Excel Parking - bwlegal A strange one., some bits missing ? |
Excel Parking - bwlegal A strange one., some bits missing ? |
Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 15:49
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#1
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 19 Oct 2017 Member No.: 94,643 |
Hi Folks,
My son received a surprise a few days ago from BWLEGAL by way of a letter informing him that: " We have been instructed by Excel Parking in relation to the Balance Due for the Above PCN ! " (£160 Total) Apparently Excel Parking have told BWlegal that he has not paid a parking charge,...However we have never received any letter from Excel ever, ...and new nothing about one until this Nonsense from BWlegal popped through the door. I have read in another post on here that they must notify the Driver within 14 days, however more than 60 days has passed since the alleged transgression by "a driver" so the question now is can anyone still pursue this claim in any way ?............. Scottish Law applies ! In my infinite wisdom I decided to address the situation , and have sent a "signed for "letter to Excel, and another "signed for" copy to bwlegal as noted below. LETTER 1 Excel Parking Services Ltd Central Payment Office P.O. BOX 4777 Sheffield England S9 9DJ date: xxxxxxx c.c. BWlegal, Leeds Dear Sirs, Your Account Ref xxxxxxxxxxx We are somewhat surprised to receive a communication on your behalf, from “BWlegal Collections” regarding an alleged parking infringement in a car park managed by yourselves in xxxxxx, stating that we have failed to make arrangements to pay an account balance. We advise that the communication received by us today DATE:XXXXX is the first we have received from you, or on your behalf. And that no previous notification regarding said parking infringement has been received at our address at any time. We therefor advise that you have failed to deliver proper notification of a parking infringement and that you have incorrectly instructed BWlegal to act on your behalf on a claim which you had not properly initiated, or previously described to us. On the basis that you have not formally notified us of any claim, we are obliged to disregard all information supplied to us by BWlegal as you have failed to establish any case for us to argue, or agree, and we therefor have no case to answer at this time. 1. We assume any such claims by you would be posted with recorded delivery or other similar Proof.of.Delivery. as standard, and would be interested to see your version of P.O.D. to us. 2. As the registered keeper of the vehicle was/is recovering from a broken hand at the time of alleged infringement, we would also be extremely interested to see your “Proof of Driver” as the vehicle has multiple drivers, none of whom currently recall the infringement. Please note that we will not correspond further with either you or BWlegal on this matter unless you supply evidence of Both items 1. & 2. above Yours Faithfully xxxxxxxxxxxxx c.c. BWlegal, Leeds ................................................................................ LETTER 2. bwlegal Enterprise House Apex House Leeds LS11 9BH date: xxxxxxxx Dear Sirs, Your Account Ref XXXXXXXX PLEASE REFER TO ATTACHED LETTER: Excel Parking Services Ltd Sheffield S9 9dj Yours Faithfully xxxxxxxxxx ........................................................ Can i have your thoughts on the fact that Excel have failed to previously inform us of any infringement, ( may have tried and failed ) and have passed a debt recovery on to bwlegal without ensuring that we had prior knowledge of the infringement / debt. It looks cut and dried to me, but they appear not to give in very easily. so your input would be greatly appreciated. thanks in advance Mundy This post has been edited by Mundy: Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 15:51 |
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Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 15:49
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Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 16:03
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#2
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Member Group: Members Posts: 17,088 Joined: 8 Mar 2013 Member No.: 60,457 |
In Scotland? Then ignore. Shame you wrote the letter. See what comes back.
There is no keeper liability in Scotland and if they don't know the driver then they are up that creek without a paddle. |
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Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 16:33
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#3
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 19 Oct 2017 Member No.: 94,643 |
@ostell
"Shame you wrote the letter. See what comes back." Yes i wrote the letter and posted it before finding the Forum., as BWlegal didnt appear to be aware that we had not been informed by Excel i felt it necessary to try and kill it before it grew wings lol. Mundy |
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Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 16:40
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#4
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,167 Joined: 6 Oct 2012 Member No.: 57,558 |
No need in Scotland to respond, its a Dodo and flightless.
