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DancingDad
Posted on: Yesterday, 09:24


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AFAIK bays are only time limited if it is on the sign... Like 4 hours max
Nothing shown, no limit
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1487284 · Replies: 15 · Views: 308

DancingDad
Posted on: Tue, 21 May 2019 - 13:33


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Personally I don't give a flying F if firemen sit around all day doing nuffink.
As long as when they have to do something they are available to do it.
That is when they earn their money and are worth every penny.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486790 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Mon, 20 May 2019 - 19:07


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I can't even see the front tyre let alone any context apart from grass.
More details please
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1486624 · Replies: 4 · Views: 103

DancingDad
Posted on: Mon, 20 May 2019 - 16:35


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QUOTE (seank @ Mon, 20 May 2019 - 12:53) *
........The cyclist was looking forward, with his head canted down and did not look at the rear of the engine in the milliseconds he had before it cut across his path. I'm looking at the DM footage on a Dell Ultrasharp 34" monitor, but if you can see differently, please tell me.

……….


I'm glad you could see that.
I must get myself a super duper mega large monitor so I can see the obvious as well biggrin.gif

One has to ask:-
Why wasn't the cyclist looking where they were going?
And considering that they weren't, what difference would side indicators have made ?
BTW, I make your milliseconds more like 4-5 seconds.
From the time that the fire engine goes past the static cyclist to when it starts to make the turn.
Cyclist is oblivious to the engine, indicators or whatever the fire engine was doing.
(On my rather old 19" monitor BTW smile.gif )
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486597 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Mon, 20 May 2019 - 11:59


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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Mon, 20 May 2019 - 12:48) *
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Mon, 20 May 2019 - 12:25) *
I fully accept that he can enter all into his machine before the ten minutes are up and that the physical act of service could be an hour later.
But he cannot print it early and thus cannot issue it without falling foul of the grace period.

I think this is all somewhat academic as we all agree the grace period applies to this case.

biggrin.gif biggrin.gif biggrin.gif
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1486510 · Replies: 54 · Views: 1,385

DancingDad
Posted on: Mon, 20 May 2019 - 11:25


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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Mon, 20 May 2019 - 12:04) *
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Mon, 20 May 2019 - 10:04) *
Neither issue or service are referred to within the General Regs.

I beg to differ, regulation 9A(2) says "a penalty charge notice with respect to the vehicle may be served only by the fixing of a notice to the vehicle by a civil enforcement officer who has reason to believe that a penalty charge is payable with respect to it.", a civil enforcement officer can print the PCN whenever he wants but he cannot serve it until he "has reason to believe that a penalty charge is payable" which cannot happen until after the 10 minute period has elapsed.


But if he prints it, he must put on the time of contravention.
And cannot falsify that (errr) should not falsify that.


I fully accept that he can enter all into his machine before the ten minutes are up and that the physical act of service could be an hour later.
But he cannot print it early and thus cannot issue it without falling foul of the grace period.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1486494 · Replies: 54 · Views: 1,385

DancingDad
Posted on: Mon, 20 May 2019 - 10:52


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QUOTE (seank @ Mon, 20 May 2019 - 10:45) *
It shows that emergency service operators may think they have carte blanche to act as they think fit, but the higher courts don't side with them.
The engine driver may escape prosecution because of the cosy relationship between the CPS and the police, fire service and ambulance crews but it doesn't prevent a sense of injustice and wouldn't stop an aggrieved individual taking a private prosecution.
There is no blanket exemption for them, despite what people might imagine.
What intrigued me about the case I listed was that the magistrates' upheld the charge against the garage, even though plod had no legal right to be in there. The appeal then brought justice.


Any private claim against the driver would IMO fail the moment the cyclist is asked why they ignored the indicators that were right in front of them.
While indicating does not confer any right to manoeuvre, they are there for a purpose, were being used, were easily visible and were ignored.
Even if the cyclist won, contributory negligence would play a huge part in any claim IMO.

On the case, doesn't surprise me that magistrates decided an assault had happened, on the face of it, it did.
Where it was won on appeal was that the second leg, in the performance of their duty, was accepted to have failed.
To me that is a case of the CPS being too greedy and trying for a higher charge, had they stuck with simple assault it may well have won.
Someone comes into my house uninvited and I give them a slapping, I am open to an assault conviction.
If I usher them out with minimum force, unlikely to be upheld.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486480 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Mon, 20 May 2019 - 09:04


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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Mon, 20 May 2019 - 09:51) *
QUOTE (Neil B @ Sun, 19 May 2019 - 23:25) *
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Sun, 19 May 2019 - 13:33) *
Jeez, what muppet wrote that NOR ??

