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Merton. One box unscratched in ½ day Parking Permit = PCN.
ZigZagZog
post Wed, 11 Jul 2018 - 20:53
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My mate John was issued PCN by Merton Council. On the Half Day Parking Permit he used he omitted scratching clear the 'month' box.

Any chance of a succesful appeal against this PCN?

TIA











This post has been edited by ZigZagZog: Thu, 12 Jul 2018 - 13:50
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post Wed, 11 Jul 2018 - 20:53
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ZigZagZog
post Tue, 17 Jul 2018 - 19:12
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QUOTE (stamfordman @ Tue, 17 Jul 2018 - 20:06) *
Looks good to me - may give them a laugh. I take it John is standing for leader of the Silly Party.


I don't understand your post & don't know whether you're taking the piss or not. John is in his v. early 20's & has to work about 5 hours (after deductions, taxes, travel costs etc) to pay this PCN.

Does it look good to you?

Why would it give them a laugh?

Why do you think he's standing for the leader of the Silly Party?

This post has been edited by ZigZagZog: Tue, 17 Jul 2018 - 19:18
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stamfordman
post Tue, 17 Jul 2018 - 19:21
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Ah you're too young for Monty Python.

The challenge is rather over the top in begging for forgiveness - but it doesn't really matter and will do.

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ZigZagZog
post Tue, 17 Jul 2018 - 19:29
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OK, apologies, I misinterpreted your post.

(Don't think Monty P has aged very well.)
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stamfordman
post Tue, 17 Jul 2018 - 19:58
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QUOTE (ZigZagZog @ Tue, 17 Jul 2018 - 20:29) *
(Don't think Monty P has aged very well.)



Neither have I.
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ZigZagZog
post Wed, 18 Jul 2018 - 10:38
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No further input from the panel so can I take it the grovelling apology / discretionary dismissal request in post 19 http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?s=&...t&p=1399873 is good to go as is?

TIA.
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PASTMYBEST
post Wed, 18 Jul 2018 - 11:05
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QUOTE (ZigZagZog @ Wed, 18 Jul 2018 - 11:38) *
No further input from the panel so can I take it the grovelling apology / discretionary dismissal request in post 19 http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?s=&...t&p=1399873 is good to go as is?

TIA.


2160272793

Appeal decision
Appeal allowed
Direction
cancel the Penalty Charge Notice and the Notice to Owner.
Reasons
This PCN was issued for the alleged contravention of being parked in a permit space or zone in Pennyroyal Avenue at 2.38pm on 11 April 2016 without clearly displaying a valid permit.
I have looked at the CEO's images. These show that Mr Overlingas' van was parked in a space which was clearly signed as being for parking by permit holders only during the controlled hours of 9am to 6.30pm Mondays to Fridays.
The images show that there was a visitor's permit displayed in the windscreen of the van which was clearly scratched for the date of 11 April 2016. I can see no alteration of the date.
The Council says that the permit was not valid because Mr Overlingas had not written in the time of arrival.
The sole purpose of having a field for the time of arrival is so that the CEO can see whether or not the motorist has overstayed the 6 hours of parking time permitted by the permit. It must have been very clear to the issuing CEO that the permitted 6 hours of parking had not been exceeded in this case. The controlled hours began at 9am and the PCN was issued at 2.38pm. I am satisfied that the permit displayed was valid for parking in the circumstances.


--------------------
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ZigZagZog
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:11
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John has heard back from Merton. It's a no.

What does the panel here think? Appeal or fold? How would those who are familiar with the process rate the chances of a successful appeal.

Thanks again for all your help with this.


Thank you for writing to us.

We have carefully considered what you say but we have decided not to cancel your Penalty Charge Notice (PCN).

There is a sign where you parked that explains that the bay you parked in is for people with a permit.

Although you were displaying a permit, the Civil Enforcement Officer (CEO) believed it was not valid.

