Final Demand Letter Options

[RainyDay2019]

Hello, I am looking for advice on how to proceed.


The incident took place August 2017 in Wales.
A car park owned by the council had been free until it was rented out to Excel Parking in 2017. The day of the incident was the driver's first time using this car park since it was being operated by Excel Parking.
The driver queued behind a woman who was in the process of entering her reg number, however she realised she did not know it and left. Having never used this machine before the driver put their money in the machine and entered their reg number, without realising they should have entered the reg number first, before paying. The resulting ticket only had an 'R' for where the reg number is printed (The driver assumes that is as far as the woman in front had gotten with entering her number).
The driver made a call to Excel Parking that day to explain the situation and asked if it could be taken care of, would they get a parking fine etc. The man who they spoke to said that they would not, and he would take care of it.

Of course the driver received a parking fine for £100 in the post sometime later. The driver appealed the claim, based on that fact that while the ticket was purchased in error, the driver had still paid for a ticket.
The appeal was denied, the driver did not pay the fine, having been advised not to on another forum, and that they had a good case.

Two weeks ago the driver received a Demand for Payment letter, detailing that the charge has risen to £160 for debt collection costs (the driver paid £1 for parking, and still has the original ticket) and that the company intends to take the driver to court if they do not pay by the specified date (21st May).

The driver did not pay the charge, and has received today (29th May) a Final Demand for payment in the post stating that Excel Parking will also seek to recover court fees and solicitors costs.

At this stage, can anyone advise if there are any grounds to fight this claim and any chance of winning if the driver were taken to court.

Thank you for your help!

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[Jlc]

At this stage, can anyone advise if there are any grounds to fight this claim and any chance of winning if the driver were taken to court.

Indeed, very good grounds but it won't stop the roboclaim* I'm afraid. The driver did everything they reasonably could and phoning them and getting the promissory estoppel.

* a pressure tactic of issuing many claims to get people to pay

[RainyDay2019]

Should the driver ignore this pressure tactic then? Additionally, the driver has screenshots proving a phone call was made, however Excel Parking denies having any records of a phone call being made.

Thank you.

[Jlc]

It's up to them if they issue a claim - never ignore a real claim. You can try and tell them but the roboclaim process will trundle on.

You only have to show on the balance of probabilities you made the call etc. You seem to have enough evidence to tip this balance.

[RainyDay2019]

Hi All,
A County Claim letter has been received in the post.


What are the next steps I will need to take to proceed to dispute the claim?


Thank you!

[ostell]

First action us to acknowledge the claim using the details and password on the form. Nothing in the defence. This gives you 33 days from the date if issue to get your defence to the court

Looks like their equipment misbehaved

This post has been edited by ostell: Sat, 20 Jul 2019 - 20:04

[RainyDay2019]

I am currently acknowledging the claim, there is am option asking if I want to contest jurisdiction of the claim made against me. I'm not sure what this means, do I need to click this option?

[Lynnzer]

I am currently acknowledging the claim, there is am option asking if I want to contest jurisdiction of the claim made against me. I'm not sure what this means, do I need to click this option?

No

[ostell]

Check with the council involved as to the status of the car park. If it is still owned by the council and subject to a parking places order then for the purpose of POFA it is not relevant land and therefore there can be no keeper liability. Often the information required is on a council web page. As long as the driver has not been identified

This post has been edited by ostell: Sun, 21 Jul 2019 - 08:21

[RainyDay2019]

Check with the council involved as to the status of the car park. If it is still owned by the council and subject to a parking places order then for the purpose of POFA it is not relevant land and therefore there can be no keeper liability. Often the information required is on a council web page. As long as the driver has not been identified

Information I have been able to find states that the car park is held long leasehold from the City Council by way of a 150 year term, with effect from 2007, and charging commenced from 2017. However additional information states that the car park building itself is owned by a private company CATHCO, although the land itself is owned by the council. CATHCO entered administration in 2010 and the car park was managed by the Council under a short term lease agreement until leased to Excel, if that is at all relevant. I will contact the Council directly to confirm this information.

Unfortunately I think by appealing the ticket I identified myself as the driver, although the particulars of the claim appear to suggest that the Defendant is only identified as the keeper and/or the driver, not both.

[nosferatu1001]

Thats just their template POC.

What did you put in your appeal? Verbatim.

[RainyDay2019]

Similar to how I have told the story here, although referring to myself as 'I'.

[nosferatu1001]

Verbatim means exactly that.

[RainyDay2019]

Oh apologies! Is there a way for me to access the appeal that I made? I don't have a copy of it myself, and I am unable to access it through myparkingcharge. The only documentation I can find is a response to the appeal by Excel and another response by the IAS when the appeal was sent to them.

[nosferatu1001]

No then. It's why you keep,copies of important documents yourself...

Sar them. Gives you all documents within 30 days.

[Redivi]

The trouble with an SAR is that the deadline to respond is long after the defence has to be submitted

I would instead send a request for all the documents Excel intends to rely on in accordance with the Over-riding Objective

[nosferatu1001]

They still dont have to respond in time. A SAR is at least a definitive deadline.

[ostell]

So you request from Excel in order to narrow the issues between you, all documents that they intend to use in court, as expected by CPR . As they have those documents to hand in order to issue the claim then you expect to receive them by returnand at the latest within 7 days.

[RainyDay2019]

I have been able to access my appeal sent to the IAS, as follows:

I went to pay for my ticket at the machine where a lady was already at the machine, entering her details. She realised she did not know her full registration number and left the machine with the first initial of her registration number 'R' still entered on the machine as you can see on the parking ticket I have provided as evidence. I put my money in, without realising I should have entered my registration details first, as most machines you are required to put your money first before your details. I tried to enter my registration number and found it wasn't registering on screen. After printing my ticket, I noticed the error on the ticket. Upon returning home, I called the company that owns the car park to explain my situation. The gentleman I spoke to assured me it would be taken care of, however this is obviously not the case as they have chosen to fine me unfairly, despite showing evidence that I have paid for the ticket, the mistake is clear on the ticket and that I even phoned to try and resolve the situation.

My further response, after Excel responded:

I have provided further evidence showing I did call their helpline, as highlighted in red. I am happy for this call to be investigated with my network to show that this call had taken place.
I was not told by the gentleman on the phone, that by leaving the car park I would be breaching any sort of conditions. He simply asked for my registration number and told me he would sort the issue for me.
I have legally paid for a ticket, for a shorter amount that I even paid for, as can be seen by the time I entered and left, and the amount I paid for the ticket - I feel that I am being treated unfairly due to an honest mistake that could be made by anybody.

Also, I have requested a SAR from Excel, on the 22.07.19, they have yet to respond. Is it worth sending another request, with a deadline of 7 days?

Additionally, the council have responded regarding ownership of the Car Park:

I write further to your enquiry regarding 'The Car Park'.

The Council owns the freehold to the site which is registered under title number 'XXXXXXX'.

Further information can be obtained via the Land Registry

[ostell]

So is there a oarking places order on the land?