You can now enter ignore mode, as you have responded you will get more letters but that's all they can do. File letters and retain for 5 years. They will get more and more red ink as time goes on. |
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Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 21:41
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#5
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 19 Oct 2017 Member No.: 94,643 |
In order to eliminate any doubt,
1. Is it a legal requirement that the likes of Excel notify an offender with an infringement notice within 14 days of the infringement ( even in Scotland ) as Excel never have delivered one to this address. and 2. Do these Parking enforcers send out their notices with "signed for"/ recorded delivery " and if not, then how can they prove that their Notice has been properly delivered. We are assuming that Excel did send some notice somewhere, but as nothing was received by us. surely the onus would be upon them to prove it was received, (which they cannot ) notwithstanding it may have been sent. Mundy |
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Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 22:04
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#6
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,167 Joined: 6 Oct 2012 Member No.: 57,558 |
You are over thinking this, no combination of timing and or content in any letter can enforce keeper liability in Scotland, it does not exist as a concept on speculative invoices in Scotland.
This post has been edited by kommando: Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 22:05 |
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Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 22:11
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#7
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Member Group: Members Posts: 901 Joined: 1 Apr 2017 Member No.: 91,235 |
A parking charge notice is no more than a speculative invoice. It can be issued at any time; however, if the issuer wants to be able to take advantage of POFA 2012, it needs to act within the timescales set in Schedule 4.
There is no requirement to post on a “signed for” basis. It could be self-defeating. Anyone expecting, say, a court claim could simply refuse to sign for it. I think there is a presumption that, when someone claims that something was posted, it was posted. If someone was simply able to say “I didn’t receive that”, there would be a lot of dishonest people saying the same thing. If ever you post something to, say, a PPC, hand it over the counter at a Post Office and request a free certificate of posting. |
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Thu, 19 Oct 2017 - 22:33
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#8
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Member Group: Members Posts: 1,640 Joined: 30 May 2013 Member No.: 62,328 |
Schedule four; timescales, and POFA are irrelevant in scotland though.
So it is still just a speculative invoice. Post 6 is correct. -------------------- The owl of Minerva spreads its wings only with the falling of the dusk.
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Tue, 13 Feb 2018 - 00:41
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#9
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New Member Group: Members Posts: 4 Joined: 19 Oct 2017 Member No.: 94,643 |
Hi Folks,
just a quick update to hopefully close this discussion. Since the last post by Albert 19 oct 2017 (4 months app.) we have received 2 formal letters from BWLEGAL ( last one 2 Jan 18 ) advising that they are awaiting instruction from their client Excel Parking. It would appear that Kommando was spot on, as this claim appears to have satisfactorily crash landed. In conclusion, It would be interesting to know why they have appeared to give up ! 1. Was it due to refuting confirmed Postal Delivery of the Original Claim, or, 2. Contesting they identify the appropriate Driver .... in Scots Law ? Either way it looks as if the Dodo ( (Raphus cucullatus ) is still extinct after all, however if one does re-appear i will advise urgently . Thanks for all the Input Mundy This post has been edited by Mundy: Tue, 13 Feb 2018 - 00:43 |
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Tue, 13 Feb 2018 - 01:20
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#10
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,126 Joined: 31 Jan 2018 Member No.: 96,238 |
I find that three month intervals while BWL awaits instructions are quite normal so I wouldn't jump to any conclusions after four months
The company specialises in issuing very late claims several years after the parking event, a few weeks before they are prevented by the Limitation Act It relies on the victims throwing away all the correspondence or moving house so they don't receive the court papers and hand BWL a default judgment They can trace the real address later or wait for the victim to discover it on a credit file The tactic is reputed to be about 65% successful at obtaining payment If you're not told that the parking notice has been cancelled, keep all the paperwork safe for at least five years after the event This post has been edited by Redivi: Tue, 13 Feb 2018 - 01:22 |
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Tue, 13 Feb 2018 - 10:08
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#11
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Member Group: Members Posts: 4,167 Joined: 6 Oct 2012 Member No.: 57,558 |
Not seen any evidence of PPC's using the court system in Scotland just before the 5 years is up in the hope of a default judgement if the defendant has moved, yes for England and Wales (where its 6 years) but not in Scotland. Stop giving them ideas .
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