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Didnt receive a Notice of Rejection on PCN
lab211
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 17:40
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So I got a PCN a while back and decided to challenge it and sent back a representation against it. I assumed they would just reject it and was expecting a notice back to that effect, but it has been nearly three months since I sent that back and I haven't heard anything. The PCN was in a hire car and reissuing the ticket in my name took them ages so I assumed they would be slow too but even so I was starting to get worried and was going to try contact them but of course they have no phone number.

Anyway today I received a "Charge Certificate" with a 50% uplift on the original amount and no mention of ways to challenge. I was planning on taking this to a tribunal to challenge but what can I do now? I assume they will say they did send out a notice of rejection but I never received anything.
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post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 17:40
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cp8759
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 18:00
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Did you receive your own Notice to Owner in your own name?


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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John U.K.
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 18:04
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You will probably be able to re-set this with the help of the experts here when you get the OfR (Order for Recovery).
While you are waiting for the experts to chip in please
1) Urgently put up a timeline with all dates, as dates govern deadlines.
Date of alleged contravention,
Date of of original PCN
Date of re-issued PCN
Date of your challenge.
Date of Charge Certificate

2) Post here copies of all paperwork received from and sent to Council, with a GSV link to the location.
For how to do it, Try this:

Do not attach docs/photos, but use this method:

Photo or scan. see http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=36858&st=0
for how to do it. I use Tinypic for stage 2 with no problems. Thera are other sites, such as Flickr (where the BBcodes are concealed behind the curly arrow (click on it) for sharing), which enable you to paste the BBCodes into your post here.
STAGE 1 takes care of resizing. If you use Tinypic for Stage 2, on the left each image in Tinypic is a list of links. Highlight and copy the entire link 'for forums' from the list for each image - beginning with IMG and ending /IMG (include all the square brackets [ ] ), and paste each link into your post. Each copied and pasted link will embed a thumbnail link in your post.

Using the attachment method is not advised as it means quickly running out of attachment space.

Redact/obscure name, address, PCN number and reg.mark.
LEAVE IN all dates/times; precise location, Contravention code and description.
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lab211
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 20:39
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Hi,

Thanks for the quick response.

The timeline is as follows:

Date of contravention: 26/01/18
Date of original PCN: 02/02/18
Date of PCN in my name: 09/03/18
Date representation sent: 28/03/18
Date representation signed for: 03/04/18
Date of Charge Certificate: 18/06/18

Location: https://goo.gl/maps/itbGcmJKPvn

Scans:






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PASTMYBEST
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 20:52
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You need to deal with the charge certificate first and there is only one sure way. Wait for the next document an Order for recovery. This will include a form enabling you to make a statutory declaration that You made representations in time but received no response. What will happen then is the TEC will order the CC revoked and the council should refer to the adjudicator for what happens next. The sometimes will ask you to re send your reps. Do not do so without coming back here. You will want to add a bit
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lab211
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 21:13
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Ok thanks that is somewhat reassuring but I am still quite nervous of this. So I should expect the Order of Recovery in about two weeks or are they normally slow sending those out too?

Also what exactly does the Order of Recovery mean, just that they can from that point they can get bailiffs involved but I can still stump up the £195 charge or make the witness statement?
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Incandescent
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 21:26
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At the OfR stage you can still make a payment, (I think they add on £8 to the £195), but it will be best for you to submit a Witness Statement (or Statutory Declaration if the PCN isn't for parking) so the process gets reverted to the Notice to Owner stage whereupon you can submit reps again, or pay, of course. The correct forms will be included with the OfR. Why there are two separate statement methods only TEC can tell you, for me it is a nonsense !

Only if you totally ignore the OfR will bailiffs eventually turn up. The OfR comes from the council, but they can only send it out when authorised by TEC.
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Neil B
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 21:54
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QUOTE (lab211 @ Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 22:13) *
Ok thanks that is somewhat reassuring but I am still quite nervous of this.

The most likely way for something to go wrong is if you do anything other than members have advised.

There are, however, some checks you can make for peace of mind. I won't mention them yet as I don't
want you jumping the gun.

So some back when you get the OfR --- or --
Come back if you don't receive it by, say, 10th July.

---------


QUOTE (lab211 @ Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 22:13) *
Also what exactly does the Order of Recovery mean, just that they can from that point they can get bailiffs involved

No. The OfR gives you plenty of time to respond before anything like that can happen.


--------------------
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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lab211
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 22:27
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Thanks for the advice, got me in a bit of a panic when I opened it.

I'll be back when I receive the Order of Recovery or if I don't hear back from them.
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Neil B
post Wed, 20 Jun 2018 - 22:29
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icon_thumleft.gif


--------------------
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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lab211
post Tue, 10 Jul 2018 - 18:41
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I am still waiting on the Order of Recovery, I'll give it another day or two but what can I do to chase if nothing shows?
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Incandescent
post Tue, 10 Jul 2018 - 21:07
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QUOTE (lab211 @ Tue, 10 Jul 2018 - 19:41) *
I am still waiting on the Order of Recovery, I'll give it another day or two but what can I do to chase if nothing shows?

