Upcoming possible private parking management Options

[Tartarus]

Where I live, may soon have a private company overseeing the parking of vehicles in the car park associated with the apartment block. Permits have already been issued, at least we've not had to pay for them, but no signs up yet, and I don't know when they may go up yet. There was also no consultation with residents about this, in terms of we've known that they may introduce it, but finding a permit in the mail was the first thing we knew about they actually doing something about it, instead of a letter and/or consultation period to hammer out details.

I'm looking to formulate a letter in response to the developments to send back to the apartment management company about the introduction of this. Hence why I'm posting here in case anyone has advice, suggestions or has been through this themselves. But first, some background.

Where I live has had a parking problem for a little while. Part of it is caused by residents having more vehicles than there is room for. Part of it is that people who don't live there using it to park, either they live in one of the neighbouring blocks, or they work in the nearby shopping area. So it isn't too surprising that the management company want to do something about it. There are 39 flats in total. There are actually only 30 marked bays to begin with, so people tend to also park in the area at the back of the blocks where some garages are (on land that is part of the complex), and in front of parts of the block that are not marked in any way.

There is also the fact that each flat has only been issued one permit, that has to be put on display inside a vehicle. Most flats have more than one vehicle. So it is quite possible and likely that people who actually live in the flats can and will get ticketed just for parking in a car park they are entitled to be in. God knows what any visitors and/or workmen who are there to perform repairs are going to do. You are now going to say, you could park elsewhere not in the car park. All well and good, but the flats are next to a main road (red route), and there are just two residential roads nearby, which are for some part DYL, some part SYL interspaced with some bays for residents who live in the houses in those roads, if they aren't using their drives. So realistically, if you have to park elsewhere, you're going to be parking a long way away from the flats. Unless you flout the SYL rules like a lot of people seemingly already do because there's already not enough room on those roads to park currently!

If the requirement is that you MUST park in a marked bay in our car park, there's going to be absolute armageddon. Anyone who goes out to work during the day and drives, is liable to not find any spot free when they get back in the evening.

Because the signs have yet to go up, I can't comment on any wording or liable penalty. When they DO appear, what are the sort of things I should look for in terms of potentially rendering the whole concept as unenforceable? I believe not mentioning the penalty amount is one such gotcha? The area with the parking spots is quite windy, and you can only see parts of the area from any spot, so will there need to be multiple signs at various intervals mounted in places that can't be obscured by any vehicle that happens to park there?

One further question, to anyone who does have this sort of thing in operation, when do the lackeys assigned to check permits and issue tickets usually operate? If it's during the day, then we may be able to get away with our cars being out until the evening, and gone by the time the next morning when they would be checking. Except for weekends of course. I'm accepting the inevitability this permit thing is going to happen, but as the yearly housing meeting is yet to occur, I suspect if the whole thing hasn't gone live by that time, there could be quite a few angry residents attending.

This post has been edited by Tartarus: Mon, 26 Sep 2016 - 10:55

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[The Rookie]

Do a mail shot round all the residencies before the AGM!

You would think the Landlords may be interested as it can put people off - devaluing the rental income.

[Tartarus]

You would think the Landlords may be interested as it can put people off - devaluing the rental income.

Landlord.

That might sound odd, but my brother's fiancee was able to have a chat with someone who lives elsewhere in the block recently about the parking situation, and found out that roughly 3/4 of the properties (so about 30 flats) are all owned by one person. Effectively I think he's been buying up every flat that has come on the market in the last few years. There was an old guy who used to sunbathe outside the building, and we found out he died last year. His flat was bought up by this guy before it even hit the market. I guess eventually he wants to own the whole thing? Who knows. For all we know, it could have been him having an influence on proceedings. But we continue to dig and try to find out more information in the background.

[The Rookie]

His flat was bought up by this guy before it even hit the market.

