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LTI 20-20 operations manual
Hassan2015
post Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 11:42
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Looking through the net, I found numerous manuals for the Lti device, the one used by mostly ALL the forces in their camera vans and ...

I remember about 10 years ago, I was fighting a case and asked for the manual to be presented, but the CPS jumped up and started to scream that this is a sensitive document and can't be released!

But it seems in 2011, they have finally lost the battle and there seems to be manuals from forces all over the country on their websites for DL!

Shame this wasn't released 10 years ago!


Out of curiosity, have anyone used the manual successfully in courts to prove that the recommendations by the manufacturer wasn't carried out? things like sight alignment and instrument accuracy checks?

H

This post has been edited by Hassan2015: Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 11:43
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post Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 11:42
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Hassan2015
post Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 21:41
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QUOTE (justforthepictures @ Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 20:55) *
The 'huge' lens isn't attached to the speedscope, it's connected to the video camera. The latest lens being offered with new kit are Canon image stabilised, that come with an optional x2 converter allowing a focal length of 1000mm.

This has no impact on the operation of the laser whatsoever and is used solely for the purposes of vehicle identification. The greater the magnification available, the more operational flexibility you have at sites with very long stretches of carriageway.

One other point, remember, the UK LTI manuals you see available will usually be produced by the importers NOT the manufacturer.


Thanks for the information.

So the operator sees the vehicle through this lens ( The Cannon one) which would have the cross printed on it, hence why it is important to do the vertical and horizontal adjustment to make sure the laser and the cross are pointing at the correct object? Or does the operator see the car through a different lens?


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StationCat
post Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 21:51
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Very few pings are actually made at the far end of the possible range (1km). Most pings will be much closer - a few hundred metres. Operators usually look out of the window at vehicles...pick one that is over the limit....look through the scope on the laser gun (x2 magnification on the Ultralyte 1000)....put the dot on the car...pull the trigger....check the speed on the HUD....then look at the screen showing the video view and use it to track the vehicle to record the number plate and the driver. The laser from the gun is invisible, so the scope alignment check confirms that the beam is properly aligned with the red dot in the scope. The red dot is then aligned with the cross hairs which are superimposed on the video image. This then confirms that the video cross-hairs are aligned with the laser beam. Primary evidence is the operator's opinion combined with the laser gun reading. The video is just to aid in identifying the vehicle.


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"Truth is ever to be found in the simplicity, and not in the multiplicity and confusion of things" - Isaac Newton
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Hassan2015
post Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 23:02
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QUOTE (StationCat @ Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 21:51) *
. Primary evidence is the operator's opinion combined with the laser gun reading. The video is just to aid in identifying the vehicle.


It is quite funny that the operators opinion is the primary evidence!

I wonder how many times CPS have had to provide the full video of an operators day to see how many pings he did that were over the threshold and how many were under!

I bet all they do is sit there and ping away and watch the ££££s go up!

Don't get me wrong! I am all up for them sitting in built up areas and catching those people who think it is ok to do 40,50 in built up areas!

But when they sit on dual carriageway catching people at 76mph, that winds me up! Is there a chance of a small child running in the middle of the road at 7:30am on a Sunday morning! That's all about making money!


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captain swoop
post Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 23:05
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QUOTE (Hassan2015 @ Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 23:02) *
But when they sit on dual carriageway catching people at 76mph, that winds me up!


Do you know of anyone that has been prosecuted for 76mph on a dual carriageway?
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Jlc
post Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 23:05
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Enforcement starts at a generous +10%+2, so at 79mph.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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Hassan2015
post Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 23:09
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QUOTE (captain swoop @ Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 23:05) *
QUOTE (Hassan2015 @ Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 23:02) *
But when they sit on dual carriageway catching people at 76mph, that winds me up!


Do you know of anyone that has been prosecuted for 76mph on a dual carriageway?



yes, me! but I got off :wink.gif



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southpaw82
post Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 00:40
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QUOTE (Hassan2015 @ Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 23:02) *
But when they sit on dual carriageway catching people at 76mph, that winds me up! Is there a chance of a small child running in the middle of the road at 7:30am on a Sunday morning! That's all about making money!

It's all about enforcing the law.


--------------------


Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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Hassan2015
post Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 09:01
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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 00:40) *
It's all about enforcing the law.



I thought it was all about road safety and reducing casualties! They do call themselves ' Safety Camera Partnership' after all!


Isn't it time that they all sit down and look at this all over again! The speed limits came into effect when cars of the time weren't that good! but nowadays with all the safety in cars and ..., surely it is time to raise this limit!

Just because the limit might be raised, it doesn't mean EVERYONE has to drive at the limit. You drive at the speed you FEEL you are in control of your car. If it is below the speed limit, then be it, others would have to find a safe place to go past you!

And I am talking about national speed limits on dual carriageways and motorways and not 30mph limits!

This post has been edited by Hassan2015: Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 09:02
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Jlc
post Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 14:41
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Many of us agree that some limits could be reviewed/increased. But if you choose to exceed these limits by an already generous margin then you can only expect 'punishment' if caught.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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southpaw82
post Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 14:50
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QUOTE (Hassan2015 @ Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 09:01) *
QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 00:40) *
It's all about enforcing the law.



I thought it was all about road safety and reducing casualties!

That is an expected by-product of enforcing the law.

This post has been edited by southpaw82: Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 14:52


--------------------


Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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justforthepictur...
post Sun, 25 Jan 2015 - 21:07
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QUOTE (Hassan2015 @ Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 22:41) *
QUOTE (justforthepictures @ Sat, 24 Jan 2015 - 20:55) *
The 'huge' lens isn't attached to the speedscope, it's connected to the video camera. The latest lens being offered with new kit are Canon image stabilised, that come with an optional x2 converter allowing a focal length of 1000mm.

This has no impact on the operation of the laser whatsoever and is used solely for the purposes of vehicle identification. The greater the magnification available, the more operational flexibility you have at sites with very long stretches of carriageway.

One other point, remember, the UK LTI manuals you see available will usually be produced by the importers NOT the manufacturer.


Thanks for the information.

So the operator sees the vehicle through this lens ( The Cannon one) which would have the cross printed on it, hence why it is important to do the vertical and horizontal adjustment to make sure the laser and the cross are pointing at the correct object? Or does the operator see the car through a different lens?

The crosshairs aren't part of the lens, they are superimposed by the Concept system.

Yes, every time the focal length is altered, the apparent optical relationship between the laser/red dot alters, so needs realigning.

The operator should be using the red dot in the sighting scope mounted on top of the speedmeter (LTI Ultralyte 100/1000), to position the laser.


--------------------
'Speed Kills' simply means, hit something or someone fast enough and it will result in a fatality.
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