Neil B will give you chapter and verse being much more expert than me on these things, but you contact the TEC giving PCN details to find out if the debt has been registered by the council. Once TEC has registered the debt, the council can issue the OfR, so you know it is imminent. They cannot issue an OfR without this registration at TEC.



This post has been edited by Incandescent: Tue, 10 Jul 2018 - 21:08
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Neil B
post Tue, 10 Jul 2018 - 22:29
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QUOTE (Incandescent @ Tue, 10 Jul 2018 - 22:07) *
you contact the TEC giving PCN details to find out if the debt has been registered by the council. Once TEC has registered the debt, the council can issue the OfR, so you know it is imminent. They cannot issue an OfR without this registration at TEC.

<<< Just that.

And, as an OfR gives you 21 days to act, you can just phone TEC every couple of weeks as above.
0300 123 1059

But do come back if it drags on.

This post has been edited by Neil B: Tue, 10 Jul 2018 - 22:30


--------------------
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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lab211
post Tue, 24 Jul 2018 - 19:57
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Thanks for all the advice so far, the Order of Recovery finally showed up.

Just want to make sure I fill it out correctly and I am a little confused by the wording where it needs witnessing.

Signature I assume is mine and dated when I sign.
I am not sure what "declared at" would be, is that my address or the time?
"Before me at" I assume is the address of where the witnessing took place, should it also include the witnesses name or does that go below the title?


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Neil B
post Tue, 24 Jul 2018 - 20:06
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QUOTE (lab211 @ Tue, 24 Jul 2018 - 20:57) *
Thanks for all the advice so far, the Order of Recovery finally showed up.

Just want to make sure I fill it out correctly and I am a little confused by the wording where it needs witnessing.

Signature I assume is mine and dated when I sign.
I am not sure what "declared at" would be, is that my address or the time?
"Before me at" I assume is the address of where the witnessing took place, should it also include the witnesses name or does that go below the title?



Those sections are for the person taking your oath.

DO NOT sign and date until told to.

QUOTE (lab211 @ Tue, 24 Jul 2018 - 20:57) *
I am not sure what "declared at" would be, is that my address or the time?

Neither; the Court or solicitor's office.


--------------------
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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hcandersen
post Tue, 24 Jul 2018 - 21:15
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the Order of Recovery finally showed up’

And its date of issue is???? And it states that you have *** days in which to submit your declaration?

OP, this is standard stuff, I know it can be stressful but it really is standard procedure carried out hundreds of times a day across the country, so don’t get concerned.

Our posters will guide you.

https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/unde...rcement-process
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lab211
post Tue, 24 Jul 2018 - 22:35
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It is dated 20/07/18 and states I have 21 days to either pay or make a declaration.

My neighbour who is a solicitor was going to witness it for me but he wasn't sure how to fill it out, so does that mean he fills both the declared at and before me at sections with his home address?
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Neil B
post Wed, 25 Jul 2018 - 07:38
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QUOTE (lab211 @ Tue, 24 Jul 2018 - 23:35) *
My neighbour who is a solicitor was going to witness it for me but he wasn't sure how to fill it out, so does that mean he fills both the declared at and before me at sections with his home address?

I'm a bit taken aback by the question, not least because I don't know the answer and now I'm not sure about my
previous answer.

Be aware not all solicitors can take oaths: Perhaps your neighbour isn't qualified.

It's free and simple at County Court, normally by appointment.


--------------------
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Fri, 11 May 2018 - 12:30) *
Neil is good at working backwards.

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PASTMYBEST
post Wed, 25 Jul 2018 - 08:37
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QUOTE (Neil B @ Wed, 25 Jul 2018 - 08:38) *
QUOTE (lab211 @ Tue, 24 Jul 2018 - 23:35) *
My neighbour who is a solicitor was going to witness it for me but he wasn't sure how to fill it out, so does that mean he fills both the declared at and before me at sections with his home address?

I'm a bit taken aback by the question, not least because I don't know the answer and now I'm not sure about my
previous answer.

Be aware not all solicitors can take oaths: Perhaps your neighbour isn't qualified.

It's free and simple at County Court, normally by appointment.



I think all solicitors can witness Neil.


QUOTE
In English law, a Commissioner for Oaths is a person appointed by the Lord Chancellor with power to administer oaths or take affidavits. All practising solicitors have these powers but must not use them in proceedings in which they are acting for any of the parties or in which they have an interest. ... S



post up the whole of the document. My understanding is that it is a tick box, sign it in front of the commissioner, they sign then send, but lets check
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lab211
post Wed, 25 Jul 2018 - 12:17
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My neighbour is a corporate in-house solicitor so I don't think he is used to this kind of stuff, I am trying to get hold of the county court to see about doing it there in case.

This is the full form

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