Hmm I wonder if there is some dodgy back room dealing going on and whether the estates are being done out of the true market value, not really pertinent to the instant issue but maybe another symptom of the same original cause!

[Tartarus]

Possibly. I don't know what it sold for. You do see the odd flat being sold and advertised in the local estate agents windows, so not all of them go prior to listing. It was just a bit obvious here I'd imagine because a death usually gets circulated, and thus he knew in advance the place was going to be on the market (his children had no desire to keep it apparently). On the whole, we've got no idea how much control and influence he has towards the MC, but you'd think he would be on their radar. He could even be friends with someone on the MC, we have no idea.

[The Rookie]

Have a look on Zoopa for the selling price!
http://www.zoopla.co.uk/house-prices/

[southpaw82]

There is some wild speculation going on here!

[Tartarus]

Had a look on Zoopla, there's one possible entry for that part of the block, but I think it's too early registered for sale compared to when the previous owner died. So I figure it never did make the estate agents. Given the new landlord/owner would have a lot of experience there, he could arrange everything himself.

No movement on anything to do with the scheme yet. Seeing what happens first, the introduction of it or our AGM.

[Tartarus]

Thought I'd post an update here on this, given it's about nine months since I originally put it up. Nothing has happened. Nada. No signs, no further comms on the matter. Maybe they realised the leases prevent the parking controls from occurring. Maybe they decided it was still too much money to organise. The parking situation hasn't altered in the slightest either, it's still very hit and miss where you might park in the evening.

[Tartarus]

I spoke too soon. Ish. Came home this evening to find 39 bays painted out and numbered in the car park area. Well, 38. One car was in a position where they wanted to paint, but was too close to another car, so it hasn't been completed yet

(guess they didn't want to do this! http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-LlLtqSsFuuE/UYRm...w7_1721904a.jpg )

Most of them (29) were the original bays, some are the "make shift" areas that people use to park anyhow. None of the space around the back of the block that also gets used to park in is involved here. Absolutely nothing comms wise from the management company about timescales or going ahead with things, but this development obviously means they are slowly trying to get it going.

[Tartarus]

NECRO BUMP!

Although anyone joining in now, I would probably recommend going back to the start of the thread and reading from there. Seems like I'm posting in here once a year now... anyhow, a couple of weeks ago, signs started appearing all around the housing block...





It's taken another couple of weeks hence to finally receive a letter regarding the situation. We've spoken to the management company on the phone and they are adamant they are going to plough ahead with the scheme.





They recommended any concerns we have, we should forward to them in a letter. Unsurprisingly we've come up with a bunch of brain dump, listed below. The reason for posting is to allow you fine folks a chance to add something we may have overlooked.

- if someone is not "respecting" the bay allocation, where do I park then? [there's been one note put on a vehicle so far, so the scheme is generating "neighbourly love" already, I won't post it here, it's full of profanity!]

- if I have to park in someone else's bay, do I still get ticketed? This could create a domino parking space effect.

- if I need workmen over to repair the boiler, fit a new kitchen et cetera, where are they supposed to park, all the way down the road?

- on that note, you contract people to come and maintain the gardens, clean the outside windows, vacuum and maintain the communal areas, where are they going to be parking?

- basically with the visitor restrictions, no one can ever come and visit someone really, for example my parents can't even come over for my upcoming birthday meal, because that will take longer than an hour.

- with the reduction in spaces available in mind, it's going to start clogging up the available spaces in the surrounding roads [which already have red route, SYL or DYL on some sections], have you considered the impact to the residents on the surrounding streets? Likewise people may start using the nearby church car park without permission!

- parking in front of the garage areas (which are unmarked), are you going to ticket people there even though they've been used for years?

- have you considered the potential deprecation to the value of the properties, especially for people such as ourselves who may look to sell in the future?

- there is so much vague language on the signs, let alone the letter, who do we speak to if there's an issue, and how would anyone know who to contact if there's a problem, let alone if their vehicle is removed to retrieve it?