I love the para that starts "With respect ---"

I'm really tempted to put something in the appeal along the lines of "With the greatest possible respect..." even though I know I should rise above that...

QUOTE (Gert @ Sun, 19 May 2019 - 23:28) *
If you have correctly paid for parking or displayed a voucher at the location and the session expires, or had parked in a free or resident permit or pay & display/ by phone bay prior to the restrictions coming into force again, a driver has a ten minute grace period within which they can remove their vehicle before a PCN may be issued.

Well the PCN can be issued before the 10 minutes are up, it just can't be served until after that. Issue and service are not the same thing.

No, the PCN cannot be issued before the 10 minutes are up.... the time of contravention is key.

Neither issue or service are referred to within the General Regs.

" No penalty charge is payable for the contravention where the vehicle has been left beyond the permitted parking period for a period not exceeding 10 minutes."

The PCN must state a time of contravention, this one does.
Doesn't have to state a time of service or issue.
At the time cited the vehicle was in contravention but at a time when there was no penalty payable.
Doesn't matter if the PCN was served 10 minutes later, at the time cited on the PCN there was no penalty payable.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1486453 · Replies: 54 · Views: 1,385

DancingDad
Posted on: Mon, 20 May 2019 - 08:24


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What's that got to do with the price of chips Sean ?
All it does is confirm what I am sure many know, that police officers have no general right to enter private property without a warrant.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486441 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Mon, 20 May 2019 - 08:19


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QUOTE (cp8759 @ Sun, 19 May 2019 - 22:12) *
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Tue, 14 May 2019 - 17:36) *
That the cyclist should not have been there is irrelevant.

How do you figure that?...…….



It was part of a paragraph, not a stand alone comment meant to stand on its own in all circumstances. biggrin.gif

I stand by the basic, given that a car driver was driving over a footway and a cyclist struck the side, the insurance would be likely to blame the car driver for cutting in front of a cyclist, to borrow Rookie's phrase, "who was there to be seen"
The driver would be on the back foot having to show why the cyclist was at fault and that they (the driver) had no chance to see the danger.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486438 · Replies: 16 · Views: 634

DancingDad
Posted on: Sun, 19 May 2019 - 13:09


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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sun, 19 May 2019 - 14:02) *
However, an email from the agent saying “you’re insured” doesn’t.


biggrin.gif


  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486258 · Replies: 11 · Views: 576

DancingDad
Posted on: Sun, 19 May 2019 - 12:33


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Jeez, what muppet wrote that NOR ??
Grace period only applies to paid for bays ???
We could have issued it later cos you were still there????

What HCA said, ridiculous interpretation, appeal, the ten minute period applies, simples.

I do predict a Do Not Contest from council.... and would apply for costs even if they do, this is a ridiculous PCN and even more ridiculous attempt to force payment against an unlawfully served PCN.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1486247 · Replies: 54 · Views: 1,385

DancingDad
Posted on: Sun, 19 May 2019 - 12:23


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QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Sun, 19 May 2019 - 12:16) *
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Sun, 19 May 2019 - 10:49) *
When you insure, ask the agent to confirm by email or if you've done it online, keep the confirmation handy.

Or just comply with the provisions I cited above.

Fairly certain the "standard" confirmation does that.
This is the text from one of my latest...…

"Welcome to Hastings Direct
Thank you for choosing us for your car insurance.
We've uploaded your welcome pack with all the documents and useful information you'll need. Please go to MyAccount and view these documents. For now, here's a quick summary of your cover. "

Plus policy number, vehicle details and start date.


Certainly enough that I would be happy to show to a cop if needed and as far as I can see, complies with what you posted.

  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486245 · Replies: 11 · Views: 576

DancingDad
Posted on: Sun, 19 May 2019 - 11:07


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QUOTE (seank @ Sun, 19 May 2019 - 11:18) *
......What is very clear is the hypocrisy because it was a fire engine making an illegal turn, whatever exemption may or may not have applied.
Had it been a private HGV driver, most people would have taken the opposite view...……..


