Speeding ticket received from Spanish authorities Options

[Zod]

I went to Spain in Feb 2018 and have received (today) a doubled sided A4 paper completely in Spanish which I assume is suggesting I was travelling too fast on their motorway. They want me to pay 300EUR.

The car was a rental vehicle which is how I'm guessing they got my details.

What do I do? Can I ignore?

[Advertisement]

[The Rookie]

I thought there was a minimum limit of €400, so this wouldn’t be eligible anyway?

[cp8759]

I thought there was a minimum limit of €400, so this wouldn’t be eligible anyway?

The Act says 70 euros is the minimum, unless this has been amended by the Lord Chancellor. I couldn't find any amendments though.

[Zod]

I failed finding an email address or online contact through the spanish website, though I did some across this website: http://www.mamunahmed.com/08/speed-camera-...g-fine-from-uk/

It shows the steps needed to take to pay the fine and contact information which I'm not sure is still accessible to date.

I'm contemplating paying it off as I don't want the headache if they pull me up on this at the airport which is likely to be many times multiple the original cost.

[Churchmouse]

I failed finding an email address or online contact through the spanish website, though I did some across this website: http://www.mamunahmed.com/08/speed-camera-...g-fine-from-uk/

It shows the steps needed to take to pay the fine and contact information which I'm not sure is still accessible to date.

I'm contemplating paying it off as I don't want the headache if they pull me up on this at the airport which is likely to be many times multiple the original cost.

Whatever makes you happy. I seriously doubt that you would "likely" be detained at the airport over an unpaid speeding ticket.

--Churchmouse

[I am Weasel]

I failed finding an email address or online contact through the spanish website, though I did some across this website: http://www.mamunahmed.com/08/speed-camera-...g-fine-from-uk/

It shows the steps needed to take to pay the fine and contact information which I'm not sure is still accessible to date.

I'm contemplating paying it off as I don't want the headache if they pull me up on this at the airport which is likely to be many times multiple the original cost.

Whatever makes you happy. I seriously doubt that you would "likely" be detained at the airport over an unpaid speeding ticket.

--Churchmouse

Don't be too sure. I was detained at Schipol airport for an outstanding Dutch speeding ticket

[Zod]

I failed finding an email address or online contact through the spanish website, though I did some across this website: http://www.mamunahmed.com/08/speed-camera-...g-fine-from-uk/

It shows the steps needed to take to pay the fine and contact information which I'm not sure is still accessible to date.

I'm contemplating paying it off as I don't want the headache if they pull me up on this at the airport which is likely to be many times multiple the original cost.

Whatever makes you happy. I seriously doubt that you would "likely" be detained at the airport over an unpaid speeding ticket.

--Churchmouse

Don't be too sure. I was detained at Schipol airport for an outstanding Dutch speeding ticket

My point exactly.


Do you mind sharing what happened and the outcome?

[Churchmouse]

I failed finding an email address or online contact through the spanish website, though I did some across this website: http://www.mamunahmed.com/08/speed-camera-...g-fine-from-uk/

It shows the steps needed to take to pay the fine and contact information which I'm not sure is still accessible to date.

I'm contemplating paying it off as I don't want the headache if they pull me up on this at the airport which is likely to be many times multiple the original cost.

Whatever makes you happy. I seriously doubt that you would "likely" be detained at the airport over an unpaid speeding ticket.

--Churchmouse

Don't be too sure. I was detained at Schipol airport for an outstanding Dutch speeding ticket

My point exactly.


Do you mind sharing what happened and the outcome?

I didn't say it couldn't happen; I said it didn't strike me as qualifying as "likely". The devil will be in the details as well: Did Weasel challenge the ticket in court? Did he fail to appear in court? Did he acknowledge the ticket? Did he acknowledge being the driver? Was he arrested at Schipol? Was he deported? Did he pay the ticket at Schipol? We do not hear very many stories of people having "difficulties" at borders for a reason--I would suggest that reason is that it doesn't happen very often.

But if you're a worrier, it may be best to just pay the ticket. Especially if you think you're actually guilty of the offence.

