Box Junction - PCN Letter Received Late |
Box Junction - PCN Letter Received Late |
Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:13
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#1
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 14 Jul 2018 Member No.: 98,900 |
Hi guys,
I returned from a 1 week holiday on 7th July to find two letters from the council relating to a box junction contravention, one PCN and one Charge Certificate. I don't disagree with the contravention based on photos. However, by the time I had received the letters I missed the chance to pay the discounted rate of £65 and this is now at £195. The date of the notice was 23rd May. Even if these both arrived on the day I went on holiday on 30th June, the deadline for me paying the discounted rate had still long gone. I generally don't have many issues with my post so I find it fishy the first letter has arrived so late. Had I got the first letter I would have just paid it and moved on but this seems very unreasonable. Is there anything I can do to avoid paying the higher fee? I did email them as soon as I got these telling them the situation but they essentially ignored what I said and quoted dates of the notices. I have (hopefully) attached photos of the two letters below. Thanks This post has been edited by lakka: Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:04 |
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Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:13
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Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:20
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 23,582 Joined: 12 Feb 2013 From: London Member No.: 59,924 |
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Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:32
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#3
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 14 Jul 2018 Member No.: 98,900 |
Even if these both arrived on the day I went on holiday on 30th July, Presume you mean 30 June? is your name and address correct on the letters? is the car leased or registered to you? There may be a case here that the PCN was served out of time. No I do mean I went away on 30th June (no letters received until that point) returned last week on 7th July. That's my issue, the date on the first letter is 23rd May but hasn't come through until over a month later. Everything on it seems correct and yes the car is registered to me This post has been edited by lakka: Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:33 |
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Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:35
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,308 Joined: 9 May 2014 Member No.: 70,515 |
What are the dates on the postmarks?
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Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:39
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#5
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 14 Jul 2018 Member No.: 98,900 |
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Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:48
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 23,582 Joined: 12 Feb 2013 From: London Member No.: 59,924 |
You put 30 July in your first post.
The envelopes may well have been useful - presume they are gone. You can't appeal the charge certificate but can wait for debt recovery and say you didn't get the PCN, which would be truthful in that it wasn't delivered when it should have been. Any trouble with post? |
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Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:06
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#7
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 14 Jul 2018 Member No.: 98,900 |
You put 30 July in your first post. The envelopes may well have been useful - presume they are gone. You can't appeal the charge certificate but can wait for debt recovery and say you didn't get the PCN, which would be truthful in that it wasn't delivered when it should have been. Any trouble with post? My mistake, you're right I put 30th July I meant June, just updated, cheers! Yeah the envelopes are gone now but in general I don't usually have any problems with my post being delayed. When you say wait for the debt recovery, is this referring to the statutory declaration process I have read about? |
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Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:15
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 23,582 Joined: 12 Feb 2013 From: London Member No.: 59,924 |
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Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 07:57
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#9
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 14 Jul 2018 Member No.: 98,900 |
Ok thanks I will wait until I get the debt recovery
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Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 09:20
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#10
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Member Group: Members Posts: 23,582 Joined: 12 Feb 2013 From: London Member No.: 59,924 |
Wait for others to comment. It's a criminal offence to make a false declaration which you would technically be doing, but receiving the PCN and CC at the same time is not right, albeit you were on holiday.
There may be a case for talking to the council. |
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Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 19:06
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 26,655 Joined: 6 Nov 2014 Member No.: 74,048 |
The PCn would be deemed served on the 25th of may unless you can show it was not. That does not really matter as the enforcement process is predetermined by the date of notice.
Can you show it was not served, Else how can you say the PCN was not received Asking the council to accept representations out of time explaining why and presenting any evidence of a poor postal service that you can is possibly your best option -------------------- All advice is given freely. It is given without guarantee and responsibility for its use rests with the user
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Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 19:29
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#12
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 14 Jul 2018 Member No.: 98,900 |
The PCn would be deemed served on the 25th of may unless you can show it was not. That does not really matter as the enforcement process is predetermined by the date of notice. Can you show it was not served, Else how can you say the PCN was not received Asking the council to accept representations out of time explaining why and presenting any evidence of a poor postal service that you can is possibly your best option I don't see any possible way I can prove that the letter arrived way later than what it should have. With regards to the statutory declaration, what about if I tick I did not receive it then explain under the 'reasons' section specifically that I did not receive it within either the 14 or 28 day periods? |
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Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 22:05
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#13
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Member Group: Members Posts: 26,655 Joined: 6 Nov 2014 Member No.: 74,048 |
The PCn would be deemed served on the 25th of may unless you can show it was not. That does not really matter as the enforcement process is predetermined by the date of notice. Can you show it was not served, Else how can you say the PCN was not received Asking the council to accept representations out of time explaining why and presenting any evidence of a poor postal service that you can is possibly your best option I don't see any possible way I can prove that the letter arrived way later than what it should have. With regards to the statutory declaration, what about if I tick I did not receive it then explain under the 'reasons' section specifically that I did not receive it within either the 14 or 28 day periods? It is a tick box exercise. You must decide if you can truthfully submit that you did not receive it. The penalty for knowingly making a false declaration is a fine of up to £5000 -------------------- All advice is given freely. It is given without guarantee and responsibility for its use rests with the user
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Mon, 16 Jul 2018 - 13:36
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#14
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 14 Jul 2018 Member No.: 98,900 |
The PCn would be deemed served on the 25th of may unless you can show it was not. That does not really matter as the enforcement process is predetermined by the date of notice. Can you show it was not served, Else how can you say the PCN was not received Asking the council to accept representations out of time explaining why and presenting any evidence of a poor postal service that you can is possibly your best option I don't see any possible way I can prove that the letter arrived way later than what it should have. With regards to the statutory declaration, what about if I tick I did not receive it then explain under the 'reasons' section specifically that I did not receive it within either the 14 or 28 day periods? It is a tick box exercise. You must decide if you can truthfully submit that you did not receive it. The penalty for knowingly making a false declaration is a fine of up to £5000 That's unfortunate, looks like I am going to have to swallow the £195 these crooks are charging me |
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