Letter before claim - about a PCN from 2015 Options

[dannyhall04]

I have just received a letter before claim for a parking charge notice that I received in August 2015.

Do I need to be worried or take any further action? How likely are they to act on the threat of legal action?

The company is Vehicle Control Services Ltd if that helps.

Thanks for any advice

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[Jlc]

A claim will follow.

It's an opportunity to narrow any issues prior to court and request any relevant documentation.

[Redivi]

From the number of very similar threads regarding ancient Parking Notices, VCS must have sent a blizzard of these letters in the last few days

They used to do it to collect default judgments from victims that had moved house
They then waited and collected the payments when the damage to credit records was discovered

There are new rules that they must check for current addresses but the letters still have shock value after such a long delay
Most people will have thrown away the documents

A claim is very likely
Whether VCS would go as far as a hearing and explain its delay is unknown

The best approach is to reply :

You dispute the debt
Give some reasons
Do not identify the driver

I suggest also demanding that VCS provides some documents and information:

Copies of the Parking Notice, all correspondence and any other evidence it intends to rely on
Copies of the signs and their placement at the time
Evidence in accordance with its Code of Practice that VCS has the capacity to take legal action

[southpaw82]

There are new rules that they must check for current addresses

Which rule are you referring to?

[dannyhall04]

From the number of very similar threads regarding ancient Parking Notices, VCS must have sent a blizzard of these letters in the last few days

They used to do it to collect default judgments from victims that had moved house
They then waited and collected the payments when the damage to credit records was discovered

There are new rules that they must check for current addresses but the letters still have shock value after such a long delay
Most people will have thrown away the documents

A claim is very likely
Whether VCS would go as far as a hearing and explain its delay is unknown

The best approach is to reply :

You dispute the debt
Give some reasons
Do not identify the driver

I suggest also demanding that VCS provides some documents and information:

Copies of the Parking Notice, all correspondence and any other evidence it intends to rely on
Copies of the signs and their placement at the time
Evidence in accordance with its Code of Practice that VCS has the capacity to take legal action

Thanks for your help. Are there any lawful reasons I can state for why I dispute it and haven’t paid it so far?

Thank you

[upset123]

Same here, four years old. perhaps they are dredging up "cold cases" the problem is it re-ignites the worry and upset that these types of letter bring to the fore. Shameful!

[Redivi]

Thanks for your help. Are there any lawful reasons I can state for why I dispute it and haven’t paid it so far?

Plenty but you haven't given any clues what the parking charge is about

[dannyhall04]

Thanks for your help. Are there any lawful reasons I can state for why I dispute it and haven’t paid it so far?

Plenty but you haven't given any clues what the parking charge is about

Oh sorry! From what I can remember (I mean it was 4 years ago!) the driver parked in a car park that was restricted to two hours and stayed for longer than the allotted time.

Hope this helps. Thanks again for any advice you can offer.

This post has been edited by dannyhall04: Sat, 4 May 2019 - 17:06

[Redivi]

No you didn't

The driver did

Not much help

Where was it ?
Were there signs ?
Were they VCS signs ? It has a habit of issuing Parking Notices for another company's car park
Windscreen ticket or ANPR ?
Parking Notice mention Protection of Freedoms Act ?
Dates of incident ? Notice received ?
Free or pay car park ?
Length of overstay ?
Additional charges ?
Who has written to you ?

[dannyhall04]

No you didn't

The driver did

Not much help

Where was it ?
Were there signs ?
Were they VCS signs ? It has a habit of issuing Parking Notices for another company's car park
Windscreen ticket or ANPR ?
Parking Notice mention Protection of Freedoms Act?
Dates of incident ? Notice received ?
Free or pay car park ?
Length of overstay ?
Additional charges ?
Who has written to you ?

In answer to your questions:

Where was it ? - Berkeley shopping centre, Ecclesall Road Sheffield
Were there signs ? - Think there were yes
Were they VCS signs ? Yes
Windscreen ticket or ANPR ? ANPR
Parking Notice mention Protection of Freedoms Act ? can't honestly remember and didn't keep the PN
Dates of incident ? Notice received ? Incindent was 13th August, notice received a few weeks later
Free or pay car park ? Free car park
Length of overstay ? No idea
Additional charges ? It states there is principal debt (£160), estimated interest charges (£46.29), estimated court fees (£25)
Who has written to you ? VCS have written the letter before claim

[Redivi]

I didn't make the question clear regarding additional charges

What I meant was - where have the additional charges come from that increased the amount from £100 to £160 ?