I wouldn't.
That it was an emergency vehicle with blues and twos going makes it more likely (to me) that they may make an unexpected manoeuvre....my attitude is let them get clear, not race them.
But even if it had been an normal HGV or bus or white van, the cyclist ignored clearly visible indicators and still tried to scoot up the inside.
I called them a pillock and I stand by that, they put themselves into the danger zone.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486236 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Sun, 19 May 2019 - 09:49


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You can drive it the moment a vehicle has tax, insurance and MOT.
If you tax online, you will get an email receipt.
When you insure, ask the agent to confirm by email or if you've done it online, keep the confirmation handy.
I've just checked and I had confirmation with policy details by email automatically for all my recent car insurances.
Gave basic details and that the full policy was available online, electronic equivalent of a cover note.
As far as I am concerned that made me 100% legal from the time stated on the email.
A copy of that is all you need to show the cops.

The police are aware that AskMid etc take a little time to update and that a newly purchased car may not show.
If you are pulled, you explain and show them what you have.
I very much doubt they will bother further.
The legal requirements are that you must have, not that the details must be showing on DVLA or Askmid
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486220 · Replies: 11 · Views: 576

DancingDad
Posted on: Sun, 19 May 2019 - 09:35


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"Are meant to avoid..." are the telling words, emergency vehicles do all sorts of weird and wonderful things when on a call out and within reason, nobody gives a toss.
Even if it wasn't a fire engine, wasn't an emergency and there was no argument that the turn was totally 100% illegal and should not have been made, why did the cyclist ignore the clear indications that the vehicle was about to turn ???
That another driver is acting illegally doesn't give anyone else the right to drive (ride) into them.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486219 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Sat, 18 May 2019 - 19:30


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QUOTE (seank @ Sat, 18 May 2019 - 20:06) *
The exemption requires that emergency vehicle drivers give way, as required, so as to avoid "accidents" like this.
The engine is lit up like a Christmas tree and has sirens wailing, but the cyclist was quite correctly riding his bike and the situation arose because the engine driver failed to give way to him.
The cyclist couldn't have seen the front indicators, not having a mirror on the bike, and there seems to be no side repeaters on the engine. He seems to have his head down and pedalling hard, but that's no excuse for the driver, who should have seen him before cutting across his path.

I'm sure you would say the situation was different if it was a normal heavy goods vehicle and there were no left turn prohibition signs there.
If so, I accuse you of dual standards, just because it's a fire engine.



An exemption is an exemption.
There is no requirement to give way except as would normally be required in the course of driving.
And little if any to give way to traffic behind you that was static.
Yes, you give way if the pirrock is sneaking up the inside, if you see them.

I would also ask you to go back to the start of the video before you accuse me of double standards.
The cyclist was static, the engine overtook.
The cyclist was right behind the engine with a pair of ruddy great indicators flashing in his face.
And still accelerated to try to undertake.
WTF did he think the fire engine was going to do?
Or did he think at all?
Had it been a heavy good vehicle making a (legal) left turn and a cyclist snuck up the inside despite the goods vehicle indicating left, I would be equally as critical of that cyclist.
And equally open to the fact that the lorry driver (or fireman in this instance) was not as aware of what was inside as they should have been.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486175 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Sat, 18 May 2019 - 16:28


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QUOTE (seank @ Sat, 18 May 2019 - 17:13) *
Except that the fire engine illegally turned left when there are 2 prominent no left turn signs immediately before the junction.
The cyclist was riding quite correctly and should not have expected the engine to illegally turn left across his path.


Most if not all traffic orders include an exemption for emergency vehicles on a call out.
Those No Left turn signs are S36 signs and carry the exemption within TSRGD.
So not an illegal left turn for the fire engine.
The cyclist (and any driver/rider) should expect the unexpected.
And cannot be said to be riding quite correctly when they ignore (or did not see) the indicators in front of them.
I would have more sympathy had the engine gone past a moving cyclist but they didn't, they passed a stationary one.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486117 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Sat, 18 May 2019 - 14:44


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Here
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.14553,0.3...33;1b1!2i40

6 of one half a dozen of the other.
Yes pole sign is missing and indeed was missing in Sept 18 so not a short term issue.
No road legend but that is not mandatory.
But the bay is only 2-3 vehicles long and the other pole sign is there.

It could go either way, an adjudicator could decide that as the council decided that two signs were needed, the signage is now inadequate.
Or that one sign in a bay that long is plenty good enough.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1486100 · Replies: 12 · Views: 235

DancingDad
Posted on: Sat, 18 May 2019 - 14:33


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QUOTE (Richy320 @ Sat, 18 May 2019 - 15:10) *
...........At the start of the video, the fire engine is alongside the cyclist and not indicating.

