PePiPoo Helping the motorist get justice Support health workers

Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

Middle lane hogging - careless?
southpaw82
post Fri, 8 Nov 2019 - 12:34
Post #1


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 33,610
Joined: 2 Apr 2008
From: Not in the UK
Member No.: 18,483



What do we think?

Some observations:

For it to be careless, it has to fall below the standard expected of a competent and careful driver.

For it to be without reasonable consideration, some other person actually has to be inconvenienced.


--------------------
Moderator

Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
11 Pages V  « < 7 8 9 10 11 >  
Start new topic
Replies (160 - 179)
Advertisement
post Fri, 8 Nov 2019 - 12:34
Post #


Advertise here!









Go to the top of the page
 
Quote Post
mickR
post Thu, 28 Nov 2019 - 20:09
Post #161


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7,235
Joined: 5 Jan 2007
From: England
Member No.: 9,919



Thats for sure.
I wonder what kent police are doing with this case?
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
southpaw82
post Thu, 28 Nov 2019 - 20:11
Post #162


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 33,610
Joined: 2 Apr 2008
From: Not in the UK
Member No.: 18,483



QUOTE (mickR @ Thu, 28 Nov 2019 - 20:09) *
Thats for sure.
I wonder what kent police are doing with this case?

Presumably proceeding with careless rather than inconsiderate!


--------------------
Moderator

Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
mickR
post Thu, 28 Nov 2019 - 20:22
Post #163


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7,235
Joined: 5 Jan 2007
From: England
Member No.: 9,919



Hmmmmm i can see that not ending well for them if them what decides are themselves mloc members
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
cp8759
post Thu, 28 Nov 2019 - 20:34
Post #164


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 38,006
Joined: 3 Dec 2010
Member No.: 42,618



QUOTE (southpaw82 @ Thu, 28 Nov 2019 - 19:33) *
No defence is required if, as a matter of law, one cannot inconvenience a driver who is themselves breaking the law.

Depends on the scenario. IMO sitting in lane 3 for no reason is an offence regardless of whether there's someone trying to get past, who's presence is at most incidental. Let us assume therefore that lane 2 is somewhat busy with traffic doing 60 - 65 but there's gaps here and there where you could pull in if you slowed down. If you're doing 70 are you required to slow down and move to lane 2 for the guy who's doing 90? IMO no, you're doing something you're entitled to do and there's no reason you should have to slow down to let someone else pass you. Does anything change if traffic in lane 2 is going 55 and you're doing 65? Debatable at best, if you're overtaking slower moving traffic I can't see why you'd be required to slow down and get out of the way. It might be common courtesy to get out of the way if you have a chance, but it's stretching it to say that it's an offence not to do so.

If I am wrong, then surely the 40 everywhere brigade is required to pull over and let me pass them when I come up behind them at 60 on a temporary speed limit single carriageway? After all, they're bloody inconvenient to me!


--------------------
If you would like assistance with a penalty charge notice, please post a thread on https://www.ftla.uk/index.php
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Fredd
post Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 08:39
Post #165


Webmaster
Group Icon

Group: Root Admin
Posts: 8,205
Joined: 30 Mar 2003
From: Wokingham, UK
Member No.: 2



QUOTE (cp8759 @ Thu, 28 Nov 2019 - 20:34) *
If I am wrong, then surely the 40 everywhere brigade is required to pull over and let me pass them when I come up behind them at 60 on a temporary speed limit single carriageway? After all, they're bloody inconvenient to me!

Not to mention tractors, cyclists, council waste collection vehicles, parcel delivery vans, buses, ... Suddenly I'm starting to see the attraction of this "get out of the way or it's careless" notion. smile.gif


--------------------
Regards,
Fredd

__________________________________________________________________________
Pepipoo relies on you
to keep this site running!
Donate to Pepipoo now using your
Visa, Mastercard, debit card or PayPal account
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
The Rookie
post Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 09:54
Post #166


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 56,198
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
From: Warwickshire
Member No.: 317



QUOTE (Fredd @ Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 08:39) *
Not to mention tractors, cyclists, council waste collection vehicles, parcel delivery vans, buses, ... Suddenly I'm starting to see the attraction of this "get out of the way or it's careless" notion. smile.gif

Does that mean stationary vehicles in queues who don't make room for cyclists (where applicable obviously) are all careless as well? Those stationary cars sure hold up the two wheeled traffic.