--Churchmouse

[I am Weasel]

My story: got flashed by a Gatso in a hire car near Schipol airport. Several months later, I received some forms in Dutch which I ignored. Roll forward a couple of years ( I had been back and forward to Holland several times between while) and I presented my passport at the immigration desk at Schipol only to be told "come this way sir". I was taken to a side office where am immigration official explained that I had a €99 speeding fine outstanding that must be paid. I queried this, but they had copies of all the paperwork o had received so I meekly paid my fine and was on my merry way in about 15 minutes. All handled very politely with no real fuss. I can only think that they had my passport number (provided by the car rental co) flagged up and that I had used my other passport on journies where I had not been stopped.

[Zod]

I didn't say it couldn't happen; I said it didn't strike me as qualifying as "likely". The devil will be in the details as well: Did Weasel challenge the ticket in court? Did he fail to appear in court? Did he acknowledge the ticket? Did he acknowledge being the driver? Was he arrested at Schipol? Was he deported? Did he pay the ticket at Schipol? We do not hear very many stories of people having "difficulties" at borders for a reason--I would suggest that reason is that it doesn't happen very often.

But if you're a worrier, it may be best to just pay the ticket. Especially if you think you're actually guilty of the offence.

--Churchmouse

Probably because if it happens most people end up paying it, especially if its 100EUR, why someone would challenge a ticket via courts on a holiday or business trip is beyond me, especially with the prospect of being turned around and sent back if payment isn't forthcoming on the spot.

From my point of view, it's even irrelevant whether he paid or not; realising procedures are actually in place and are being exercised at airports as opposed to what might happen solidifies the point that people are being reprimanded many years after the offence is committed.

My story: got flashed by a Gatso in a hire car near Schipol airport. Several months later, I received some forms in Dutch which I ignored. Roll forward a couple of years ( I had been back and forward to Holland several times between while) and I presented my passport at the immigration desk at Schipol only to be told "come this way sir". I was taken to a side office where am immigration official explained that I had a €99 speeding fine outstanding that must be paid. I queried this, but they had copies of all the paperwork o had received so I meekly paid my fine and was on my merry way in about 15 minutes. All handled very politely with no real fuss. I can only think that they had my passport number (provided by the car rental co) flagged up and that I had used my other passport on journies where I had not been stopped.

Did you argue that it was the law for the forms to be sent in the language of the recipients country? Or any other potential defence?

What other passport do you mean?

This post has been edited by Zod: Sat, 26 May 2018 - 13:00

[nigelbb]

I've had hire cars abroad without presenting my passport so we need to ask the OP if the Spanish authorities have their passport details.

To answer Zod's question it's perfectly possible to have two passports e.g. to save unpleasantness presenting a passport with Israeli stamps when entering various other Middle Eastern countries.

This post has been edited by nigelbb: Sat, 26 May 2018 - 14:30

[Zod]

They took my driving licence as far as I can remember. May have taken my passport too, but I would've thought they do a search by name too, alongside passport numbers as they expire over time etc

[I am Weasel]

Hi Zod,
I did not ask for the forms in English, it was pretty clear what they said even to somebody with very limited Dutch. I was simply chancing it in the hope that they would not follow up.

At the time, I held 2 UK passports with different numbers. All quite legal and above board. I travel extensively for work and cannot enter Jordan with Israeli stamps in my passport and vice versa. Thus it is possible to have multiple, separate UK passports

[baroudeur]

I failed finding an email address or online contact through the spanish website, though I did some across this website: http://www.mamunahmed.com/08/speed-camera-...g-fine-from-uk/

It shows the steps needed to take to pay the fine and contact information which I'm not sure is still accessible to date.

I'm contemplating paying it off as I don't want the headache if they pull me up on this at the airport which is likely to be many times multiple the original cost.

You've now missed the chance to pay the reduced rate of €150!

If you intend to challenge the penalty it will cost a lot more than the €300 currently outstanding.

[Zod]

I failed finding an email address or online contact through the spanish website, though I did some across this website: http://www.mamunahmed.com/08/speed-camera-...g-fine-from-uk/

It shows the steps needed to take to pay the fine and contact information which I'm not sure is still accessible to date.

I'm contemplating paying it off as I don't want the headache if they pull me up on this at the airport which is likely to be many times multiple the original cost.

You've now missed the chance to pay the reduced rate of €150!

If you intend to challenge the penalty it will cost a lot more than the €300 currently outstanding.

How do you know if I've missed the reduce rate?

Based on other people's experience, it's already higher than most I've seen.

