PePiPoo Helping the motorist get justice Support health workers

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

[NIP Wizard] A505 - 3 possible camera locations
Proconsul
post Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 13:29
Post #1


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 9
Joined: 30 Oct 2018
Member No.: 100,672



NIP Details and Circumstances
What is the name of the Constabulary? -
Date of the offence: - January 2024
Date of the NIP: - 4 days after the offence
Date you received the NIP: - 7 days after the offence
Location of offence (exact location as it appears on the NIP: important): - A505 Dunstable Road W/B btwn M1 jnc 11 and Poynters Road, Luton, Bedfordshire
Was the NIP addressed to you? - Yes
Was the NIP sent by first class post, second class or recorded delivery? - Not known
If your are not the Registered Keeper, what is your relationship to the vehicle? -
How many current points do you have? - 0
Provide a description of events (if you know what happened) telling us as much about the incident as possible - some things that may seem trivial to you may be important, so don't leave anything out. Please do not post personal details for obvious reasons - Having left the M1, then driving along a dual carriageway, west towards Dunstable.

Nothing memorable occurred. Just driving along with the rest of the traffic.

The alleged speed was 37mph - by "automatic camera device"

It also has:
"Time into red: 0 seconds".
I have no idea of the relevance.
(Surely that would be for jumping a red light?)

The location is unclear.
According to StreetView there are at least 3 cameras pointing west - "btwn M1 J11 and Poynters Road" - just under 1.1mile.

How can a defence be considered when the location of the alleged offence is unclear ?

(Note: Date received NIP is a best guess.


Questions/requests that occur include:
1. Which location / camera ?
2. Please provide photographs.
3. When was the relevant camera last calibrated ?

Are these reasonable ?
If so, should they be asked together or one at a time ?



NIP Wizard Responses
These were the responses used by the Wizard to arrive at its recommendation:
Have you received a NIP? - Yes
Are you the Registered Keeper of the vehicle concerned (is your name and address on the V5/V5C)? - Yes
Did the first NIP arrive within 14 days? - Yes
Although you are the Registered Keeper, were you also the keeper of the vehicle concerned (the person normally responsible for it) at the time of the alleged offence? - Yes
Were you driving? - Yes
Which country did the alleged offence take place in? - England

NIP Wizard Recommendation
Based on these responses the Wizard suggested that this course of action should be considered:
  • The law requires you to provide the information requested in the Section 172 notice within the 28 day period, naming yourself as the driver. If you are considering obtaining formal legal advice, do so before returning the notice.

    You should note that there is nothing to be gained by responding any earlier than you have to at any stage of the process. You are likely to receive a Conditional Offer of a Fixed Penalty (COFP) and further reminder(s). If you want to continue the fight, you should ignore all correspondence from the police until you receive a summons. You need to understand from the outset that while you will receive much help and support from members on the forums, you will need to put time and effort into fighting your case and ultimately be prepared to stand up in court to defend yourself.

Generated by the PePiPoo NIP Wizard v3.3.2: Sun, 25 Feb 2024 13:29:56 +0000

This post has been edited by Proconsul: Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 14:03
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
 
Start new topic
Replies (1 - 9)
Advertisement
post Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 13:29
Post #


Advertise here!









Go to the top of the page
 
Quote Post
The Rookie
post Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 13:34
Post #2


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 56,260
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
From: Warwickshire
Member No.: 317



The NIP is used for both speeding and red light, what you note there is common. I agree it’s a bit confusing (and poor practice) but it’s not going to help you.

I believe those are average speed cameras so you aren’t caught at a single camera but between two of them.

What does confuse me slightly here is that I don’t believe the A505 meets Poynters road which runs parallel to it (based on Google maps).


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
mickR
post Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 13:54
Post #3


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7,244
Joined: 5 Jan 2007
From: England
Member No.: 9,919



QUOTE (The Rookie @ Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 13:34) *
I believe those are average speed cameras so you aren’t caught at a single camera but between two of them.

What does confuse me slightly here is that I don’t believe the A505 meets Poynters road which runs parallel to it (based on Google maps).


yep they are AS cams.

yes Simon you are confused Poynters road doesnt run parallel, it is the road off the 505 at the next roundabout

This post has been edited by mickR: Sat, 2 Mar 2024 - 18:26
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
FuzzyDuck
post Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 13:58
Post #4


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 402
Joined: 17 May 2021
Member No.: 112,702



QUOTE (The Rookie @ Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 13:34) *
What does confuse me slightly here is that I don’t believe the A505 meets Poynters road which runs parallel to it (based on Google maps).