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
mike5100
post Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 10:33
Post #167


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 162
Joined: 16 Jun 2019
Member No.: 104,319



QUOTE (The Rookie @ Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 09:54) *
QUOTE (Fredd @ Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 08:39) *
Not to mention tractors, cyclists, council waste collection vehicles, parcel delivery vans, buses, ... Suddenly I'm starting to see the attraction of this "get out of the way or it's careless" notion. smile.gif

Does that mean stationary vehicles in queues who don't make room for cyclists (where applicable obviously) are all careless as well? Those stationary cars sure hold up the two wheeled traffic.

Not sure whether you are joking or not, but there is a real question hidden in your answer. In this country it is legal for motorcyclists to filter between two lines of stationary traffic. 99% of car drivers move over (if they see you biggrin.gif ), but there are a few who deliberately block motorcyclists . Presumably that is careless driving? (Although having said that - they know what they are doing so it cannot be care-less biggrin.gif )
Mike
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
The Rookie
post Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 11:15
Post #168


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 56,198
Joined: 9 Sep 2003
From: Warwickshire
Member No.: 317



QUOTE (mike5100 @ Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 10:33) *
Presumably that is careless driving? (Although having said that - they know what they are doing so it cannot be care-less

'Careless' is of course driving at a standard below that of a careful and competent driver, so deliberate bad driving is still careless.....

This post has been edited by The Rookie: Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 11:15


--------------------
There is no such thing as a law abiding motorist, just those who have been scammed and those yet to be scammed!

S172's
Rookies 1-0 Kent

Council PCN's
Rookies 1-0 Warwick
Rookies 1-0 Birmingham

PPC PCN's
Rookies 10-0 PPC's
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
mickR
post Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 16:20
Post #169


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7,235
Joined: 5 Jan 2007
From: England
Member No.: 9,919



QUOTE (The Rookie @ Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 11:15) *
QUOTE (mike5100 @ Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 10:33) *
Presumably that is careless driving? (Although having said that - they know what they are doing so it cannot be care-less

'Careless' is of course driving at a standard below that of a careful and competent driver, so deliberate bad driving is still careless.....


Even more careless
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PASTMYBEST
post Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 17:08
Post #170


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 26,655
Joined: 6 Nov 2014
Member No.: 74,048



If I am turning left at a junction, I do not want a bike or motorbike on my left but going straight on, it is an accident waiting to happen, so I move in close to the left to stop "filtering" I people want to pass outside me then at least they cannot be hidden. Might be seen as overly careful but not careless


--------------------
All advice is given freely. It is given without guarantee and responsibility for its use rests with the user
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
mickR
post Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 19:26
Post #171


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7,235
Joined: 5 Jan 2007
From: England
Member No.: 9,919



Only imbeciles would filter up the inside of left lane traffic at a junction.
Que, the cycling fraternity to chip in
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
DancingDad
post Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 20:41
Post #172


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 25,726
Joined: 28 Jun 2010
From: Area 51
Member No.: 38,559



QUOTE (mickR @ Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 19:26) *
Only imbeciles would filter up the inside of left lane traffic at a junction.
Que, the cycling fraternity to chip in

I've had people do it on cycles, motorbikes, pedestrians just stepping out and on one occasion, a transit van who mounted the kerb to "filter" past on the left.

Never overestimate the low level of human stupidity, the dumb ones are really dumb.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Richy320
post Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 08:59
Post #173


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 425
Joined: 4 Aug 2014
From: In the beautiful Chilterns
Member No.: 72,309



QUOTE (mickR @ Fri, 29 Nov 2019 - 20:26) *
Only imbeciles would filter up the inside of left lane traffic at a junction.
Que, the cycling fraternity to chip in

As a cyclist biggrin.gif I generally filter on the left hand side of the lane appropriate for the direction of travel. If the left lane is for turning left and going straight ahead then it’s perfectly safe to filter on the left. It’s not difficult to ascertain when the traffic is likely to move and position yourself accordingly. It is, however, more difficult to work out if the driver is one of those ‘right of way over cyclists at all times’ muppets who move to the left to prevent such filtering or deliberately right hook you to ‘teach you a lesson’.

