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Contravention Code 62
spring2action
post Mon, 11 Mar 2019 - 18:28
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Hello fellow forumites
Received a PCN with code 62, same as DaveWarren10 a week ago. Any further suggestions to add to those already given would be welcome.
I attach the 4 photos taken by the CEO.

Attached Image

Attached Image

Attached Image

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post Mon, 11 Mar 2019 - 18:28
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cp8759
post Mon, 11 Mar 2019 - 21:43
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Read this http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=125502 in full, then show us the PCN and a link to the location on google street view.


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I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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spring2action
post Mon, 11 Mar 2019 - 22:48
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Hi cp8759, thanks for the reply. I think I've cracked the imgur link so here goes:
https://m.imgur.com/gallery/XPHpGQn

And 2 links to streetview.
There are no parking restrictions and no street markings here.
Let me know if you need any further information. Thanks.

https://www.instantstreetview.com/@51.53540...6.63h,-3.21p,4z

https://www.google.com/maps/place/140+Ferry...d1f4709c119e8f5


Will try imgur link again, sorry.
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cp8759
post Mon, 11 Mar 2019 - 22:58
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There might be an estoppel argument to be made, but we need to see the council pics. Your imgur link doesn't work.


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I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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spring2action
post Mon, 11 Mar 2019 - 23:17
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Yes I know. I'm working on it.
What's an estoppel argument?

Council pics already posted (x4)
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cp8759
post Mon, 11 Mar 2019 - 23:34
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QUOTE (spring2action @ Mon, 11 Mar 2019 - 23:17) *
Yes I know. I'm working on it.
What's an estoppel argument?

Council pics already posted (x4)

can we have full resolution versions, rather than the tiny thumbnails?


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I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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spring2action
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 14:21
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Perhaps this might work for viewing the photos: the council make it very difficult to access/move actual photos. One thing to note is not everyone parked in this way received pcns.

https://ealing.tarantoportal.com/PCN/ViewImages


Ok I see this didn't work either. Any suggestions what to use? Have tried Imgur and that hasn't worked.
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stamfordman
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 14:23
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Nope - you have to login with the PCN details.
You can PM me the details and I'll post pics.

Also where's the PCN.
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spring2action
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 15:03
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Yes I did everything but seems when I copy and paste here, it loses those details and therefore doesn't show. I'll PM you. I'll also try to send the PCN. Thanks for that.
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spring2action
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 15:37
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Just sent to you now stamfordman.
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stamfordman
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 16:24
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This is the best pic. I think PCN was given because tyre a bit on grass.

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spring2action
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 17:20
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Thanks for doing that SM.
True but strangely the black car 2 cars behind me also got a ticket for the same contravention but tyres not on the grass and just on the kerb which is almost in some places level with the road.
Do I have a chance of a successful appeal?
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Incandescent
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 18:10
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Can't see PCN yet, but I assume it is for parking off the carriageway. It has been an offence since 1974 to park off the carriageway in the London area. Difficult to appeal but if you'd been just on the kerb-stones, a de minimis argument could succeed, but you'll only get this tested at London Tribunals with the full PCN penalty in play.
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spring2action
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 19:17
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PCN pics

http://imgur.com/a/q1nWfay

http://imgur.com/a/G8TCBFI

http://imgur.com/a/Kxjsy0S

http://imgur.com/a/xTqJlEx

Does this work?

Contravention 62 - Parked with one or more wheels on or over a footpath or any part of a road other than a carriageway.
(No mention of grass verge which is not a footpath, methinks)?
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DastardlyDick
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 19:42
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QUOTE (spring2action @ Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 19:17) *
Contravention 62 - Parked with one or more wheels on or over a footpath or any part of a road other than a carriageway.
(No mention of grass verge which is not a footpath, methinks)?

A "road" consists of carriageway(s), verges and footpaths, and the verge is not part of the carriageway so the contravention is correct.
Dim memory tells me that there was a case where an Adjudicator found that the curb is part of the carriageway, but I can't find it mad.gif
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spring2action
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 20:03
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This is all about definition but what is the point of this law? Not obstructing anyone. Not dangerous. Makes no sense.

This post has been edited by spring2action: Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 20:04
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Incandescent
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 21:20
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QUOTE (spring2action @ Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 20:03) *
This is all about definition but what is the point of this law? Not obstructing anyone. Not dangerous. Makes no sense.

Well maybe, but it is a nice little earner for the councils, and it won't be amended anytime soon either, so you just have to accept it. I suspect CEOs are told to issue PCNs when wheels are on the grass like yours is. As DD says, the kerbstones may be part of the carriageway, but it will be very difficult to find the adjudication that said this.
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PASTMYBEST
post Tue, 12 Mar 2019 - 22:38
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The estopped argument referred to by CP is commonly known as legitimate expectation. Parking has been going on like that for a period of years, the council not enforcing. This gives rise to a legitimate expectation that they will not.


how are you to know that the will only tolerate parking on the kerbstone, but not beyond


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cp8759
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 18:07
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July 2008: https://www.google.com/maps/place/140+Ferry...33;4d-0.3648942 and https://www.google.com/maps/place/140+Ferry...33;4d-0.3648942

July 2012: https://www.google.com/maps/place/140+Ferry...33;4d-0.3648942

June 2018: https://www.google.com/maps/place/140+Ferry...33;4d-0.3648942

An argument can be made that it's been customary for people to park with two wheels on the kerb stones over a long period of time, such that over 10 years, every time the Google Car happened to drive by, there were at least one or two cars parked in this manner. Add a witness statement from one or two neighbours and you've got a strong case. However the council will never accept this, so you would have to risk the full penalty at the tribunal.


--------------------
I am not on the "motorists's side", nor am I on the "police/CPS/council's" side, I am simply in favour of the rule of law.
No, I am not a lawyer.
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spring2action
post Wed, 13 Mar 2019 - 20:47
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So not looking hopeful for a winning appeal..?
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