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UKCPM PCN, Hounslow Vista
Ronie
post Wed, 24 May 2017 - 10:31
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Hi

I have got a ticket posted on my windscreen in April and during that time I saw the man.

The ticket was upside down so, the man was not able to see it properly hence put the PCN.

But I shown it to him and he said I will update the system saying have seen the ticket but you will have to appeal to cancel it.

Which I did by they came back saying it is rejected as signboard clearly says it should be visible.

Below letter I posted in appeal:

-------------
To
Appeals Department

Subject: Wrongly Parking ticket fine attached to the vehicle

This is regarding the Parking fine posted on my Vehicle parked in Hounslow (on VFS site). The Parking ticket was shown on dashboard but seems Ticket Checker had difficulty to view it. We discussed with the ticket checker and shown him ticket immediately. He agreed the ticket is right and valid but I still need to appeal to eliminate this charge from your System. Hence, below is detail :

Name:
Address:
Car Reg no:
Parking Ref no
Reason: There was valid Parking ticket there and shown it to ticket checker. He wrote a note into his system already. Please check and resolve this issue. For your reference, I have attached the ticket copy to the appeal letter.

I have already spoken to my Solicitor friend and he agreed as you have a proof of ticket with last three digits () of car printed on it. Which prove you paid valid car park charges. Hence, requesting you to act on it immediately and cancel the charge.


Thanks & regards
-----------------


Should I reply to them? or stay quite?

Thanks
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post Wed, 24 May 2017 - 10:31
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Ronie
post Thu, 25 May 2017 - 11:45
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So, keep waiting and see...I don't need to reply them anymore.
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Jlc
post Thu, 25 May 2017 - 11:51
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QUOTE (Ronie @ Thu, 25 May 2017 - 10:32) *
They have logo of BPA in their letter but I doubt they are member.

They can be a member just not an 'approved operator'. They use the IPC for that.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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Ronie
post Thu, 25 May 2017 - 18:05
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What is google going to do? smile.gif

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Gan
post Thu, 25 May 2017 - 19:26
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Point you in the direction of the Land Registry if you ask the obvious question
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Ronie
post Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 10:08
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I have got debt recovery letter today.

Now, I am bit nervous. I was ok to pay 60 quid initially if it was fully my mistake:

Below are few points:

1) I have seen person putting ticket on it and shown him parking ticket but he refused to cancel the parking ticket.
2) I have asked ticket poster to show his ID but he did not do that and starting talking in Native Language (Punjabi) with offensive words.
3) Then he saw my wife and kids coming in. Stopped talking with rudeness and said I will update the system saying have seen the ticket which is valid. But can't cancel the ticket. He said company would be able to cancel it.
4) I have PCN which does not have UKCPM contact details for appeal. Googled to find the contact and called them. Asked them to read your system and she said send it via post.
5) This is where I have started posted them letter which was rejected.
6) Things now moved to Debt recovery asking for 160 pounds.

If it goes to court do we have chance to win by explaining above to Judge?

Thanks
Ronnie
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ostell
post Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 11:33
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If this letter was from Debt Recovery Plus then just file it away and ignore it.
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Ronie
post Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 11:45
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Thanks for your reply.

Yes, it is from debt recovery plus.

But what do you think about court action? Do we have case to win?

Thanks


This post has been edited by Ronie: Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 11:45
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ostell
post Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 12:12
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Did you post up an image of the ticket and the signs on the previous page? I didn't see anything obvious

They could try court remains to be seen but this was a long delay before DR+ so they might be just fishing to see if you are still there.
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Ronie
post Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 13:05
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Thanks for the reply.

Yes, I uploaded ticket in past (http://imageshack.com/a/img924/3731/RGpVoR.jpg)

Signboard:


https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B6jL-TSrcW...iew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6jL-TSrc...RTBqUkdVM2xzXzg

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B6jL-TSrc...b0s4X0owYXRPM2M

Thnx for your help
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ostell
post Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 13:24
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One could say that you complied with their instructions to display a valid ticket in the windscreen area. The ticket was valid, it had an identifying sequence number on it, there was no requirement on the signs to display face up.

You had displayed a valid ticket contrary to their alleged misdeed of not displaying a valid ticket.

This post has been edited by ostell: Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 13:25
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Ronie
post Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 13:33
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Wow, you are right...it does not say face up

Though say clearly display on windscreen. Which may or may not mean it should be face up but ticket was there. And it has last three digit on it for my reg number.

They ask for last three digit of reg number when paying in machine. So, ideally they should have some technology to check it if the car paid valid ticket.