This post has been edited by Richy320: Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 09:00


--------------------
Speed does not kill. It's more to do with how you stop.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
PASTMYBEST
post Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 12:15
Post #174


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 26,655
Joined: 6 Nov 2014
Member No.: 74,048



QUOTE
who move to the left to prevent such filtering


Or from my point of view move to the left to save the dumb cyclist from death or injury because they seem to abdicate their safety to strangers


--------------------
All advice is given freely. It is given without guarantee and responsibility for its use rests with the user
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
mickR
post Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 16:31
Post #175


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7,235
Joined: 5 Jan 2007
From: England
Member No.: 9,919



QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 12:15) *
QUOTE
who move to the left to prevent such filtering


Or from my point of view move to the left to save the dumb cyclist from death or injury because they seem to abdicate their safety to strangers


This.

Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Fredd
post Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 17:28
Post #176


Webmaster
Group Icon

Group: Root Admin
Posts: 8,205
Joined: 30 Mar 2003
From: Wokingham, UK
Member No.: 2



This thread was bad enough when it was about the MLOC, PLEASE don't turn it into yet another, even more tedious, car vs. bicycle thread! icon_hang.gif


--------------------
Regards,
Fredd

__________________________________________________________________________
Pepipoo relies on you
to keep this site running!
Donate to Pepipoo now using your
Visa, Mastercard, debit card or PayPal account
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
DancingDad
post Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 18:19
Post #177


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 25,726
Joined: 28 Jun 2010
From: Area 51
Member No.: 38,559



QUOTE (Fredd @ Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 17:28) *
This thread was bad enough when it was about the MLOC, PLEASE don't turn it into yet another, even more tedious, car vs. bicycle thread! icon_hang.gif


Or even better, cyclists hogging the middle lane rolleyes.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
Richy320
post Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 21:36
Post #178


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 425
Joined: 4 Aug 2014
From: In the beautiful Chilterns
Member No.: 72,309



QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 12:15) *
QUOTE
who move to the left to prevent such filtering


Or from my point of view move to the left to save the dumb cyclist from death or injury because they seem to abdicate their safety to strangers

Would that be death or injury caused by the motorists who are right of way over all cyclists at all times muppets?

Back to the original thread, MLOC out in force on the M40 this evening. Southbound in the inside lane at 60 (towing a trailer) the carriageway narrows to 2 lanes. As it widens to 3 lanes again after the junction, a Volvo SUV joins the motorway, travelling more quickly than me on the inside, I move to the inside lane, he moves to the centre lane, despite the inside lane ahead being completely empty. Go figure!


--------------------
Speed does not kill. It's more to do with how you stop.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
southpaw82
post Sun, 1 Dec 2019 - 00:30
Post #179


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 33,610
Joined: 2 Apr 2008
From: Not in the UK
Member No.: 18,483



QUOTE (Richy320 @ Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 21:36) *
QUOTE (PASTMYBEST @ Sat, 30 Nov 2019 - 12:15) *
QUOTE
who move to the left to prevent such filtering


Or from my point of view move to the left to save the dumb cyclist from death or injury because they seem to abdicate their safety to strangers

Would that be death or injury caused by the motorists who are right of way over all cyclists at all times muppets?


Possibly but it could also be the death or injury due to an accident with a vehicle whose driver is all in favour of cyclists. Accidents involving cyclists aren’t the preserve of drivers who don’t like them.

Cycling threads are always the same! I may start cracking down on them, since they inevitably end up in ad hominem arguments.


--------------------
Moderator

Any comments made do not constitute legal advice and should not be relied upon. No lawyer/client relationship should be assumed nor should any duty of care be owed.
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post
mickR
post Sun, 1 Dec 2019 - 00:41
Post #180


Member


Group: Members
Posts: 7,235
Joined: 5 Jan 2007
From: England
Member No.: 9,919



How has this thread turned i to a cycling issue?? ohmy.gif
Go to the top of the page
 
+Quote Post

11 Pages V  « < 7 8 9 10 11 >
Reply to this topicStart new topic
1 User(s) are reading this topic (1 Guests and 0 Anonymous Users)
0 Members:

 



Advertisement

Advertise here!

RSS Lo-Fi Version Time is now: Friday, 29th March 2024 - 08:33
Pepipoo uses cookies. You can find details of the cookies we use here along with links to information on how to manage them.
Please click the button to accept our cookies and hide this message. We’ll also assume that you’re happy to accept them if you continue to use the site.
IPS Driver Error

IPS Driver Error

There appears to be an error with the database.
You can try to refresh the page by clicking here