- considering how thin parts of the roadway are on the estate with vehicles on both sides, and how some vehicles will be parked, how is towing or removing some vehicles going to even be feasible? If a vehicle is removed, and other vehicles are damaged in the process, who is liable and how do we claim?

- where is the money going, and how will money "owed" be recovered in any way? How is the amount of the "fine" going to be possible to determine?

- who is enforcing this parking scheme? How often will they be checking? Are they really going to check once per hour, every hour of the day, 24/7? Is the management fees we pay going to increase to pay for this scheme, that seemingly no resident actually asked for? There was no consultation or communication about the implementation of the scheme sent to residents, and seemingly the only times mentioned were at the AGM, of which due to other commitments, we couldn't make for the last two years.

- on that note, what's to stop people just ripping up any fine notes and driving away?

- if the landlord does not pass the permit onto the tenant(s), who is liable for any fines?


This post has been edited by Tartarus: Fri, 20 Jul 2018 - 08:52

[The Rookie]

Those signs are idle threats,
1/ They arn't in an ATA so cant get keeper data from the DVLA or hold keepers liable.
2/ They can't tow without breaking the law (PoFA).
3/ Its forbidding signage anyway, so you can't contract to pay the £5.
4/ The signs don't identify who you are contracting with.

In all, just scare tactics, like a loudly barking dog with no teeth.

If you don't display a permit (which would identify you) they won't even know who to take action against!

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Fri, 20 Jul 2018 - 09:48

[Tartarus]

Thanks for the quick response Rookie. These are all things we were mulling over, but it's good to hear an opinion that agrees with what we were concluding. Obviously we weren't going to give the management company ideas by mentioning these specific "idle threat" points to them!

It still stands though that if vehicles start getting damaged by other residents because they are in the wrong spot, there's gonna be fallout...

[ManxRed]

And there's no such company as 'Management Company Ltd'

[The Rookie]

I do wonder if 'management company limited' (sic) couldn't get a PPC to agree reasonable terms to avoid the fall out that happens in many cases and opted for a scary poster instead. For that they should sort of be applauded.

[ManxRed]

Maybe. I mean if it deters genuine interlopers then all well and good.

But anyone with a bit of knowledge can see that they have absolutely no chance whatsoever of enforcing that sign at all.

Its like a mild form of 'Trespassers will be shot'

[Harnes]

So, each parking space/permit is numbered and that number is allocated to a flat.

It doesn't appear to matter who parks in that space, if no permit is displayed it will be the flat allocated to that space that gets the heat !

Who are on the management commitee - Zippy & George ?

[ManxRed]

Yes, essentially each resident will be fined £5 an hour if ANYONE parks a car in their space without a permit.

They haven't thought this through, have they?

[Tartarus]

No, that was our first reaction too on just seeing the initial signs ManxRed heh.

And there's no such company as 'Management Company Ltd'

You may not be surprised to learn I've redacted that part of the sign

It's the company that is responsible for managing the block I live in, and others in the area I believe.

We were very much expecting a PPC to be handling this, the parking for the block across the street from us IS handled by one (and having looked at their signs, are very much in the pseudo compliant nature), and thus were thinking they would be controlling this too. Evidently not based on the letter and signs!

[notmeatloaf]

I wouldn't worry about it - as has been said it is all a load of crap especially as it seems unlikely they will pay someone minimum wage to stand and watch how many £5 hrs they can charge you for.

I just think you need to get together as tenants as best you can and agree your own rules.

Also not to condone theft but at a previous work car park the PPC found their signs kept dropping off the wall and into the bins. Eventually they gave up. As it seems likely to be hassle for your management company to get replacements it may be an option if they do start to hand out photocopied "parking fines [sic]".

[The Rookie]

Its like a mild form of 'Trespassers will be shot'

More like ‘trespassers will be prosecuted’ which is equally meaningless and toothless but works on the uneducated.