Can variable speed limits glitch Options

[kc2506]

Driving on the M25 goes from a 50 to a 40mph as shown on the variable speed board on the gantry, so i slow down appropriately. Then it goes back to 50 so i speed up, probnably reaching a peak of 47mph, before 40mph shows up again. Makes me wonder can these variable speed limits "glitch" and if so could i be fined? And how would you go about proving to Highways England/the police that the variable speed limits were faulty

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[mickR]

yes they can "glitch" unlikely you will get a fine as they will know its a fault also there's a time delay from change of limit (reduction ) displayed to enforcement, I can't remember how long tho.

so if limit reduces as you go under gantry it won't trigger enforcement

[kc2506]

yes they can "glitch" unlikely you will get a fine as they will know its a fault also there's a time delay from change of limit (reduction ) displayed to enforcement, I can't remember how long tho.

so if limit reduces as you go under gantry it won't trigger enforcement

Would what I describe constitute a glitch or would there be any reason as to why the speed limit would drop, then go up by 10mph, then drop back down wt the next gantry?

[mickR]

its not uncommon for limits to fluctuate down, up and down on subsequent gantries. I thought you mentioned down up down on the same gantry as you were approaching??

[kc2506]

its not uncommon for limits to fluctuate down, up and down on subsequent gantries. I thought you mentioned down up down on the same gantry as you were approaching??

No

First gantry i passed 50

Second was 40

Third was 50

Fourth was 40

[Sparxy]

Driving on the M25 goes from a 50 to a 40mph as shown on the variable speed board on the gantry, so i slow down appropriately. Then it goes back to 50 so i speed up, probnably reaching a peak of 47mph, before 40mph shows up again. Makes me wonder can these variable speed limits "glitch" and if so could i be fined? And how would you go about proving to Highways England/the police that the variable speed limits were faulty

The newer HADECS3 cameras have an extra camera looking at the gantry as "proof" of what was displayed. Highways also keep a log of what they have "asked" the signs to display.

On the occasion that i've felt the signage is too inconsistent to be genuine (like the 40-50-blank-blank-40-50 and a lane closure thrown in that lasted 1 sign) i've phoned National Highways to report it, to which to be fair to the chap on the phone, he sounded a little alarmed as apparently knew nothing of any lane closures or restrictions...

[kc2506]

So another example
Today on the M11 they have variable speed limit boards, very old ones I think they're from the 70s and 80s when the road first opened.
Showed 50 just near the turn off for the A11 heading north, so I slow down accordingly.
Next board I pass there's no speed limit shown on it, so I assume it's back to NSL as the road was clear, so I get up to 70-73mph.
Next board I pass just shows "End"
So it worries me that I was going 20mph over the tempoary speed limit but i didn't know that as nothing was shown on the next board. Other drivers too were doing the NSL.
What would your rights be here?

[666]

So another example
Today on the M11 they have variable speed limit boards, very old ones I think they're from the 70s and 80s when the road first opened.
Showed 50 just near the turn off for the A11 heading north, so I slow down accordingly.
Next board I pass there's no speed limit shown on it, so I assume it's back to NSL as the road was clear, so I get up to 70-73mph.
Next board I pass just shows "End"
So it worries me that I was going 20mph over the tempoary speed limit but i didn't know that as nothing was shown on the next board. Other drivers too were doing the NSL.
What would your rights be here?

You'd have the right to whinge a bit if you're caught, but that's about it.

The speed limit is in force until you see a sign to the contrary. A blank sign has no effect whatever.

[kc2506]

So another example
Today on the M11 they have variable speed limit boards, very old ones I think they're from the 70s and 80s when the road first opened.
Showed 50 just near the turn off for the A11 heading north, so I slow down accordingly.
Next board I pass there's no speed limit shown on it, so I assume it's back to NSL as the road was clear, so I get up to 70-73mph.
Next board I pass just shows "End"
So it worries me that I was going 20mph over the tempoary speed limit but i didn't know that as nothing was shown on the next board. Other drivers too were doing the NSL.
What would your rights be here?

You'd have the right to whinge a bit if you're caught, but that's about it.

The speed limit is in force until you see a sign to the contrary. A blank sign has no effect whatever.

