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Help with Wright Hassall, Threads merged
alexsyl
post Tue, 12 Apr 2016 - 08:13
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Hi all,

Apologies in advance - I'm new here and I know there are countless topics regarding these issues but I'm not sure what to do next.

In November 2015 I parked in the Abbey Walk car park in Selby (the Sainsburys one, in case anyone knows it). It was always free to park and is close to the town centre, as I was meeting a couple of friends for some food there. I arrived at around 7pm ish and left around 10.30.

I didn't think anything of it, so imagine my surprise when I received a letter from ZZPS dated 19th February 2016 saying I had an unpaid parking fine from the above. Turns out this car park is now managed by Vehicle Control Services on an ANPR sheme, which is not exactly well publicised (and by that I mean I couldnt see any signs up in the car park regarding said parking restrictions). I had never received any prior correspondence from VCS to advise that I had a parking fine or anything like that.

I wrote to both ZZPS and VCS, on the same day, disputing the charge as I had never received any prior notification and therefore could not appeal within the initial given period. I did originally research on here and a couple of other websites to help me gain some content for said letters, so said that I would not pay ZZPS as it's all speculative invoices, is not a genuine pre-estimate of loss, and there is significant lack of signage in the car park to show the parking restrictions.

I got the usual templated b*llocks letter back, refusing to answer any of my points that I raised, so I wrote to them again to deny the debt to ZZPS and refuse to deal with ZZPS, and demanded they respond fully to the issues and points that I raised in my initial letter, saying that if I didnt hear from them within 14 days then I'd consider the matter closed.

So, yesterday, I receive a letter in the post from Wright Hassall, dated 29th March (but only arrived yesterday - convenient?) - which I have scanned and attached. This looks different to the usual WH templated letters that I have seen people posting about on here and elsewhere - so I am completely unsure how to respond.

Obviously I want to completely stand my ground and have no intention of paying this - I'm just worried about it getting to the CCJ stage.

Is there anyone who could please provide me with some help on how to respond to this WH letter? I'm a bit of a newbie with these kinds of things so anything in laymans terms would be much appreciated.

Thank you!

This post has been edited by alexsyl: Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 11:12
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post Tue, 12 Apr 2016 - 08:13
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Jlc
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 08:45
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If they are ignoring your legitimate attempts to resolve the matter prior to proceedings then you tell them so and that such behaviour could be deemed unreasonable and could impact their ability to claim (already limited) costs even if they won.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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alexsyl
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 09:17
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Whats the best way to phrase stuff like that? Or is there an existing letter for this kind of thing that I could use?

I dont want to go in too "angry" as obviously they are a solicitors, which may affect my corner if it does go further.

Do I threaten harrassment or the SRA or taking it higher within their own company?
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The Rookie
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 09:55
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Is it a real letter before claim, we have seen many headed this that are not!


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 8-0 PPC's
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alexsyl
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 10:01
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Good point - it just looks like a bog standard template letter from WH, so I'm not 100% sure now.

The letter is at home and I'm currently not, so will take a scan of it tonight and post it in here for review.
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nosferatu1001
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 11:07
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However WH (ZZPS) confirmed a tone pooint that if it stats "formal letter of claim" or similar, then it si a LBA

A simple response of two or three lines. nothing more. State you will draw the courts attention to their unreasonable behaaviour and will ask for an exceptional costs order (if you want to go in heavy)

The SRA do gak. Theyre pretty useless.
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hexaflexagon
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 11:07
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...just noticed a reference number in the top left corner of the WH letter. If this uniquely identifies you and should WH be reading this I suggest you redact it.
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alexsyl
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 11:14
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Edited the attachment now - thank you for pointing that out

I'll get a copy of the WH letter tonight and post it on here - will then draft a response and check it here before I send it on
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hexaflexagon
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 11:29
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When you first wrote to VCS did you ask them for a copy of the original PCN and did they send it. If so would you upload it here - redacted of course. If not it's not unreasonable to write to them again, pointing out you have never seen a PCN so would like a copy since you need to know precisely what the charge relates to.

What about the signage? Have you got pictures and if so would you upload these too. You never know but this may be relevant.
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alexsyl
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 11:37
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I didnt ask for a copy of the original PCN I'm afraid - just that I hadnt received it and therefore could not appeal within the 14 days etc. From other topics I have read on here though, if I were to write to VCS they'll just refuse to help me as the case went to ZZPS and is now with WH?

