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Private "Parking Charge Notice" in a private residential car-park where I have a permit but was "not in allocated bay" as someone else was in my bay
Oxfordshirelad
post Thu, 10 Jan 2019 - 16:26
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Hi all,

I received a parking charge notice from Premier Parking Solutions. From the advice I can see here it would seem my best bet is to just completely ignore the ticket, however, I couldn't find a case that matched completely.

The vehicle was parked in a private car park under a block of apartments. Whilst there are always lots of empty spaces in the day time when I returned my space had a car in it. We parked to the side of it which was not in an allocated bay, but the vehicle was not blocking the road in or out or any vehicle that needed to move around. I came back to my car 3 hours later and I had a ticket on it. We have a permit for the carpark which was displayed! - parking charge is £100 - OUTRAGEOUS!!! Reasoning is listed as "Not parked in allocated bay".

Every day people park in the same place as our vehicle did on this occasion and other areas where you can park and could class as "an overflow" but are not official bays. The parking inspectors don't have key flobs to get into our carpark (weirdly) so they depend on a car coming in or out to get in but surely giving me this is beyond ridiculous given I have a permit? Permits are NOT for a specific bay but just for the car park as a whole and bays are not marked for a certain vehicle so in theory I could park in any official bay (If by bay it means a space with white lines around it) and not get a ticket (although the bay owner would be annoyed!).

Any advice? Its the normal stuff of £60 if paid within 14 days, appeals, complaints, registered keeper details and data processing all listed on the ticket.

Other thing to note is clearly the printer the person used had an ink issue as there is a white mark running the length of the ticket that makes certain thinks illegible.

Any help is much appreciated.

Thanks.

This post has been edited by Oxfordshirelad: Thu, 10 Jan 2019 - 17:19
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post Thu, 10 Jan 2019 - 16:26
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John121
post Thu, 10 Jan 2019 - 16:48
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First of all dont mention who was driving the vehicle or who was parked, just refer to them as the "driver". Please edit your post above eliminating any trace of who the driver was and wait for the pros to come on here and advise you further.
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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:38
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Hi all,

Appreciate many are busy but have seen lots of activity so just commenting to move to top and hoping someone can help.

Thanks
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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:40
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Just follow the normal route for appeals
What do the signs say?
as you will have seen from reading other threads, its key to know what the signs say.
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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:44
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QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:40) *
Just follow the normal route for appeals
What do the signs say?
as you will have seen from reading other threads, its key to know what the signs say.


other threads / or one of the pinned posts seem to say ignoring it is the best way.

I'll have to take a look at the signs tonight and report back I cant remember off the top of my head.
Thanks tho
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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:48
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Noone here says to ignore! Thats massively outdated. Since 2012/13 the advice has been to respond.
You always appela once
Its the route after that that changes, depending on the AoS the PPC is a member of. If you get to go to POPLA you appeal to POPLA, otherwise if you have to go to IAS you sit tight until a LBC appears.

Read just this first page - no searching, READ - and you will see the options out there.

Also, as you will know from having read RESIDENTIAL ccases

See what your lease / rental agreement says about your RIGHTS as regards parking.
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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:55
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QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:48) *
Noone here says to ignore! Thats massively outdated. Since 2012/13 the advice has been to respond.
You always appela once
Its the route after that that changes, depending on the AoS the PPC is a member of. If you get to go to POPLA you appeal to POPLA, otherwise if you have to go to IAS you sit tight until a LBC appears.

Read just this first page - no searching, READ - and you will see the options out there.

Also, as you will know from having read RESIDENTIAL ccases

See what your lease / rental agreement says about your RIGHTS as regards parking.



I don't have a lease or rental agreement as I don't live there. I just have a permit through other means which allows me to park there.

I'll have a read and I guess on what you have said I'll appeal then.

Cheers

Yes its IAS!!! Not sure what an LBC is though.
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Jlc
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:59
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Let's see a picture of the signs. Do they have a number to call?


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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nosferatu1001
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 13:14
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Letter before claim

So you have any agreement at all outlining how you can park there? Dont be so damned cryptic. Gets dull quickly.
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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 14:14
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QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 13:14) *
Letter before claim

So you have any agreement at all outlining how you can park there? Dont be so damned cryptic. Gets dull quickly.


the first person who replied told me to edit my stuff because I wasn't being cryptic!!!!

I left the property I rented last yr and no one asked for my permit. I knew the guy wasn't going to rent out for a while so I've parked there as its next to the station for the past 2 months. Regardless I have a permit which permits me to park in that car-park which is the main thing
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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 15:09
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:59) *
Let's see a picture of the signs. Do they have a number to call?


Hi pictures below of the signage. It does say "park fully within a marked bay" but as you can see they have the diagonal line across the area below the sign but not where I parked and where a Volvo is now parked. Additionally as you pull into the car-park there is NO sign-posts at all. If I parked in 1 of the 1st spaces I could go years without seeing the signs which are randomly located half way inside and the back but always against back walls and not on the tall white posts (which would make sense!!). There is a phone number but this goes to an automated service where you can only leave messages - you cannot speak to someone for general "i have a permit why did you ticket me" issues.

It says invalid format when I post the pictures here is a link to all 4 pics I am trying to share https://imgur.com/a/ZE61RZx


This post has been edited by Oxfordshirelad: Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 15:11
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thevaliant
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 15:49
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QUOTE (Oxfordshirelad @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 14:14) *
QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 13:14) *
Letter before claim

So you have any agreement at all outlining how you can park there? Dont be so damned cryptic. Gets dull quickly.