Looks like it meets at a roundabout to me, by the Premier Inn.

So quoting a 1.1m section of the A505 that is covered by average speed cameras seems perfectly reasonable to me.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
NewJudge
post Sun, 25 Feb 2024 - 14:50
Post #5


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 4,777
Joined: 29 Oct 2008
Member No.: 23,623



QUOTE (KaiserDJ @ Sat, 24 Feb 2024 - 20:25) *
Questions/requests that occur include:
1. Which location / camera ?
2. Please provide photographs.
3. When was the relevant camera last calibrated ?

1. Covered above.

2. You are not entitled to them (or any other evidence) at this stage. You can ask for "photographs which may help identify the driver" (obviously before you respond naming yourself as driver). The police do not have to but usually will. I don't really see what you hope to gain from them, though.

3. Again, you are not entitled to it. Even if you have it, it is unlikely to help you. The lack of a calibration certificate by itself is not fatal to a prosecution.

You should be offered a course for that speed (provided you have not done one in the last three years) or a fixed penalty (£100 and 3 points) as the alternative. If you want to accept either of those you must accept the allegation as it stands as the police will not enter into dialogue with you. If you want to see anything that the police will rely on to convict you, you must opt for the matter to be dealt with in court and then you will be served with the evidence. The penalty in court, even if you plead guilty, will be considerably higher than either the course or fixed penalty.

Your priority at the moment is to respond to the "request for driver's details within the time allowed.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Proconsul
post Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 13:06
Post #6


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 9
Joined: 30 Oct 2018
Member No.: 100,672



Thank you all for your prompt replies.

I suppose it is my fault for not noticing the Average Speed Check sign....but I suppose I assumed they would be on a gantry (all ASC locally to me are).

30mph on a dual carriageway just seems wrong ! sad.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Jlc
post Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 13:34
Post #7


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 41,580
Joined: 25 Aug 2011
From: Planet Earth
Member No.: 49,223



QUOTE (Proconsul @ Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 13:06) *
30mph on a dual carriageway just seems wrong ! sad.gif

The 30mph terminal signs (here) and the system of street lighting make it a restricted road (30mph) by the absence of signs to the contrary.

This post has been edited by Jlc: Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 13:34


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
The Rookie
post Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 14:05
Post #8


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 56,260
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
From: Warwickshire
Member No.: 317



QUOTE (Proconsul @ Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 13:06) *
30mph on a dual carriageway just seems wrong ! sad.gif

There are probably more miles of 30mph DC than any other speed limit in this country.


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Jlc
post Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 14:17
Post #9


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 41,580
Joined: 25 Aug 2011
From: Planet Earth
Member No.: 49,223



QUOTE (The Rookie @ Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 14:05) *
QUOTE (Proconsul @ Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 13:06) *
30mph on a dual carriageway just seems wrong ! sad.gif

There are probably more miles of 30mph DC than any other speed limit in this country.

Not sure on the stats but many do drive like my Father with, "This feels like a 40mph road". After leaving a 70mph motorway 30mph does feel like going backwards...


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
baroudeur
post Sat, 2 Mar 2024 - 15:16
Post #10


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 939
Joined: 24 Sep 2014
Member No.: 73,212



QUOTE (Proconsul @ Mon, 26 Feb 2024 - 13:06) *


Home territory for me.

1st camera HERE

2nd camera after the traffic lights HERE

3rd camera HERE

If continuing to Dunstable there is another pair of ASCs on Luton Road.

Poynters Road is at the junction of Dunstable Road (Luton) and Luton Road Dunstable.

EDit: better GSV with sign and camera

This post has been edited by baroudeur: Sat, 2 Mar 2024 - 15:24
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



Advertisement

Advertise here!

RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: Tuesday, 16th April 2024 - 07:10
Pepipoo uses cookies. You can find details of the cookies we use here along with links to information on how to manage them.
Please click the button to accept our cookies and hide this message. We’ll also assume that you’re happy to accept them if you continue to use the site.
IPS Driver Error

IPS Driver Error

There appears to be an error with the database.
You can try to refresh the page by clicking here