[Churchmouse]

My story: got flashed by a Gatso in a hire car near Schipol airport. Several months later, I received some forms in Dutch which I ignored. Roll forward a couple of years ( I had been back and forward to Holland several times between while) and I presented my passport at the immigration desk at Schipol only to be told "come this way sir". I was taken to a side office where am immigration official explained that I had a €99 speeding fine outstanding that must be paid. I queried this, but they had copies of all the paperwork o had received so I meekly paid my fine and was on my merry way in about 15 minutes. All handled very politely with no real fuss. I can only think that they had my passport number (provided by the car rental co) flagged up and that I had used my other passport on journies where I had not been stopped.

Spain allegedly has "Driver Liability", like the UK "along with countries like Ireland, Germany, Italy, Spain and Austria", according to the RAC. Presumably, the Netherlands has "Keeper Liability", like France (or maybe their request for payment in Weasel's case had no compulsory aspect). In any case, the legal implications of a speeding ticket from Spain could be quite different than one from France or the Netherlands...

--Churchmouse

[Zod]

Spain allegedly has "Driver Liability", like the UK "along with countries like Ireland, Germany, Italy, Spain and Austria", according to the RAC. Presumably, the Netherlands has "Keeper Liability", like France (or maybe their request for payment in Weasel's case had no compulsory aspect). In any case, the legal implications of a speeding ticket from Spain could be quite different than one from France or the Netherlands...

--Churchmouse

Arguing the matter to the authorities (in my case) that I was not driving will suggest that I was committing a second offence by offering my rental vehicle to someone, other the person legally allowed to drive on the agreement which meant they weren't insured and goes against the terms of the rental company.

[NewJudge]

Arguing the matter to the authorities (in my case) that I was not driving will suggest that I was committing a second offence by offering my rental vehicle to someone, other the person legally allowed to drive on the agreement which meant they weren't insured and goes against the terms of the rental company.

If this was in the UK you would not have to argue that you were not driving until the police demonstrated to a court how they believed you were. They usually do this by means of a signed return to a Section 172 request (for driver's details). If Spain operates under "driver liability" as suggested it is difficult to see how they can prove you were driving. Maybe the Spanish authorities are able to make some unchallengeable assumptions with hire cars that where there is a sole driver on the contract he must be assumed to have been riving.

[djtaylor]

On their website, English information about what to do:-

https://sede.dgt.gob.es/es/tramites-y-multa...lguna-multa-en/

[Churchmouse]

Spain allegedly has "Driver Liability", like the UK "along with countries like Ireland, Germany, Italy, Spain and Austria", according to the RAC. Presumably, the Netherlands has "Keeper Liability", like France (or maybe their request for payment in Weasel's case had no compulsory aspect). In any case, the legal implications of a speeding ticket from Spain could be quite different than one from France or the Netherlands...

--Churchmouse

Arguing the matter to the authorities (in my case) that I was not driving will suggest that I was committing a second offence by offering my rental vehicle to someone, other the person legally allowed to drive on the agreement which meant they weren't insured and goes against the terms of the rental company.

What offence? Most car insurance policies in Europe seem to cover all drivers of a particular vehicle, so it wouldn't matter who was driving as far as the insurance is concerned. Not declaring an extra driver to the hire company could be a breach of contract, but that's hardly likely to be an unusual occurrence with grave legal consequences. How would the hire company even find out what you had told the Spanish authorities? And even if they did communicate after being paid for the speeding ticket, what would the consequence of breaching a hire car contract? What loss or damage would they have suffered?

It appears that there is a facility for nominating a different driver (djtaylor's link above), which also effectively confirms that Spain is a "Driver Liability" country. But you only have 20 days to do it, apparently...

--Churchmouse

[baroudeur]

I failed finding an email address or online contact through the spanish website, though I did some across this website: http://www.mamunahmed.com/08/speed-camera-...g-fine-from-uk/

It shows the steps needed to take to pay the fine and contact information which I'm not sure is still accessible to date.

I'm contemplating paying it off as I don't want the headache if they pull me up on this at the airport which is likely to be many times multiple the original cost.

You've now missed the chance to pay the reduced rate of €150!

If you intend to challenge the penalty it will cost a lot more than the €300 currently outstanding.

How do you know if I've missed the reduce rate?

Based on other people's experience, it's already higher than most I've seen.

It's in post 4 in the image.

Even in Spanish it's easy to translate as..... "reduction of 50% if paid within 20 days."

If you think that's high a recent Swiss case was in multi thousands!