I left the property I rented last yr and no one asked for my permit. I knew the guy wasn't going to rent out for a while so I've parked there as its next to the station for the past 2 months. Regardless I have a permit which permits me to park in that car-park which is the main thing


Hmmmmm....
Whilst no love for PPC's, I do wonder how much help you're going to get now you've admitted this. Let's see.
You used to rent a flat in a complex. That flat came with a space.
Upon moving out you 'assumed' you could still park there (in the space) because reasons.....?
One day when you did rock up, the new flat resident had rather selfishly parked their car in YOUR (old) space. So you dumped it nearby.

And now you're annoyed they want to charge you £100 to do so, as you (probably) agreed to do so via the signs.

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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 16:36
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QUOTE (thevaliant @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 15:49) *
QUOTE (Oxfordshirelad @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 14:14) *
QUOTE (nosferatu1001 @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 13:14) *
Letter before claim

So you have any agreement at all outlining how you can park there? Dont be so damned cryptic. Gets dull quickly.


I left the property I rented last yr and no one asked for my permit. I knew the guy wasn't going to rent out for a while so I've parked there as its next to the station for the past 2 months. Regardless I have a permit which permits me to park in that car-park which is the main thing


Hmmmmm....
Whilst no love for PPC's, I do wonder how much help you're going to get now you've admitted this. Let's see.
You used to rent a flat in a complex. That flat came with a space.
Upon moving out you 'assumed' you could still park there (in the space) because reasons.....?
One day when you did rock up, the new flat resident had rather selfishly parked their car in YOUR (old) space. So you dumped it nearby.

And now you're annoyed they want to charge you £100 to do so, as you (probably) agreed to do so via the signs.


No it wasn't a new flat resident I know the owner I asked him. We don't know who it was, he knows I park there. So its not a case of I am now annoyed. And even if it was whilst I then would get what you are saying I was still in a car park with a permit for that car park.

Thanks
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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 16:47
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 12:59) *
Let's see a picture of the signs. Do they have a number to call?


hoping you can help me @Jlc
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SchoolRunMum
post Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 23:14
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QUOTE
We don't know who it was, he knows I park there.


So the owner authorises you to park there and you have a permit, so I can see why you've been parking there. No problem IMHO, just like any authorised/permitted visitor.

Keep the illegible ticket and all letters and ask the owner for a copy of their lease, NOW, in readiness in case PPS try a small claim (ask now in case the owner doesn't stay there and no longer has the lease when you need it to defend a claim!). PPS are useless at claims, you can read plenty on this forum where the evidence is diabolical.

Maybe the rogue parker was (possibly) the ticketer. Seen that before. It would be in their interests to displace other cars then go round ticketing.
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Oxfordshirelad
post Mon, 14 Jan 2019 - 14:56
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QUOTE (SchoolRunMum @ Fri, 11 Jan 2019 - 23:14) *
QUOTE
We don't know who it was, he knows I park there.


So the owner authorises you to park there and you have a permit, so I can see why you've been parking there. No problem IMHO, just like any authorised/permitted visitor.

Keep the illegible ticket and all letters and ask the owner for a copy of their lease, NOW, in readiness in case PPS try a small claim (ask now in case the owner doesn't stay there and no longer has the lease when you need it to defend a claim!). PPS are useless at claims, you can read plenty on this forum where the evidence is diabolical.

Maybe the rogue parker was (possibly) the ticketer. Seen that before. It would be in their interests to displace other cars then go round ticketing.



Thanks for the reply.

I'll try see the person I bought the permit from. I don't have his number anymore it was just randomly I saw him there the other day after it happened as he was picking up post - so I may not be able to get a copy of the lease soon.

I'll take a look at other posts. I just wanted someone to tell me that if I had a permit but wasn't parked in a marked bay if thats usually OK to appeal because it seems to me that it should be.

Cheers
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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 09:11
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Hi all,

I emailed them explaining the situation and asking for it to be cancelled.

Received the following response



Should I go ahead and admit who was the driver or is that a bad move? Does it matter?

Cheers,

This post has been edited by Oxfordshirelad: Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 13:25
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ManxRed
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 09:49
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So basically they are saying that the Keeper cannot ever appeal the ticket.

While the IPC CoP is vaguely worded on the subject of allowing a Keeper to appeal, it is kind of implied at 6.1 (g).

Not that the IPC will care. This is simply an attempt to extract the driver's identity. They are desperate for this info, DO NOT SUPPLY IT TO THEM.

And edit your post above. They do read this forum!

This post has been edited by ManxRed: Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 09:50


--------------------
Sometimes I use big words I don't understand in an effort to make myself sound more photosynthesis.
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Oxfordshirelad
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 09:53
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QUOTE (ManxRed @ Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 09:49) *
So basically they are saying that the Keeper cannot ever appeal the ticket.

While the IPC CoP is vaguely worded on the subject of allowing a Keeper to appeal, it is kind of implied at 6.1 (g).

Not that the IPC will care. This is simply an attempt to extract the driver's identity. They are desperate for this info, DO NOT SUPPLY IT TO THEM.

And edit your post above. They do read this forum!


Ok great - what part exactly should I edit? the only part I feel gives them info is the date of the response they quote? sorry never been through this stuff before.

Also should I reply to them at all or just ignore it? I submitted an appeal on their website but again I didn't admit any information or give them any information towards who I was.

Thank you!
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ManxRed
post Fri, 25 Jan 2019 - 10:21
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The next to last sentence in the bottom line of your post.


--------------------
Sometimes I use big words I don't understand in an effort to make myself sound more photosynthesis.
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