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Why do we have to pay money to councils for PCN's
Jake345
post Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 15:26
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In regards to PCN's from councils and TFL , I dont understand why we have to pay money to them.

What entitles the council to claim money from me if I perform a prohibited turn , or get caught in a junction box?

Shouldnt I be paying money instead to other motorists I have inconvenienced? Or why cant I opt to perform community service work for the council instead of paying them money,

Why is it these institutions get to profit from people making mistakes?

Did I enter into some kind of contract with these institutions when I signed for my driving licence?
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post Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 15:26
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666
post Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 15:49
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I will try to take your queries at face value, despite their FOTL-ish flavour.

They are entitled because Parliament has decided so. If you really want to change the system you should contact your MP.

They don't profit: they are not profit-making organisations. Every pound paid by offenders is a pound less to be raised from council tax, so I'm in favour.
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Jlc
post Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 15:57
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Traffic Management Act 2004


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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DancingDad
post Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 22:49
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QUOTE (666 @ Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 16:49) *
………..
They don't profit: they are not profit-making organisations. Every pound paid by offenders is a pound less to be raised from council tax, so I'm in favour.


Strictly speaking, you may be correct.
In fact you are with some councils who spend more on enforcement then they make.
But it is difficult to believe when you look at the performance of some of the more aggressive authorities.
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The Rookie
post Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 06:42
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QUOTE (Jake345 @ Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 16:26) *
Why is it these institutions get to profit from people making mistakes?

Most councils spend more on enforcement than they receive, as such perhaps all drivers should give extra to the councils for keeping the roads clearer?


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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Charlie1010
post Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 07:20
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What mistakes do people make?

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666
post Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 08:30
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QUOTE (Charlie1010 @ Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 08:20) *
What mistakes do people make?

Getting caught?
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DancingDad
post Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 08:36
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QUOTE (The Rookie @ Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 07:42) *
QUOTE (Jake345 @ Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 16:26) *
Why is it these institutions get to profit from people making mistakes?

Most councils spend more on enforcement than they receive, as such perhaps all drivers should give extra to the councils for keeping the roads clearer?


Most is obviously a relative term and TBH, one I would not argue against given the number of provincial authorities that don't generate the same income as the big hitters.
But the big hitters make up for it.
Over 800m surplus across UK for all parking activities, Income less expenditure. (2017 figures)
Westminster made over 70 million alone.
Outside London, Brighton and Hove topped the lost with over 20m surplus.
It's big business when you have the catchment area.
https://www.racfoundation.org/wp-content/up...bling_Final.pdf

This post has been edited by DancingDad: Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 08:36
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The Rookie
post Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 08:55
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I agree there are big disparities, most the profitable ones are in London (for reasons that are obvious), but the median is a small loss.

The tables are interesting, on street the profit comes from permits NOT enforcement, Expenditure exceeding the penalties. While Westminster may top the 'profit' tables they are second in the penalty table and the value is less than 25% of their total profit, so clearly permits are the biggest source of income and nothing to do with the OP's questioning.


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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Fredd
post Sat, 19 Oct 2019 - 13:51
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QUOTE (DancingDad @ Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 09:36) *
QUOTE (The Rookie @ Mon, 14 Oct 2019 - 07:42) *
QUOTE (Jake345 @ Sun, 13 Oct 2019 - 16:26) *
Why is it these institutions get to profit from people making mistakes?

Most councils spend more on enforcement than they receive, as such perhaps all drivers should give extra to the councils for keeping the roads clearer?


Most is obviously a relative term and TBH, one I would not argue against given the number of provincial authorities that don't generate the same income as the big hitters.
But the big hitters make up for it.
Over 800m surplus across UK for all parking activities, Income less expenditure. (2017 figures)
Westminster made over 70 million alone.
Outside London, Brighton and Hove topped the lost with over 20m surplus.
It's big business when you have the catchment area.
https://www.racfoundation.org/wp-content/up...bling_Final.pdf

Here's a bit of a give-away straight from the horse's mouth - the horse in this case being a largely rural provincial council.

QUOTE
A spokesperson for North East Lincolnshire Council said the council's "need to generate revenues" was a key driver of the policy.

The council statement said: “We always appreciate peoples’ views on such things as parking and are constantly reviewing and looking at the best options to increase footfall to our town centre and the facilities we provide.

“However, we must also balance those decisions out with the need to generate revenues, which is vital if we are to maintain and improve what we have to offer across the whole of North East Lincolnshire.”



--------------------
Regards,
Fredd

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