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Aware of issued SJPN, Advice welcome
chris1471
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 13:47
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Hi all, this is my first post here. I need some advice on this.

28/06/19 - caught speeding on hand held laser, 47 in a 30, pulled and ticket issued. Nothing to respond to on said ticket.
25/09/19 - moved house (sold flat and bought a house in town next door)
09/10/19 - changed drivers license and vehicle log book to new address. (not insurance though - up for renewal now so will change)
18/12/19 - charged with offence on SJPN.
24/12/19 - SJPN dated 24/12/19 submitted to previous address without my knowledge with 21 days to respond.
17/01/20 - through chance find out new owner of previous property opened my SJNP letter by mistake. (bit of a story there)
20/01/20 - obtain SJPN from previous address.

Obviously, I can prove with legal documentation i vacated my previous property on the 25/09/19 and can prove my drivers license and
log book were changed on 09/10/19

I havent responded yet as technically I havent been informed about this. Potentially this didnt arrive until well after Christmas which is into 6 months.

What should I do now?
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post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 13:47
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Jlc
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:08
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QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 13:47) *
What should I do now?

Have you been convicted yet?

(The 6 months limit is to commence proceedings)


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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chris1471
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:11
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:08) *
QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 13:47) *
What should I do now?

Have you been convicted yet?

(The 6 months limit is to commence proceedings)


Hi, well the 21 days to respond has only recently elapsed.
Im not aware or been informed about any court proceedings.
Ive certainly not recieved any notification about this at my new address so technically, im still in the dark about all of this.
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BaggieBoy
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:14
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Check your drivers record online at the DVLA.
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chris1471
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:16
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QUOTE (BaggieBoy @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:14) *
Check your drivers record online at the DVLA.


Done that, still nothing logged with regard to this incident on my DVLA record.
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NewJudge
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:24
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Since the SJPN was not issued until 24/12 (inside 6 months from the offence date) it is most unlikely to have been dealt with yet. I suggest you contact the court and tell them your reply is in the post. You may have been offered a Fixed Penalty for this. Do you know if paperwork in connection with that might have been sent to your old address?
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chris1471
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:27
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QUOTE (NewJudge @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:24) *
Since the SJPN was not issued until 24/12 (inside 6 months from the offence date) it is most unlikely to have been dealt with yet. I suggest you contact the court and tell them your reply is in the post. You may have been offered a Fixed Penalty for this. Do you know if paperwork in connection with that might have been sent to your old address?


Hi, Ive asked the owner of the previous address to inform me immediately if any further post arrives for me there. Nothing as yet.

So contacting the court is the best next step for me in your opinion?

This post has been edited by chris1471: Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:27
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666
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:56
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QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:27) *
QUOTE (NewJudge @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:24) *
Since the SJPN was not issued until 24/12 (inside 6 months from the offence date) it is most unlikely to have been dealt with yet. I suggest you contact the court and tell them your reply is in the post. You may have been offered a Fixed Penalty for this. Do you know if paperwork in connection with that might have been sent to your old address?


Hi, Ive asked the owner of the previous address to inform me immediately if any further post arrives for me there. Nothing as yet.

So contacting the court is the best next step for me in your opinion?

Yes. Ignoring it is the worst thing you can do.
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Jlc
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:04
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If you have not been convicted yet then you might be able to intercept it. (I presume you are pleading guilty?)

Otherwise you may want to perform a Statutory Declaration to remove any conviction.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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TonyS
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:17
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QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:11) *
Ive certainly not recieved any notification about this at my new address so technically, im still in the dark about all of this.

I don't know if that's the case. I suspect that if correspondence was sent to the address you gave the Police at the time of the stop then it's been legally served. I wouldn't expect the onus to be on the Police to keep checking that your address hasn't changed.

Anyway "technically" aside, you ARE aware of it.
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chris1471
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:32
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QUOTE (TonyS @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:17) *
QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 14:11) *
Ive certainly not recieved any notification about this at my new address so technically, im still in the dark about all of this.

I don't know if that's the case. I suspect that if correspondence was sent to the address you gave the Police at the time of the stop then it's been legally served. I wouldn't expect the onus to be on the Police to keep checking that your address hasn't changed.

Anyway "technically" aside, you ARE aware of it.


If the SJPN had been served in a timely manner then fair enough.

To still be dealing with this 7 months down the line is a joke to be honest.


QUOTE (Jlc @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:04) *
If you have not been convicted yet then you might be able to intercept it. (I presume you are pleading guilty?)