On this occasion when the CEO observed the vehicle a full-day visitor’s permit was seen on display. However, I must advise that the permit had not been completed correctly as the month section had not been scratched.

In order for a full-day parking permit to be valid, the driver must ensure that they scratch off one day, date and month. This information is clearly stated on the parking permit.

I note you have stated you work for Merton Council, however, to exempt one vehicle whilst others are respecting the regulations would be unfair and ultimately defeat the purpose of the enforcement.

It is the responsibility of the driver to ensure that they display a valid parking permit in the vehicle.

So whilst I note it was not your intention to park in contravention of the restrictions in force, I am satisfied that the PCN has been issued correctly and that the PCN has been correctly issued.

You can view photographic evidence of your case online at www.merton.gov.uk/pcn.


You have these choices:
• You can pay the discount charge of £30.00 if your payment reaches us within 14 days of the date of this letter.
• If you miss the discounted period you can pay the full charge of £60.00 within 28 days of this letter.
• You can formally challenge your PCN by using a Notice to Owner form. The vehicle's owner will automatically receive the form if the PCN has not been paid within 28 days of this letter. The form offers you the chance to formally challenge your PCN or pay the full £60.00. If you decide to formally challenge your PCN, please do not write to us again but wait until the Notice to Owner form arrives. If we reject your formal challenge you will be given the opportunity to appeal against our decision to an independent adjudicator. For
more information about the traffic adjudicator please visit their website at http://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/appe...ocess-explained. Please note: Should you write back in to the council before the Notice to Owner, the discounted period will not be placed on hold or reoffered.

How to pay
• Online at www.merton.gov.uk/pay.
• By phone 020 8545 3518 (24 hours). Please note that we do not accept AMEX or Diner’s Club Cards.
• Post Office (cash or a debit card only) or at Pay Point Shops (cash only) using the bar code as shown on this letter or on the PCN.
• By post Please make your cheque or postal order payable to ‘London Borough of Merton’, write your PCN number (MT.........), vehicle registration and your address on the back, then send it to the address above.
• Please note London Borough of Merton does not offer payment or instalment plans for PCNs. Payment is made when it is received by the council and not from the date written on a cheque or the date payment is posted. The council cannot be held responsible for any payments that are delayed or lost by the Postal Services.

Yours sincerely

Parking Services
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stamfordman
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:18
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It's a bog off letter that didn't address your key point about the date. They had the fact to show you weren't pulling a fast one but ignored it.

If it were me I'd continue but you'd be punting £30.
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ZigZagZog
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:32
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Yeah, well I figured they'd reject the initial appeal - it's their MO. They're playing a numbers game & they know more people will give up at every step of the process, donating more money to the parking weasels at the council.

John is facing a conundrum. He has limited funds but also limited time to fight this.

Stamford, what's involved in the appeal? Is it just submitting the same arguments to a different, impartial person or is there more work / time needs spending?
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stamfordman
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:40
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Wait for the notice to owner if you want to continue and then make a more detailed appeal with examples.

is the car registered to him at his address - all OK with V5C details?
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ZigZagZog
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 10:56
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Thanks, all the paperwork is in order.

He's annoyed, seeing this as the council being money grubbing & bloody minded in the face of an honest mistake where no attempt was being made to rook the council & where he had no advantage to gain.
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stamfordman
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 11:03
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Well if John isn't you then why not offer the £30 yourself if he loses. That way he can't lose.
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ZigZagZog
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 11:09
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John isn't me.

I just did that. I may be wrong but I don't see how common sense cannot prevail at the formal challenge.
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stamfordman
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 11:35
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QUOTE (ZigZagZog @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:09) *
I just did that. I may be wrong but I don't see how common sense cannot prevail at the formal challenge.


Common sense and councils is an oxymoron. They may back down when they see you'll take it to adjudication but be prepared for two more steps.
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typefish
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:01
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QUOTE (ZigZagZog @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 11:11) *
In order for a full-day parking permit to be valid, the driver must ensure that they scratch off one day, date and month. This information is clearly stated on the parking permit.