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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 1 Sep 2017 - 17:10
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Yes of course they could, but they get less money that way. Stop thinking these parasites are snatching but that - parasites.

This is drp. FIVE MINUTES OF RESEARCH here will have told you to ignore drp. They're powerless. Utterly and completely.
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Ronie
post Thu, 17 May 2018 - 13:10
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Suddenly out of the blue (after 7 months) I have got below letter:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1K4qdZM8mLg...iew?usp=sharing

Do you think I should reply to Gladstone with something?

To refresh memory:

In my case it was ticket which was moved and was not displayed properly. Though, I showed it to Parking attendant (who does not have have any id and was not employed by UKCPM). He refused to cancel the PCN and wanted me to talk to UKCPM

There was no detail to contact or appeal on the PCN but I googled and send them detail but they refused. My paid ticket does have last three digit of my car and time.


Thanks for your help in advance smile.gif
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ostell
post Thu, 17 May 2018 - 14:33
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Yes, this a letter before claim and needs a response.

There is no indication in that letter of the reason for the claim for a charge.

Write back and ask for sufficient details of the claim they are making to allow a suitable response and tell them to conform to the requirements of PAP and include all the required paperwork with their letter. To narrow the issues involved you require copies of all the paperwork that will be used to substantiate the claim and in particular the windscreen notice, if applicable, the notice to keeper that was sent and a copy of the contract between the claimant and the landholder that permits them to take action at the location. A witness statement stating a contract exists is insufficient.

This post has been edited by ostell: Thu, 17 May 2018 - 14:34
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Ronie
post Tue, 22 May 2018 - 09:37
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Thanks for your reply.

Do you want to see PCN? I can upload it too.

Thanks
Ronnie

This post has been edited by Ronie: Tue, 22 May 2018 - 09:37
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 22 May 2018 - 09:51
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No, we want to see your LBA response.
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Ronie
post Tue, 22 May 2018 - 13:46
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Below is what I am going send them:


Re: LETTER BEFORE CLAIM dated for Ref :

I am writing to acknowledge receipt of the above letter.

As instructed by your letter, I can’t see the reason for claim for a charge in there. I would request you to send sufficient details of the claim you are making to allow a suitable response and conform to the requirements of PAP & include all required paperwork with your letter. I would need copies of all the paperwork that will be used to substantiate the claim. Also, would need copy of notice sent to keeper along with copy of contract between Claimant and Landholder that permits them to take action at the location with witness statement stating a contract exists is insufficient.

Moreover, I have read the Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims under the Civil Procedure Rules 1998 (hereby referred to as “the PAP”) and the Practice Direction on Pre-Action Conduct (hereby referred to as the “PD”). I refer you to Annex A of the PD which clearly lays out in section 2 what the claimant’s Letter Before Claim (hereby referred to as the “LBC”) should contain. I do not believe your LBC complies with the PD as it neglects to include various pieces of information listed within.

I wish to remind you that paragraph 4 of the PD states that the court has the power to apply sanctions for non-compliance with the PD. The fact that you refer to the PAP suggests to me that you believe you have sent me a compliant LBC and that I am liable to respond under the PAP, yet the fact that your letter does not comply with the PD suggests that I am not. If you are indeed asking for a response under the PAP, please explain why you have not complied with the PD and send a new LBC that does comply with the PD. I will then be able to comply with my obligations under the PD.

I expect an actual response to my letter rather than another generic template letter that does not address my questions and concerns.
--------------------------------------

Please let me know if it is ok?


I did not get LBA but Letter before claim is there.

Is LBA comes after Letter before Claim?
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SchoolRunMum
post Wed, 23 May 2018 - 00:31
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A LBA is the same as a LBC.

Your reply looks OK to me.
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Jlc
post Wed, 23 May 2018 - 07:30
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If it was being picky (some call it my OCD) then PAP is used before defining it. Although, it's an acronym they should understand, but you do wonder sometimes...

However, this does not assist any defence but could be relevant for costs after any judgment.

This post has been edited by Jlc: Wed, 23 May 2018 - 07:31


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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Ronie
post Thu, 24 May 2018 - 09:01
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Yes, it is not defense. We will write it after we get more information back.

Moreover, I don't feel paying fraud people as already paid for ticket & there was no loss to landholder. Moreover, not ethical to ask for money when you shown the ticket to ticket checker (who was not even their employee)

Anybody got court orders? Or do they really resolve it before going to court?

This post has been edited by Ronie: Thu, 24 May 2018 - 09:02
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