Otherwise you may want to perform a Statutory Declaration to remove any conviction.


Yes i will plead guilty. I have no issues with that.

I would have done it and sent it off had the paperwork arrived at my new address.

So its looking like im better off knowing even though its late in the day? I was just wondering what would have happened if i didnt respond I.E.
if i wasnt fortunate enough to have been informed this arrived at my previous address?

Would I have even been offered an opportunity to dispute a more severe penalty for not replying?
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Jlc
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:36
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QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:32) *
To still be dealing with this 7 months down the line is a joke to be honest.

It's quite normal (and legal) for them to process these close to the 6 months mark.

QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:32) *
So its looking like im better off knowing even though its late in the day? I was just wondering what would have happened if i didnt respond I.E.
if i wasnt fortunate enough to have been informed this arrived at my previous address?

You are convicted in absence.

QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:32) *
Would I have even been offered an opportunity to dispute a more severe penalty for not replying?

That excess would normally be offered a fixed penalty. There is specific court guidance to sentence at equivalent rate. (Which may be a good reason to perform a SD to get that opportunity)


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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The Rookie
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:41
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You either deal with it now (less painful) or later, more so, entirely your choice.

Without knowing why the paperwork didn't arrive at your previous address before you left we don't know if there is a reason in that delay that would help you.

If you didn't respond the fine would be higher (no guilty plea discount), it would later progress to an attachment of earnings order and your licence revoked for failing to surrender it.





--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

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Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
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NewJudge
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 16:01
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QUOTE (chris1471 @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 15:32) *
To still be dealing with this 7 months down the line is a joke to be honest.

Many of the cases that progress to court that are seen on here (and elsewhere) take six months to get there. SJPNs are often issued just a few days before the deadline. There is nothing at all unusual about it.
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chris1471
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 16:38
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So I've tried multiple telephone numbers in an attempt to contact the court with no luck. Its sending me round the houses and/or all lines are busy and cutting me off.
I tried to plea guilty online and it said the deadline has ended.
So I get shafted with a more severe penalty because I moved house?
Way to go British Justice system, way to go.

This is almost as good as me not being able to produce my photocard when issued with producer because it was stolen and ending up in court because i couldn't produce it at the station with the rest of my documents. Even when informed of the crime reference number they still issued a skint college student with court costs.

This post has been edited by chris1471: Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 16:42
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Jlc
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 17:01
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I already explained you may not be penalised if you were offered a fixed penalty.

Many of these issues are avoided with a mail redirection - after all you knew you were caught and expecting something.


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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chris1471
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 17:27
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QUOTE (Jlc @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 17:01) *
I already explained you may not be penalised if you were offered a fixed penalty.

Many of these issues are avoided with a mail redirection - after all you knew you were caught and expecting something.


But I wasn't offered a fixed penalty. There was nothing on the ticket issued at the time of the offence with regard to that.
Did you see the timeline on my first post detailing when i moved compared to when the SJPN was posted?

25/09/19 - moved house.
24/12/19 - SJPN dated and probably arrived sometime after Christmas.

I would say a month is an adequate time to have your mail redirected wouldn't you? This is well outside that time frame. Regardless
of that there is no legal requirement to redirect your mail at all! In fact I'm glad I didn't bother because the previous owner of my current
property did and some of their mail was still arriving here.

You seem to be stipulating this situation is in some way my fault which when all the facts are considered is slightly antagonistic.


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thisisntme
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 17:41
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Well a month was plainly not sufficient time for a redirect to be in force. No one is actually saying it is youor fault they are trying to help.


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I reserve the right to be wrong.
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chris1471
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 17:48
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QUOTE (thisisntme @ Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 17:41) *
Well a month was plainly not sufficient time for a redirect to be in force. No one is actually saying it is youor fault they are trying to help.


Well next time I move house I will pay Royal Mail £50 a month for 6 months to redirect my mail, only to post it at my previous address anyway. Sounds like good value for money to me.
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Jlc
post Thu, 23 Jan 2020 - 17:59
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Ok I’m out then


--------------------
RK=Registered Keeper, OP=Original Poster (You!), CoFP=Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, NtK=Notice to Keeper, NtD=Notice to Driver
PoFA=Protection of Freedoms Act, SAC=Safety Awareness Course, NIP=Notice of Intended Prosecution, ADR=Alternative Dispute Resolution
PPC=Private Parking Company, LBCCC=Letter Before County Court Claim, PII=Personally Identifiable Information, SAR=Subject Access Request

Private Parking - remember, they just want your money and will say almost anything to get it.
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