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Elite Management (Midlands) PCN - Birmingham
geeeraffe
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 21:03
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Hi all,

I received the following NTK the other day. From what i can see it's a 'golden ticket':
1. no POFA references
2. delivered outside of the 14 day window, allowing for the 2 days postal (i received this on the 17th)
3. they don't state the period of the alleged offence, only a single time
(4. ? They don't state what the full amount payable is, only the reduced limit. I don't *think* this is related to POFA but it seems strange.)



As a result, I will appeal this. I think i'll need some hand-holding through the POPLA part, but is this sufficient enough for an opening gambit on their online appeals (stolen from another thread on here, naturally!):
QUOTE
I am the keeper of vehicle xxxxx which has received your PCN notice xxxx. I note that you have not included the statements required by Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 to be able to hold me, the Keeper, liable for the actions of the Driver. There is no legal requirement to name the Driver and I will not be doing so.

I do not expect to hear from you again other than to confirm that no further action will be taken against me.


For my general information do they suspend the 'early payment' period while an appeal is ongoing? So, if this appeal was somehow unsuccessful at POPLA and i chose to pay, would it be the full whack or the reduced amount?

Thanks everyone.
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post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 21:03
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ostell
post Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 21:39
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It usually helps if you tell them exactly why they haved failed. If there was no windscreen ticket then paragraph 9 applies.

The main reason is that the have failed to deliver within 14 days, but many of the required statements in 9 (2) are missing

With so many POFA failures then POPLA should be a doddle and should uphold any appeal.

This post has been edited by ostell: Tue, 20 Mar 2018 - 21:42
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geeeraffe
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 10:39
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Thanks ostell.

My updated appeal therefore reads:
QUOTE
I am the keeper of vehicle xxxxx which has received your PCN notice xxxx. I note that you have failed to meet certain requirements as laid out in Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, namely:
9(2)a - you have not stated the *period* of parking to which the notice relates, only specified a single time of the alleged offence.
9(2)g - you have not adequately stated the discount offered for prompt payment, as you have not stated the 'non-discounted' charge.
9(4)b and 9(5) - you failed to deliver the Notice to Keeper to me within the relevant period (as stated in 9(5), this is 14 days)

You have therefore not included the statements required by Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 to be able to hold me, the Keeper, liable for the actions of the Driver. There is no legal requirement to name the Driver and I will not be doing so.

I do not expect to hear from you again other than to confirm that no further action will be taken against me.


Is that better? Thanks again.

This post has been edited by geeeraffe: Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 12:29
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ManxRed
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 12:59
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The 'contravention' is given as 'Parked without permission of the Landowner on Private Property'

Normally these PPC's try to blur the line between contract and trespass on their signs and paperwork, but that's pretty much the definition of trespass, so they'll struggle to argue this isn't based on trespass.

In which case it's a claim from the landholder only, for actual or nominal damages. Good luck to them with that one.


--------------------
Sometimes I use big words I don't understand in an effort to make myself sound more photosynthesis.
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geeeraffe
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 13:04
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So do I need to make mention of that in my appeal, or will they just reject it anyway (as per usual) and i take it back through POPLA.

Cheers.
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The Rookie
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 13:11
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They'll almost certainly force you to POPLA, but POFA non compliance (when spelt out) is usually an easy win.


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 8-0 PPC's
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emanresu
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 17:12
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QUOTE
They'll almost certainly force you to POPLA, but POFA non compliance (when spelt out) is usually an easy win.


They have been removed from the BPA list so POPLA may not be available. Should ask though.


--------------------
Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Daily Court List. See who is doing what and where here
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
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geeeraffe
post Fri, 23 Mar 2018 - 19:14
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That's interesting, they were definitely on there when i first received the NTK. What does that mean for my appeal?
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emanresu
post Sat, 24 Mar 2018 - 10:57
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QUOTE
What does that mean for my appeal?


Just follow the timings but with any appeal get proof you sent it as sometimes these get "lost"


--------------------
Where there is a claim - there is a counterclaim.
Are Parking companies misusing your personal data or interfering with your lease? Counterclaims are only £25. Makes them sit up and take notice. For leaseholds, join in the Managing agents too. Since the purpose of these claims is to frighten you, give them something to be frightened of.
Subject Access Requests to the DVLA?Find out who accessed your data and when. Try SubjectAccess.Requests@dvla.gsi.gov.uk. [Apologies if it does not work]
Double Dip / ANPR FaultsThe BPA Report on ANPR Double Dips is here. Ideal case for a counterclaim (see above).
Daily Court List. See who is doing what and where here
Printing and posting Witness Statements. Easy and cheap way DoxDirect
What is court like. A District Judge's view
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geeeraffe
post Thu, 5 Apr 2018 - 14:17
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Hi all,

Just to let you know, I submitted my appeal and received the following response via email:
QUOTE
We have reviewed the account fully, as the vehicle was on site for 5 minutes, we have been able to cancel this Parking Charge Notice as a gesture of goodwill.

Therefore, you should expect no further correspondence regarding this matter.


Which makes life a bit easier since i don't have to faff with POPLA. Interestingly, this response came from ZZPS and not Elite Management (Midlands), so i presume they must have changed their name?

Anyway, thanks again everyone for the assistance in drafting my appeal.

All the best.
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Jlc
post Thu, 5 Apr 2018 - 14:55
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Some companies outsource some parts of their operations.

This post has been edited by Jlc: Thu, 5 Apr 2018 - 14:55


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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SchoolRunMum
post Thu, 5 Apr 2018 - 19:02
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''gesture of goodwill'' my cat's bum!

It was a pathetic scam ticket and they were sussed.
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