I thought it was a half day permit?
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ZigZagZog
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 12:08
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fish,

You're correct. Does that help the cause?

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ZigZagZog
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 14:40
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"I note you have stated you work for Merton Council, however, to exempt one vehicle whilst others are respecting the regulations would be unfair and ultimately defeat the purpose of the enforcement."

No idea what Merton Parking Services are talking about here. No such claim was made. The appeal was submitted as you see it below in blue.

Is it possible the parking weasel who handled this appeal muddled it up with another appeal? Any traction to be made from this mistake & the confusion over the Half Day Permit?

I received the PCN xxxxxxxxx with the parking contravention 19s on 09/07/18 at xx.xx. I would ask the council to please use their discretion to kindly waive this PCN for the reasons outlined below.

I used a valid parking permit but forgot to scratch off the month part, in this case for 'July'. It was a foolish, honest mistake – I was pushed for time as I was running late and in my haste simply omitted scratching off the last of the four sections, the month the permit was for. The car was otherwise parked properly and safely as you can see from your CEO's photos.

I'd like to point out that with the boxes I had scratched out on the parking permit I used it could only ever have been used on the 09/07/2018 as there is not another Monday the 9th to come in any month remaining in 2018. The permit was only and could only ever be valid for that particular Monday, July 9th, 2018.

I am very sorry about the inconvenience to your department and to have wasted your time. I can only reiterate that it was an honest and silly mistake, arguably a trifling de minimis mistake, with no intention on my part to game the system or parking regulations and no possible gain to be made by me. I would be very, very grateful if you would look kindly upon this request and please let me off for my silly mistake.


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rosturra
post Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 16:35
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QUOTE (ZigZagZog @ Thu, 16 Aug 2018 - 15:40) *
I'd like to point out that with the boxes I had scratched out on the parking permit I used it could only ever have been used on the 09/07/2018 as there is not another Monday the 9th to come in any month remaining in 2018. The permit was only and could only ever be valid for that particular Monday, July 9th, 2018.[/i][/b]


"It could only ever have been used on the 09/07/2018"


Really?

There is no 'Year' field in the parking permit.

Whilst there isn't another Monday the 9th in 2018... it could be re-used in 2019!



PS. It seems a bit sneaky that the permit is am or pm only.

Does this mean that if you want to park at 11am for 2 hours you need two half day passes?
In Greenwich the half day passes allow you 4 hours, and you scratch the start time.

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ZigZagZog
post Sat, 22 Sep 2018 - 11:06
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Hello again everybody.

Received the missive below from the lovely people in Merton's parking enforcement office. If you recall, the plan was to appeal on the basis/hope of common sense prevailing here (I know) & the adjudicator recognising that this was an honest mistake of not scratching out the appropriate 'month' box on a Half Day Residents permit, that there was no intention to game the system or profit.

In addition to this strategy I was wondering...... in the declination of the informal appeal (post 27) Merton has made several mistakes, amongst them "On this occasion when the CEO observed the vehicle a full-day visitor’s permit was seen on display" & "I note you have stated you work for Merton Council", neither of which is accurate - ½ day permit was used & no claim to work for Merton was ever made (see informal appeal, post 19). Is that enough to raise a doubt in the independent adjudicator's mind that Merton are mixing up their PCN replies & have in fact replied to the wrong person?

I wonder if the experts here can spot any mistakes Merton has made in their latest correspondence (below) declining the informal appeal which hurt them & help John?

Once again, thanks in anticipation of your answers & help.








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stamfordman
post Sat, 22 Sep 2018 - 11:39
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I can't see anything wrong with the NTO, but others might.

In your formal appeal, yes I would certainly raise the mistakes they made in their rejection to the challenge, the failure to address your key point, as well as restating the grounds for appeal.

The paper trail then leads to it all being presented to the adjudicator should they reject again.

So draft the reps and post here.
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