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Totting up ban with Court date impending.
monkeybrains74
post Thu, 16 Nov 2017 - 20:55
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Hi.

First of all, I am full aware it's my own doing and even though the last offence was a genuine error on my part, it is still my own fault

The last offence took place on the 12/10/17. The road is a duel lane i.e. 2 lanes going the same direction (and 2 the other) through a town and I assumed wrongly that it was a 40 limit when it was in-fact a 30.

A policeman with a radar caught me doing 35 and so received a FPN a few days later.

I send the form back and this morning received the below:

"A further endorsement of 3 penalty points makes you liable for disqualification through the 'totting up' process. This can no longer be dealt with at the fixed penalty stage and xxxxxx Police will contact you in due course"

I checked earlier on the DVLA site and this is showing the below:


SP30
Penalty points: 3
Offence date: 25 Feb 2017

SP30
Penalty points: 3
Offence date: 2 May 2016

SP30
Penalty points: 3
Offence date: 18 Oct 2014
Expired

This shows that at the time, I had 9 points but the 3 on the 18th October came off just 6 days after the date of offence.

I'm really asking if anyone has any advice regarding my court appearance. I wish to accept fault but would like to know what I can possibly do to reduce any ban. Should I get legal representation?

The DVLA site is now showing I only have 6 points, so I guess the 3 expired came off and any for this latest offence are yet to be added?
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post Thu, 16 Nov 2017 - 20:55
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southpaw82
post Mon, 12 Feb 2018 - 22:56
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QUOTE (monkeybrains74 @ Mon, 12 Feb 2018 - 22:54) *
Maybe a sign would help.

Almost certainly!


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Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
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Logician
post Tue, 13 Feb 2018 - 01:15
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QUOTE (monkeybrains74 @ Mon, 12 Feb 2018 - 22:47) *
I guess it's not worth going in person then as it's going to be a waste of my time. I have no case for Exceptional Hardship apart from having to take orders to the Sorting Office but I'm sure they'd just tell me to get a Taxi. Thanks for your help all.


As you have no case for it, then there is no point in trying for exceptional hardship. They will ask you to attend court anyway, to ensure you know you have been disqualified and understand the consequences.



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progbloke
post Tue, 13 Feb 2018 - 11:38
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QUOTE (monkeybrains74 @ Mon, 12 Feb 2018 - 23:54) *
Everyone is overtaking me on that stretch of road when I'm doing 30.


You never know, some of them might get zapped as well.
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cp8759
post Tue, 13 Feb 2018 - 13:40
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QUOTE (monkeybrains74 @ Mon, 12 Feb 2018 - 22:54) *
Everyone is overtaking me on that stretch of road when I'm doing 30.

Every time I have ever driven from here up to the 50 signs, every single car has overtaken me well over 30 with one exception (which is memorable enough that I actually remember it), doesn't change the fact that the police could prosecute everyone who's doing 35 or more.


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I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
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monkeybrains74
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:21
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Hi.

First of all apologies for the image quality, I have to go out but will be back shortly and can upload another pic later.

I'm just wondering if this letter is what to be expected or does it seem possible that I may be let off?


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Jlc
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:28
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QUOTE (monkeybrains74 @ Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:21) *
...or does it seem possible that I may be let off?

Not sure how you come to that conclusion.

This is the opportunity to present your exceptional hardship plea should you want to.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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BaggieBoy
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:28
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QUOTE (monkeybrains74 @ Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:21) *
I'm just wondering if this letter is what to be expected or does it seem possible that I may be let off?

You aren't being let off (as in no punishment), they are giving you the chance to make a case for the likely totting ban not to be imposed.

This post has been edited by BaggieBoy: Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:29
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monkeybrains74
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:32
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I don't mean let off per se.

In other words, is this part of the process to be expected?

I didn't fill in anything in the hardship area of the return form, apart from saying sorry and not realising the speed limit had changed from 30 - 40.
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NewJudge
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:56
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QUOTE (monkeybrains74 @ Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 12:32) *
In other words, is this part of the process to be expected?

Yes. The court (or Single Justice) that first heard your matter decided that disqualification must be considered. You should not normally be disqualified in your absence without first warning you that it may happen and giving you the opportunity to attend court before it does. That's what the letter is for.

A plea of "Exceptional Hardship" can only be made in person before a court. You will have to give evidence under oath (or affirmation) explaining the hardship you or others will suffer. As the letter says, if you fail to turn up for your next hearing the matter will be dealt with in your absence and it is a certainty that you will receive a six month ban (which will begin immediately).

This post has been edited by NewJudge: Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 13:00
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monkeybrains74
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 13:19
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Okay, thank you very much.

I'm not sure whether it's worth attending as I don't have a hardship case, apart from taking my orders to the sorting office and general inconvenience. which I fully understand is not sufficient.

I think I'll attend and simply apologise again.
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Jlc
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 14:02
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There's nothing to lose in attempting an EH plea - but the chances seem slim.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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monkeybrains74
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 16:37
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Yes, I don't expect to but worth a go smile.gif
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notmeatloaf
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 17:22
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The advantage to replying (other than a punt at EH if you want it) is, as they say, otherwise you must not drive past 9/4 because even though the court hearing will not take place then, because disqualification is immediate you will have no way of knowing when it starts.

So depending on how busy/efficient the court is you will be having (albeit "voluntary") time added onto your six months. The ban will start from the day of the court hearing, not the 9th.

It depends on how much you value that extra time.
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monkeybrains74
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 17:59
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Yes, good point.

I'll get the form sent out tomorrow.

I guess it won't be too long to wait for a court date once that is in?
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notmeatloaf
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 18:18
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Depends on how busy they are. If you call the court they could probably let you know.
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monkeybrains74
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 18:34
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Thanks.

To be honest, the longer the better now as would like to make the most of as much of the summer as possible before the ban.
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monkeybrains74
post Wed, 21 Mar 2018 - 12:17
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I've been thinking over the past day that this ban would affect some of my customers and their delivery arrivals.

For small items, I take these to the sorting office in 3 postal sacks which I will be able to manage on foot, albeit I may have to take more than 1 trip.

However for larger items, I use MyHermes and their nearest drop-off point is around 2 miles away.

There is no way I can carry these larger items on foot and if I got a taxi/bus this would kill my profit.

I'm also not able to use the're pickup service as that would make another day for my customers, who always want their items as soon as possible. One of my selling points over competitors is that I offer speedy delivery.

==

Would the above be worth saying to the court? I truly am unsure how to workaround this.
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nosferatu1001
post Wed, 21 Mar 2018 - 13:05
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You can try for exceptional hardship. however theres a difference between kills profit short term (6 months) and kills your business totally.
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monkeybrains74
post Wed, 21 Mar 2018 - 13:41
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Yes, I understand fully.

I'm just thinking it's worth a try.
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monkeybrains74
post Thu, 19 Apr 2018 - 11:10
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Just a quick update to let you know my court date is on the 14th of June.

It was initially the 22nd of May but have just received another letter saying it's the 14th of June and that the case should now be referred to a full court hearing. (I did request a change in date for a later time but not sure if this is part of the reason why it's been changed).

Can I ask what this means (full court hearing)?

This post has been edited by monkeybrains74: Thu, 19 Apr 2018 - 11:25
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