They will be one of two things:

A debt collector charge which VCS hasn't paid
Debt collectors work on 15% commission of what they recover.
VCS doesn't pay £60 to collect £100 whether or not successful
Debt collectors do, however, add amounts of their own to make the job worthwhile

The other common addition is £60 "Legal costs" if you had a letter from BWLegal
These are easily defended because they cannot be recovered in Small Claims Court

The Parking Notice had to be delivered within two weeks for VCS to have the right to recover payment from the registered keeper if driver is unknown
This is largely academic because VCS misrepresents a criminal case to argue that the registered keeper is deemed to be the driver if nobody else has been named

[dannyhall04]

I didn't make the question clear regarding additional charges

What I meant was - where have the additional charges come from that increased the amount from £100 to £160 ?

They will be one of two things:

A debt collector charge which VCS hasn't paid
Debt collectors work on 15% commission of what they recover.
VCS doesn't pay £60 to collect £100 whether or not successful
Debt collectors do, however, add amounts of their own to make the job worthwhile

The other common addition is £60 "Legal costs" if you had a letter from BWLegal
These are easily defended because they cannot be recovered in Small Claims Court

The Parking Notice had to be delivered within two weeks for VCS to have the right to recover payment from the registered keeper if driver is unknown
This is largely academic because VCS misrepresents a criminal case to argue that the registered keeper is deemed to be the driver if nobody else has been named

I believe £160 is higher than the original. It may have been £100 or £60 if paid in 14 days something like that.

The registered keeper of the vehicle has now changed does that affect anything?

[ostell]

It is the Keeper At the Date Of the Event that matters.

[dannyhall04]

It is the Keeper At the Date Of the Event that matters.

Ok thanks. So how do I proceed? Do I need to respond and if so what should I say?

[Redivi]

You must always reply to a Letter Before Claim
Did it include the questionnaire for the Pre-action Protocol for Debt Claims ?

Were there signs ? - Think there were yes
There would have been signs
The question concerns whether they were at the entrance with plenty more in the car park with the charges stated clearly in big writing

I believe £160 is higher than the original. It may have been £100 or £60 if paid in 14 days something like that.
This is like pulling teeth
If the letter demanding £160 was sent by a debt collector, its a debt collection charge
If it was sent by a solicitor, it's legal costs

If you don't have this information because you've thrown everything away, say so
You demand it as part of your reply

The registered keeper of the vehicle has now changed does that affect anything?
No

[dannyhall04]

You must always reply to a Letter Before Claim
Did it include the questionnaire for the Pre-action Protocol for Debt Claims ?

Were there signs ? - Think there were yes
There would have been signs
The question concerns whether they were at the entrance with plenty more in the car park with the charges stated clearly in big writing

I believe £160 is higher than the original. It may have been £100 or £60 if paid in 14 days something like that.
This is like pulling teeth
If the letter demanding £160 was sent by a debt collector, its a debt collection charge
If it was sent by a solicitor, it's legal costs

If you don't have this information because you've thrown everything away, say so
You demand it as part of your reply

The registered keeper of the vehicle has now changed does that affect anything?
No

I don’t remember clear signs.

The letter is from neither debt collector or solicitor, it is from VCS themselves. It does state that the issue has been passed to their legal department though.

It didn’t include a questionnaire, only a website link to a Reply Form which when I try to go on and view is coming up with a 404 error page and I have tried googling it but can’t find the form

[Redivi]

Even if it worked, never use a parking company's reply form

The response needs to be properly crafted and include a request for documents and information

That takes time
It isn't something that you do in five minutes on a website

Download the form here and post it

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure...ls/debt-pap.pdf

[dannyhall04]

Even if it worked, never use a parking company's reply form

The response needs to be properly crafted and include a request for documents and information

That takes time
It isn't something that you do in five minutes on a website

Download the form here and post it

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure...ls/debt-pap.pdf

Thank you for your help

[dannyhall04]

I have received an intention to start court proceedings.

What would be the best course of action?

Thanks in advance for any help.

[Sheffield Dave]

So what if anything has happened in the 9 months since you told us about receiving a LBC?
The current letter - who sent it? How much are they asking for, and how do they break down the total?