The lights turn green and both move forwards. The fire engine starts to indicate left but moves to the right and at no point does the fire engine get beyond the cyclist where he could see the indicator, there don’t appear to be indicators on the side of the fire engine. The cyclist, having seen the fire engine move wide to the right is, therefore, expecting the fire engine to be going either straight on or right but is certainly not expecting to be ‘left-hooked’ by the fire engine.

I agree that there are examples all over the internet of cyclists riding in an appalling manner. This is not one of them.

Unfortunately we don’t see enough of the video to see who was where and at what point but this is certainly a very good example of why cyclists should not go up the inside of large vehicles. The fire engine driver was clearly not using his mirrors.

No, at the start the cyclist is stationary and the fire engine is overtaking.
Before the cyclist moves off, the engine is ahead with two ruddy great indicators going.
In full view of the cyclist had they looked.... check out start to 4-5 seconds of the video.
The cyclist simply got his head down and pedalled like the clappers with no regard to siren, blue lights, indicators or that they were undertaking a fire engine.

Fully agree that the driver cut across the cyclist and that makes it his "fault"
But that does not excuse the cyclist from using a little common sense, patience and looking at the big red machine making the funny noises.
They put themselves in the position to be wiped out, quite possibly in the driver's blind spot.

How often do cyclists need to be told not to go up the inside of large vehicles at junctions ?
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486095 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Sat, 18 May 2019 - 11:04


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QUOTE (Enceladus @ Sat, 18 May 2019 - 11:32) *
........Concerning the 200 PCNs, that could be well over £13k paid in error. did you really mean 200? I suggest you split that off as a separate topic from this PCN. Or folks will get confused

Agreed on that.
End of the day they have been paid so getting any action is difficult.
But if the executor of the estate was so minded, they could put together a list and request for reimbursement to the estate based on that his BB made him exempt.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1486049 · Replies: 10 · Views: 130

DancingDad
Posted on: Sat, 18 May 2019 - 10:45


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QUOTE (Starworshipper12 @ Sat, 18 May 2019 - 11:19) *
QUOTE (DancingDad @ Sat, 18 May 2019 - 09:54) *
What about the cyclist who nominally has "right of way" on green but seems deaf and blind to a fire engine ?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-69...quick-turn.html


Absolutely shocking. I do hope the fire engine wasn’t needed somewhere else urgently, and I do hope the cyclist has some kind of charge brought against them.


With Blues nd Twos going, I suspect the fire engine was already needed somewhere urgent biggrin.gif
There will IMO be no chance of any charge against the cyclist.
Within the scheme of things, the fire engine has no right of way nor is there any mandatory requirement to give way to them.
End of the day, the pirrock on the bike could end up with a compensation payout while the engine driver could face careless or dangerous driving charges.

To me the cyclist is a good example of those who do wind up many drivers..."my right of way, I'm coming through and you must avoid me!"
To be fair, many car/van/lorry drivers seem to have the same attitude, it is not all one way.
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486048 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Sat, 18 May 2019 - 08:54


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What about the cyclist who nominally has "right of way" on green but seems deaf and blind to a fire engine ?
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-69...quick-turn.html
  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1486031 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

DancingDad
Posted on: Fri, 17 May 2019 - 21:49


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QUOTE (cristinika28 @ Fri, 17 May 2019 - 22:44) *
QUOTE (hcandersen @ Fri, 17 May 2019 - 19:19) *
I never ever been to Lowestoft, I live 140 miles away
2. Obviously there was no PCN and therefore no evidence of me being there


Can we cut to the chase.

OP, where you were is not relevant. What is, however, is the location of the car at the alleged time.

So, can you prove or establish on the basis of balance of probabilities the whereabouts of the car at the time alleged?


Yes I can, the car was with me the whole time, and i know exactly where, about 140 miles from the alleged location.

thank you all for your help!


That you know where is irrelevant without some evidence.
  Forum: Council Parking Tickets & Clamping and Decr... · Post Preview: #1485993 · Replies: 15 · Views: 365

DancingDad
Posted on: Fri, 17 May 2019 - 21:20


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QUOTE (Richy320 @ Fri, 17 May 2019 - 20:44) *
.........Footpath/footway - Seank, it’s rarely a good idea to argue semantics with the good folk on here. It generally ends badly!


True. biggrin.gif

Footways are the things alongside a carriageway, commonly called pavements.
Footpaths are things that go through the countryside (usually) that people can walk along.
Cyclists should not be riding on either of them unless signed to allow it.
https://www.cyclinguk.org/campaigning/views...s-england-wales


  Forum: The Flame Pit · Post Preview: #1485985 · Replies: 92 · Views: 1,956

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