PePiPoo Helping the motorist get justice Support health workers

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

Box Junction - PCN Letter Received Late
lakka
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:13
Post #1


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7
Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Member No.: 98,900



Hi guys,

I returned from a 1 week holiday on 7th July to find two letters from the council relating to a box junction contravention, one PCN and one Charge Certificate.

I don't disagree with the contravention based on photos. However, by the time I had received the letters I missed the chance to pay the discounted rate of £65 and this is now at £195. The date of the notice was 23rd May.

Even if these both arrived on the day I went on holiday on 30th June, the deadline for me paying the discounted rate had still long gone.

I generally don't have many issues with my post so I find it fishy the first letter has arrived so late.

Had I got the first letter I would have just paid it and moved on but this seems very unreasonable.

Is there anything I can do to avoid paying the higher fee?

I did email them as soon as I got these telling them the situation but they essentially ignored what I said and quoted dates of the notices.

I have (hopefully) attached photos of the two letters below.

Thanks





This post has been edited by lakka: Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:04
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
 
Start new topic
Replies (1 - 13)
Advertisement
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:13
Post #


Advertise here!









Go to the top of the page
 
Quote Post
stamfordman
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:20
Post #2


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 23,582
Joined: 12 Feb 2013
From: London
Member No.: 59,924



QUOTE (lakka @ Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:13) *
Even if these both arrived on the day I went on holiday on 30th July,



Presume you mean 30 June?


is your name and address correct on the letters? is the car leased or registered to you?

There may be a case here that the PCN was served out of time.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
lakka
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:32
Post #3


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7
Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Member No.: 98,900



QUOTE (stamfordman @ Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:20) *
QUOTE (lakka @ Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:13) *
Even if these both arrived on the day I went on holiday on 30th July,



Presume you mean 30 June?


is your name and address correct on the letters? is the car leased or registered to you?

There may be a case here that the PCN was served out of time.


No I do mean I went away on 30th June (no letters received until that point) returned last week on 7th July. That's my issue, the date on the first letter is 23rd May but hasn't come through until over a month later.

Everything on it seems correct and yes the car is registered to me

This post has been edited by lakka: Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:33
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
John U.K.
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:35
Post #4


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 4,308
Joined: 9 May 2014
Member No.: 70,515



What are the dates on the postmarks?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
lakka
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:39
Post #5


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7
Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Member No.: 98,900



QUOTE (John U.K. @ Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:35) *
What are the dates on the postmarks?


I binned the envelopes but didn't check, presumably that's what you mean?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
stamfordman
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 21:48
Post #6


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 23,582
Joined: 12 Feb 2013
From: London
Member No.: 59,924



You put 30 July in your first post.

The envelopes may well have been useful - presume they are gone.

You can't appeal the charge certificate but can wait for debt recovery and say you didn't get the PCN, which would be truthful in that it wasn't delivered when it should have been.

Any trouble with post?

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
lakka
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:06
Post #7


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7
Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Member No.: 98,900



QUOTE (stamfordman @ Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:48) *
You put 30 July in your first post.

The envelopes may well have been useful - presume they are gone.

You can't appeal the charge certificate but can wait for debt recovery and say you didn't get the PCN, which would be truthful in that it wasn't delivered when it should have been.

Any trouble with post?


My mistake, you're right I put 30th July I meant June, just updated, cheers!

Yeah the envelopes are gone now but in general I don't usually have any problems with my post being delayed.

When you say wait for the debt recovery, is this referring to the statutory declaration process I have read about?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
stamfordman
post Sat, 14 Jul 2018 - 22:15
Post #8


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 23,582
Joined: 12 Feb 2013
From: London
Member No.: 59,924



Yes, see here:

https://www.londontribunals.gov.uk/eat/unde...rcement-process
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
lakka
post Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 07:57
Post #9


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7
Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Member No.: 98,900



Ok thanks I will wait until I get the debt recovery
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
stamfordman
post Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 09:20
Post #10


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 23,582
Joined: 12 Feb 2013
From: London
Member No.: 59,924



Wait for others to comment. It's a criminal offence to make a false declaration which you would technically be doing, but receiving the PCN and CC at the same time is not right, albeit you were on holiday.

