoulders and keep well back especially at roundabouts and traffic lights

Or just go back to that crazy idea that you leave enough room so that if the car in front slams on the anchors or stops suddenly then you still have time to brake? There are enough people who insist on leaving a few car lengths at 60mph that they will simply seek an easier target.

A while back in the days before ABS I was following a car who T-boned someone who pulled out of a junction so stopped almost immediately. The police were surprised I stopped about 30ft behind them. I wasn't because especially approaching a junction I always try to leave enough space so I have thinking space and stopping distance for such an eventuality.
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DancingDad
post Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 12:25
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QUOTE (notmeatloaf @ Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 11:53) *
.........Or just go back to that crazy idea that you leave enough room so that if the car in front slams on the anchors or stops suddenly then you still have time to brake? There are enough people who insist on leaving a few car lengths at 60mph that they will simply seek an easier target.
.........


I've seen a few bash for cash videos where the motor swung into a gap and anchored up, not giving the guy they want to claim from a decent chance.
But fully agree otherwise, stopping distance is your friend.

This post has been edited by DancingDad: Sun, 25 Feb 2018 - 12:25
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