I have a picture of the entry to the car park which confirms no signage - however this is taken from the internet so may be slightly out of date. I have not been back since, however, I may go one evening this week as I messaged the retailer who the car park "belongs to" and they said to go in with the letters and see if they can do anything about it...
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hexaflexagon
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 11:54
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QUOTE (alexsyl @ Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 12:37) *
I didnt ask for a copy of the original PCN I'm afraid - just that I hadn't received it and therefore could not appeal within the 14 days etc. From other topics I have read on here though, if I were to write to VCS they'll just refuse to help me as the case went to ZZPS and is now with WH?


Nevertheless it's VCS who are the claimants and if they refuse to let you have a document which is the entire basis of their claim then the fact that this reasonable request has not been met would not impress a court should it ever get that far. It can only be to your advantage to request this and you have nothing to lose. Copy WH in on the correspondence too.
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alexsyl
post Mon, 18 Apr 2016 - 13:15
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Righto, thank you. Will get the letter tonight and post it up here, then can draft some replies and get them sent. Thank you
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nosferatu1001
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 07:20
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First class, free proof of posting, every time you send through the post smile.gif
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alexsyl
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 08:19
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So yesterday I got home and had another letter from WH, basically saying that in light of my letter questioning their case, they have referred it back to the client and my case is on hold pending their responses.

In light of this, would you now not reply, until I receive a further letter with the "findings" (which there are none) from their case, or would you still reply anyway?

Copies of both letters are in the same attachment with any relevant details blanked out.

Attached File  WH_letters_april_2016.pdf ( 391.29K ) Number of downloads: 207
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hexaflexagon
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 08:31
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I see no point in responding to this letter. You might want to allude to it in the letter mentioned earlier that you're sending to VCS and copying to WH.

Also for a sanity check upload the letter you intend sending to VCS to this thread first,
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alexsyl
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 08:59
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Hows about the following?

Also, can anyone confirm for my reference, is the Letter Before Claim I received from WH a legitimate one, or one of the fake ones?


Dear Vehicle Control Services

Ref: xxxxxxxxxxxxx

In light of an ongoing issue with regards to an alleged packing infringement at xxxxxxxx on xx/xx/xxxx, I stated to you in my initial letter of xx/xx/xxxx that I had never received an initial parking charge notice, and the further letter from ZZPS was the first I had ever heard of it, and thus was unable to appeal within the initial 14-day period. I would therefore like to request that you send me an original copy of the parking charge notice within the next 14 days please.

This issue is currently being contested with Wright Hassall solicitors (a copy of this letter has been sent on to them for reference), and they have informed me that the case is currently on hold pending investigation with their client (ZZPS Limited).

Please note that if I do not receive this within the next 14 days as stated above, then I will consider this matter closed and no further action will be taken.

Yours faithfully,

xxxxxxxxx
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Gan
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 09:22
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QUOTE (alexsyl @ Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 09:59) *
Hows about the following?

Also, can anyone confirm for my reference, is the Letter Before Claim I received from WH a legitimate one, or one of the fake ones?

Regard it as genuine

Dear Vehicle Control Services

Ref: xxxxxxxxxxxxx

In light of an ongoing issue with regards to an alleged packing infringement at xxxxxxxx on xx/xx/xxxx, I stated to you in my initial letter of xx/xx/xxxx that I had never received an initial parking charge notice, and the further letter from ZZPS was the first I had ever heard of it, and thus was unable to appeal within the initial 14-day period.

This issue is currently being contested with I have received a Formal Letter Before Claim from Wright Hassall solicitors (a copy of this letter has been sent on to them for reference), and they who have since informed me that the case is currently on hold pending investigation with their client (ZZPS Limited). I therefore require an original copy of the parking charge notice. Copies of their letters are enclosed.

Please note that if I do not receive this within the next 14 days as stated above, then I will consider this matter closed and no further action will be taken.
Please provide this within ten days so that I can provide a detailed response to the Letter Before Claim.

Thank You

Yours faithfully,

xxxxxxxxx

cc Wright Hassall solicitors


This post has been edited by Gan: Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 09:24
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alexsyl
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 09:43
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Thank you - will get these sent off today

Something to add - I will be imminently changing address, and although I have a mail redirection on, should I inform these clowns of my new address or not?
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Raxiel
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 09:44
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You have a typo:
QUOTE
with regards to an alleged packing infringement
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alexsyl
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 09:53
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thanks - I had noticed and corrected it in my actual letter smile.gif
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Gan
post Tue, 19 Apr 2016 - 10:50
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Yes

Make sure that you make the new address very clear to both Wright Hassall

Keep a copy of the letter and get a receipt from the Post Office when you send it

That way, you eliminate the risk of not receiving the claim if the re-direction fails

You can also prove that they're entirely responsible and therefore liable for the cost of a set aside application if they still send it to the old address
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