There may be a case for talking to the council.


Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PASTMYBEST
post Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 19:06
Post #11


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 26,655
Joined: 6 Nov 2014
Member No.: 74,048



The PCn would be deemed served on the 25th of may unless you can show it was not. That does not really matter as the enforcement process is predetermined by the date of notice.

Can you show it was not served, Else how can you say the PCN was not received Asking the council to accept representations out of time explaining why and presenting any evidence of a poor postal service that you can is possibly your best option


--------------------
All advice is given freely. It is given without guarantee and responsibility for its use rests with the user
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
lakka
post Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 19:29
Post #12


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7
Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Member No.: 98,900



QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 20:06) *
The PCn would be deemed served on the 25th of may unless you can show it was not. That does not really matter as the enforcement process is predetermined by the date of notice.

Can you show it was not served, Else how can you say the PCN was not received Asking the council to accept representations out of time explaining why and presenting any evidence of a poor postal service that you can is possibly your best option


I don't see any possible way I can prove that the letter arrived way later than what it should have.

With regards to the statutory declaration, what about if I tick I did not receive it then explain under the 'reasons' section specifically that I did not receive it within either the 14 or 28 day periods?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PASTMYBEST
post Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 22:05
Post #13


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 26,655
Joined: 6 Nov 2014
Member No.: 74,048



QUOTE (lakka @ Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 20:29) *
QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 20:06) *
The PCn would be deemed served on the 25th of may unless you can show it was not. That does not really matter as the enforcement process is predetermined by the date of notice.

Can you show it was not served, Else how can you say the PCN was not received Asking the council to accept representations out of time explaining why and presenting any evidence of a poor postal service that you can is possibly your best option


I don't see any possible way I can prove that the letter arrived way later than what it should have.

With regards to the statutory declaration, what about if I tick I did not receive it then explain under the 'reasons' section specifically that I did not receive it within either the 14 or 28 day periods?


It is a tick box exercise. You must decide if you can truthfully submit that you did not receive it. The penalty for knowingly making a false declaration is a fine of up to £5000


--------------------
All advice is given freely. It is given without guarantee and responsibility for its use rests with the user
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
lakka
post Mon, 16 Jul 2018 - 13:36
Post #14


New Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7
Joined: 14 Jul 2018
Member No.: 98,900



QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 23:05) *
QUOTE (lakka @ Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 20:29) *
QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sun, 15 Jul 2018 - 20:06) *
The PCn would be deemed served on the 25th of may unless you can show it was not. That does not really matter as the enforcement process is predetermined by the date of notice.

Can you show it was not served, Else how can you say the PCN was not received Asking the council to accept representations out of time explaining why and presenting any evidence of a poor postal service that you can is possibly your best option


I don't see any possible way I can prove that the letter arrived way later than what it should have.

With regards to the statutory declaration, what about if I tick I did not receive it then explain under the 'reasons' section specifically that I did not receive it within either the 14 or 28 day periods?


It is a tick box exercise. You must decide if you can truthfully submit that you did not receive it. The penalty for knowingly making a false declaration is a fine of up to £5000


That's unfortunate, looks like I am going to have to swallow the £195 these crooks are charging me
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



Advertisement

Advertise here!

RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: Friday, 29th March 2024 - 08:58
Pepipoo uses cookies. You can find details of the cookies we use here along with links to information on how to manage them.
Please click the button to accept our cookies and hide this message. We’ll also assume that you’re happy to accept them if you continue to use the site.
IPS Driver Error

IPS Driver Error

There appears to be an error with the database.
You can try to refresh the page by clicking here