Legally I'm not sure. I'm pretty sure the Highways Agency have said with gantries anyway if no speed limit is displayed the cameras will be enforcing NSL.
Also say if you'd pulled into the hard shoulder, and were there for however long, before the speed limit changed. Then you went back onto the road at the NSL because there were no signage - again a hypothetical question, legally surely there must be repeater signs? Considerign these matrix boards are not as frequent as gantry signs.

Another point - think its an iffier one - aren't speed limits only legally enforceable if they have a red ring around them? These didn't.

https://www.drivingtesttips.biz/advisory-ma...20speed%20limit.

think they must have been advisories not mandatory anyway

This post has been edited by kc2506: Mon, 12 Jun 2023 - 15:31

[666]

So another example
Today on the M11 they have variable speed limit boards, very old ones I think they're from the 70s and 80s when the road first opened.
Showed 50 just near the turn off for the A11 heading north, so I slow down accordingly.
Next board I pass there's no speed limit shown on it, so I assume it's back to NSL as the road was clear, so I get up to 70-73mph.
Next board I pass just shows "End"
So it worries me that I was going 20mph over the tempoary speed limit but i didn't know that as nothing was shown on the next board. Other drivers too were doing the NSL.
What would your rights be here?

You'd have the right to whinge a bit if you're caught, but that's about it.

The speed limit is in force until you see a sign to the contrary. A blank sign has no effect whatever.

Another point - think its an iffier one - aren't speed limits only legally enforceable if they have a red ring around them? These didn't.

https://www.drivingtesttips.biz/advisory-ma...20speed%20limit.

think they must have been advisories not mandatory anyway

You're right, advisory only.

[kc2506]

So another example
Today on the M11 they have variable speed limit boards, very old ones I think they're from the 70s and 80s when the road first opened.
Showed 50 just near the turn off for the A11 heading north, so I slow down accordingly.
Next board I pass there's no speed limit shown on it, so I assume it's back to NSL as the road was clear, so I get up to 70-73mph.
Next board I pass just shows "End"
So it worries me that I was going 20mph over the tempoary speed limit but i didn't know that as nothing was shown on the next board. Other drivers too were doing the NSL.
What would your rights be here?

You'd have the right to whinge a bit if you're caught, but that's about it.

The speed limit is in force until you see a sign to the contrary. A blank sign has no effect whatever.

Another point - think its an iffier one - aren't speed limits only legally enforceable if they have a red ring around them? These didn't.

https://www.drivingtesttips.biz/advisory-ma...20speed%20limit.

think they must have been advisories not mandatory anyway

You're right, advisory only.

Is it only smart motorways that have variable speed limits?
I can't remember if the speed displayed was static or flashing but I definitely didn't see it in a red circle.

[DancingDad]

........
Is it only smart motorways that have variable speed limits?
I can't remember if the speed displayed was static or flashing but I definitely didn't see it in a red circle.

Nope.

If no circle, speed was advisory, not regulatory

[kc2506]

........
Is it only smart motorways that have variable speed limits?
I can't remember if the speed displayed was static or flashing but I definitely didn't see it in a red circle.

Nope.

If no circle, speed was advisory, not regulatory

and it would be in a red circle, not an orange one?

I saw a 60 in an orange circle on the way back on the other side of the carriageway.

The one showing 50 was like this https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:UK_...ed_Limit_50.svg



This post has been edited by kc2506: Mon, 12 Jun 2023 - 20:50

[Slapdash]

Which bit of red circle is difficult ?

[Irksome]

I saw on Wednesday, on the A1 variable limit just South of Peterborough, on one gantry only (all others were off), 20 in lane 1, 30 in lane 2, 40 in lane 3 and 50 in lane 4 ... I'm pretty sure they must have been testing the signs, but it was 4 or 5 pm so I thought it very odd. It wasn't the gantry with the Hadecs so I didn't take any notice :-)

[PeterStone]

I saw on Wednesday, on the A1 variable limit just South of Peterborough, on one gantry only (all others were off), 20 in lane 1, 30 in lane 2, 40 in lane 3 and 50 in lane 4 ... I'm pretty sure they must have been testing the signs, but it was 4 or 5 pm so I thought it very odd. It wasn't the gantry with the Hadecs so I didn't take any notice :-)

I've seen this on the M25 near Chorleywood, where the lanes had different speeds, 20MPH in the left lane, two were 60MPH, and the other another speed. I recall the 20MPH because I was trying to decide if it was safe to slow to 20MPH