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PCN - Drove off before PCN attached, PCN sent in the post
defcon
post Fri, 13 Sep 2019 - 16:40
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Hi all,

I recently parked on double yellow lines for less than 5 mins while I went inside to grab my phone, I came out to a warden walking towards my car. When I stepped out it looked like he was walking towards my car and I didn't see him taking any photos or writing any details as yet so I got in my car and drove away and a PCN was sent via post. Below is the PCN and the images on the tower hamlets council's website. Any hope?







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post Fri, 13 Sep 2019 - 16:40
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defcon
post Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 00:26
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I've begun the appeal process, the adjudicator will have to make the decision based on my initial representation which I've submitted as evidence.
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cp8759
post Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 12:48
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QUOTE (defcon @ Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 01:26) *
I've begun the appeal process, the adjudicator will have to make the decision based on my initial representation which I've submitted as evidence.

Oh that's not ideal, as the council has to submit copies of your representations anyway. If the council contests the case, let us know as we can definitely submit something better than that to the adjudicator.


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If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
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defcon
post Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 13:21
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 13:48) *
QUOTE (defcon @ Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 01:26) *
I've begun the appeal process, the adjudicator will have to make the decision based on my initial representation which I've submitted as evidence.

Oh that's not ideal, as the council has to submit copies of your representations anyway. If the council contests the case, let us know as we can definitely submit something better than that to the adjudicator.


The appeal is online so I can update the evidence I've provided if need be
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Plywood-Enthusia...
post Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 14:24
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Good luck, the forum experts think it's an open and shut case based on procedural impropriety.

But do educate yourself on the highway code, if you do it on another borough you might not be so lucky on the technicality.

Incidently, LBTH do provide you with 5 minutes to load/unload of single and double yellow. Had you stopped in a more suitable place, probably a couple meters down you wouldn't have to deal with this grief.

Not many drivers are aware of the yellow lines on kerbs and what they mean for some reason. They're there for a reason, if you stop there you will cause a major obstruction to road users and pedestrians.

Just looking at the location here: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5127855,-0....6384!8i8192

You could have driven into st annes row which has sections without the no loading markings. Actually stopping in the spot you did completely blocks the road of everyone else. It's too narrow for any vehicles to stop.

This post has been edited by Plywood-Enthusiast: Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 14:30
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defcon
post Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 15:13
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QUOTE (Plywood-Enthusiast @ Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 15:24) *
Good luck, the forum experts think it's an open and shut case based on procedural impropriety.

But do educate yourself on the highway code, if you do it on another borough you might not be so lucky on the technicality.

Incidently, LBTH do provide you with 5 minutes to load/unload of single and double yellow. Had you stopped in a more suitable place, probably a couple meters down you wouldn't have to deal with this grief.

Not many drivers are aware of the yellow lines on kerbs and what they mean for some reason. They're there for a reason, if you stop there you will cause a major obstruction to road users and pedestrians.

Just looking at the location here: https://www.google.com/maps/@51.5127855,-0....6384!8i8192

You could have driven into st annes row which has sections without the no loading markings. Actually stopping in the spot you did completely blocks the road of everyone else. It's too narrow for any vehicles to stop.



You're right - I didn't actually notice the yellow kerb markings and assumed it was just DY (not that that's any better) The spot where I parked doesn't block the road though, there's space to turn which isn't clear from the PCN images - but still lesson very much learned and I appreciate the advice smile.gif

This post has been edited by defcon: Sat, 21 Sep 2019 - 15:14
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Big_Gaz
post Mon, 23 Sep 2019 - 15:26
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QUOTE (Mr Mustard @ Sat, 14 Sep 2019 - 22:42) *
There appears to be a fatal flaw in that the right to make representations under Regulation 4(h) of The Local Authorities' Traffic Orders (Procedure) (England and Wales) Regulations 1996 has not been communicated to you. Correction: Sorry. I think I copied & pasted from something else. I did of course mean The Civil Enforcement of Parking Contraventions (England) Representations and Appeals Regulations 2007 and The Civil Enforcement of Parking Contraventions (England) General Regulations 2007

It states 'in a case where a penalty charge notice was served by post on the basis that a civil enforcement officer was prevented by some person from fixing it to the vehicle concerned or handing it to the owner or person in charge of the vehicle, that no civil enforcement officer was so prevented'.

This isn't fatal - this ground is only for Reg 10(1)(b) of the Reps and Appeals Regs where the CEO is physically stopped from issuing PCN, e.g. by violence or threat. Drive-aways are issued under 10(1)( c ).
(Does anyone know how to stop the editor from converting <left bracket>c<right bracket>in to a copyright symbol?!)

QUOTE (Mr Mustard @ Sat, 14 Sep 2019 - 22:42) *
Also, the PCN does not contain the information at para 2(h) of the Schedule to the above stated Regulations which sets out why the PCN is being served by post, in short, either that the vehicle drove away or that some person prevented service of a PCN at the scene.

That is two procedural improprieties which should lead to a win at the tribunal although that representation has to be made to the council first of all.

(Councils often get Reg 10 PCNs wrong. I think they modelled this one on the Notice to Owner and forgot to make the necessary changes.)

Got them on this one, though!!
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cp8759
post Mon, 23 Sep 2019 - 18:33
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QUOTE (Big_Gaz @ Mon, 23 Sep 2019 - 16:26) *
(Does anyone know how to stop the editor from converting <left bracket>c<right bracket>in to a copyright symbol?!)

Use a Cyrillic с like this: (с)


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If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
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Big_Gaz
post Tue, 24 Sep 2019 - 08:06
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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Mon, 23 Sep 2019 - 19:33) *
Use a Cyrillic с like this: (с)

Awesome - thanks! biggrin.gif
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